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#110124 - 09/06/05 11:59 AM OT:New TV purchase?
littleb Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 08/03/03
Posts: 1235
Loc: Moorhead, Minnesota/US
I was over at BB on Sunday and pulled the trigger on a RCA rp hdtv monitor and a hd dtv receiver. I think I may have boo-booed with the RCA. While the slim pickens of hd channels look very good, the conventional channels look very blurry and are hard to watch for extended periods. I went back and asked one of the sales reps if all the hd tvs looked this way. He said unfortunately they do. I find that hard to believe. My conventional tube tv looked much clearer and crisper with conventional channels. Is it the cheapo RCA that is the culprit or is the sales rep right?

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#110125 - 09/06/05 12:26 PM Re: OT:New TV purchase?
F107plus5 Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 01/24/05
Posts: 2034
Loc: Fla. Orig. Mich.
We have a Mitsubishi RP CRT with hdtv tuner, but were runnin' with cable-in on 1080i and yes, the HDTV channels are fabulous. Everything else.....

.....Well....now that's another story. And the story has many chapters

Some are very very good

Some are downright yuckyand difficult to watch.

And some are right in between. There dosen't seem to be any obvious rhyme of reason for it other than some channels are delivering to us a better PQ, perhaps right from the source!

My Daughter is having the same situation as we are(no surprize cause we subscribe to the same cable company)but her picture sometimes looks just a little bit better on her Toshiba(one of the later, much improved models)simply cause she has a smaller RP CRT than we haveSlide up where you're looking at the same angle of view and they are the same.

So..in our limited population of veiwing data, we have a "could be the input at that" responce



(however......RCA is not the most respected brand of sets at the moment either, or at least wasen't at the first of this year)

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#110126 - 09/06/05 01:20 PM Re: OT:New TV purchase?
thyname Offline
aficionado

Registered: 04/05/05
Posts: 552
Loc: Oakton, VA
Do you guys have cable or satellite? From my experience, satellite is much better than cable for non-hd channels.
_________________________
Axiom M60s, QS4s, VP100 Onkyo TX-SR804 Oppo 970HD Rotel RB-1080/RCD-1072 REL Q150E sub, PS 3

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#110127 - 09/06/05 01:47 PM Re: OT:New TV purchase?
bugbitten Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 04/06/05
Posts: 2339
Loc: Madisonville, KY
On my Sony 32 crt all channels are perfect above 13 on cable. 2-13 (all the networks) are very bad. More snow and slihouttes than you would think. My satellite quality was a little better on SD, but not a lot
On Sony plasma, the HD on satellite had no comparison until I went OTA with an antenna on the chimney. NBC and ABC HD are quite stunning. Other channels look like analog converted to digital.

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#110128 - 09/06/05 01:48 PM Re: OT:New TV purchase?
oldskoolboarder Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 05/25/03
Posts: 2181
Loc: Menlo Park, CA
Welcome to the confusing HD club. Yes, D* HD can look good to great. IMHO, OTA looks better.

Unfortunately, SD channels can vary from good to horrid. I've found that on my EDTV plasma, SD can look quite good, it really depends on the compression that D* has on the particular channel. HD displays can also make mediocre SD looks worse, since you have more pixels. That's probably what's bother you. I agree, CRT can look cleaner, sometimes a LOT cleaner w/ SD.

You might check the AVS forums for suggestions on how to possibly calibrate your RCA for better viewing. As your gut tells you, don't believe the rep. SD can look pretty good, just depends on your source, monitor and settings.

BTW, which receiver did you get? Did you get the HD Tivo? Those have gone down to $299 w/ rebates.

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#110129 - 09/06/05 02:15 PM Re: OT:New TV purchase?
royce73 Offline
veteran

Registered: 04/20/05
Posts: 170
Loc: New Jersey
I think the TV is fine - it is your source that is the issue. I have used both DirecTV and Comcast Cable and the regular stations on D* looked a whole lot better than the ones on Comcast. The standard channels were so bad on Comcast, that I only use my 47" HDTV for Hi-def or widescreen programming only.

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#110130 - 09/06/05 02:38 PM Re: OT:New TV purchase?
littleb Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 08/03/03
Posts: 1235
Loc: Moorhead, Minnesota/US
I have DTV. I got the H10 model hd receiver for $100 less because I bought a TV. I'm thinking I might return the RCA and upgrade a bit, thinking maybe a Toshiba would be a better set.

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#110131 - 09/06/05 02:47 PM Re: OT:New TV purchase?
BrenR Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 12/10/03
Posts: 3602
Loc: Winnipeg MB Canada
In reply to:

On my Sony 32 crt all channels are perfect above 13 on cable. 2-13 (all the networks) are very bad. More snow and slihouttes than you would think.



Alrighty, finally back to a topic I can chime in about. What you're experiencing, Bug, is overmodulation of your cable signal. Chances are you have some lower bandwidth capable cable in your place, and as higher and higher channels came out, someone (perhaps a previous owner) complained that the higher channels were snowy. The cable company's knee-jerk reaction is to "cook up" the signal strength to make up for the falloff in the higher frequency ranges, but that overmodulates the lower frequency ranges (channels 2-13 VHF) that don't get attenuated by the cable in your house.

Same thing happened when I moved in here, all the cable was original (back in the 2-13 channel TV dial days) badly shielded RG59, which carries 2-13 very well, but rolls off in the higher channels. When I replaced it all with quad-shield RG6, which doesn't exhibit the same rolloff characteristics, ALL the channels were overmodulated and showed "ghosting" (which is actually bleed through from adjacent channels)... I called the cable company and let them know that I wanted them to lower the signal strength on their side, by using a variable RF "pad", I determined the best signal was at 6dB lower than what they were currently driving.

The cable company is very resistant to come out and tweak the signal strength that they're sending, it's kind of a "you gets what you gets" situation for them. It took two or three calls and finally me throwing up my hands and telling them if they wouldn't adjust their signal for the best looking off-air quality for me, that I'd switch to the digital cable through the phone company where it wouldn't be an issue. They came out, padded my cable at the pole, I took my pad off and all has been right since.

Not much you can do if all your in-wall is rated for less than 900MHz, but if it is, a little testing with either variable or static pads may give you a bit more insight.

In reply to:

My satellite quality was a little better on SD, but not a lot


Chances are that you have one "satellite capable" (usually into the gigahertz range) run of coax from the satellite to your set top, which would further reinforce that theory.

This is one of those mid-investment in labour (pulling new cable through walls), small-investment in money (coax is cheap), big-return type things. People tinker with getting that... maybe... just... a little... no, wait, I think I hear it... return on $6000 interconnects and then overlook something as reasonable as this.

Bren R.

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#110132 - 09/06/05 10:50 PM Re: OT:New TV purchase?
bugbitten Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 04/06/05
Posts: 2339
Loc: Madisonville, KY
Our cable is the worst service company going. They have a whole city contract and pretty much do as they please. My only other options are Sat and OTA. Done Sat (voom) and more channels than I ever watch plus little HD without voom. No local HD. So I watch OTA locals and cable for 14 and up.
Turns out the guy who installed my antenna knew the problem exactly as you described, but cable co is NO help.

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#110133 - 09/07/05 09:17 AM Re: OT:New TV purchase?
littleb Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 08/03/03
Posts: 1235
Loc: Moorhead, Minnesota/US
I gave the local independent TV technician a call yesterday. He told me the numero ono question he is asked is, "I bought a HDTV, why is my TV picture horrid?" He said this is because modern HD tvs lack the proper "interlacer." He also said interlacers are expensive, so TV manufacturers cut that corner.

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