 Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Many people here also own or know someone who has bought an SVS sub. I own several subs including an SVS PC12-Ultra which I purchased before myEP600s. SVS has been known to be a hyperaggressive marketer but this post by Clint DeBoer raises serious questions about business practices and ethical behaviour at SVS. To me it also explains the concerted attacks on Axiom's new EP subs in the fall of 2005. Reading this post it looks like their attacks against Axiom have continued at Audioholics. I'd like to thank Gene and Clint at Audioholics for raising the bar by kicking out SVS as an advertiser. Maybe SVS will change there ways before further damaging their brand image by these outrageous guerrilla marketing tactics. Why We Fired SVS as an Advertiser -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Several things have gone on in the past few weeks that have caused us to think about what's important to us and how we want to treat the forum community. One thing that we have realized is that at some point, when people take advantage and do not heed implied requests and basic etiquette you have to make a decision. SVS has been an advertiser at Audioholics for some time. We like their products and continute to believe they make some of the cheapest subs out there with a good "bang for the buck" factor. Regardless of not allowing them to advertise, this has nothing to do with them as a manuafacturer. As a company, however, their marketing methods have gotten out of control - at least on our site. If you'll notice, there is likely not a single subwoofer thread on this forum that doesn't have people talking about SVS. There is a reason for this and it has to do with the marketing methods of SVS as a company. They freely admitted to us that forum participation of their staff and SVS owners is the driving force behind their marketing strategy. This is actually kind of intelligent - until it is abused. It is being abused on our site - to the point that we were being told that attempting to keep review threads on topic for non-SVS products was basically unacceptable behavior on our part. We were being told how to behave on our own site. We attempted to let it go and redirect threads as needed, but a recent discussion made it clear that this was unacceptable. We STILL were going to quietly let them go on their way until a recent post appeared on our forums regurgitating the exact conversation SVS had with Gene recently. Quote: Originally Posted by Sjmarcy I just joined this forum, and read a few threads. I note the declaration: "Where audio and video equipment undergoes rigorous objective and subjective tests by our staff, ensuring that marketing slogans aren't the only guidelines for your home theater choices"....yet I see the President posting encoutgement for Axiom products, a site advertiser. Hmmm. And another post where a member was called a fanboy by an Audioholic staff member on a different matter? What's up with the difference between this sort of thing and the Forum's written mission statement? Note the post count. This was written by someone who had a direct conversation with our contact at SVS. That pretty much did it for us. As a result we have fired SVS as an advertiser and will enforce the following forum rules: We will not ban SVS threads about SVS products - they make some cool subs, so people are free to talk about them as they'd like - in their own threads. All SVS employees have been banned from the website. We will not allow SVS posts in non-SVS review threads. I'm sorry, but it has come down to this. Any critiques of this policy should be done via PM, not on the forums. We took a long time to come to this conclusion and we were willing to lose a lot of monthly income over this in order to make sure we don't allow our forums to become a marketing tool for a single advertiser. We are not the first (or likely last) website to enforce similar rules. Thanks for your understanding. We hate making stuff like this public, but it seemed we were given no choice in the matter. __________________ Clint DeBoer Editor in Chief Audioholics http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29188
John
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Thanks John ... I've always thought the way SVS seemed to get integrated into most any thread on that site regarding subwoofers was induced by sly SVS marketing.
Makes me very glad that I own Axioms.
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Coincidentally, I just sold my SVS today. I'm extremely happy with my EP500, so this news makes it that much easier to say goodbye. 
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Hi Rick. I post at AVS and have had my share of attacks by SVS plants and fanboys when I pointed out the positive characteristics of other subs like the EP500/600, Velodyne, Hsu and other manufacturers but this is the first real evidence about how its been part of a concerted marketing plan to disrupt threads, spread misinformation and influence buyers. Nasty business practice if you ask me and highly unethical. I won't buy any more SVS products and as a matter of course I don't buy products from unethical companies.
John
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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After reading the original post from Jakeman I browsed over to Audioholics and started reading some of the old Axiom threads. Some of the posts are just downright funny. People bashing axiom and other subs in favour of SVS even though they have never heard one. There are a lot of banned posters in those forums now.
2xM80 VP180 2xQS8 2xM3 HSU STF3 LG 60PS11 Denon 3808 ATI 1506 LCR 2xATI 1502 Oppo BDP-83
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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I originally WAS going to purchase SVS on my sub hunt, but I am more than happy to purchase the EP500 from a company that is ethical and doesn't have unethical business practice just to get a lead in the market share. Word of mouth is the greatest advertising tool, Axiom has a great reputation with me (especially delivering my speakers 2 weeks ahead of schedule!) and I have already hooked a friend of mine into the Axioms, he is looking forward to the day he will own M22s and an EP500. hmmmm, think Axiom is so great because they are Canadian? 
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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If you can't stand on your laurels, reduce yourself to guerilla marketing. Around here, the second a sub of any manufacturer is mentioned, all the possibilities from all manufacturers are discussed. Just such a different feeling, very laid back around here, but I guess that happens when even if you never sell another subwoofer, you still have award-winning floorstanders & bookshelves, centres and surrounds in both cabinet and in-wall applications. Just sick how the most balanced discussion happens on a manufacturer's site, where you'd expect the most fanboyism. Bren R.
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Quite a sorry situation, but this is what can happen when a company decides that it wants to 'adverblog' itself. Sounds like a few of their people got a little bit overzealous and went a bit too far. It's really a shame, as SVS does make great subs (not that I'm biased ), and publicity like this can be a killer for an internet-only retailer. Can't we all just get along and focus our bashing at Bose?  Actually I have 4 days left on my 30-day return policy on my SVS - maybe I should return it with the reason that I don't like their business practices! 
Last edited by PeterChenoweth; 02/02/07 06:40 PM.
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Makes you like it around here even more doesn't it? I'm notorious for suggesting Hsu subs on these boards - even now that I own an EP500! (which I love btw)
The fact that I'm not scolded for continually offering up a Hsu subwoofer to newbs here says a lot about Axiom. They know they've got terrific products, and they know that other companies do as well. Depending on the particular need of the buyer, sometimes their products make the most sense, other times it's the competition. Being honest and open about your products and business is the best way towards long-term success.
Cheers to Axiom for understanding that. The rest of them will suffer the fate they bring upon themselves. SVS is a good example.
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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axiomite
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Quote:
If you can't stand on your laurels, reduce yourself to guerilla marketing.
The funny thing is, SVS makes a worthwhile product. If they made crap, I could understand behavior like this, but they don't make crap.
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Just sick how the most balanced discussion happens on a manufacturer's site, where you'd expect the most fanboyism.
WOW! What an interesting observation. I hadn't thought about it 'til you mentioned it, but I think you're right.
A thread similar to this one was begun over at the AVS forum, and moderator David Bott closed it with the following comments which I found interesting.
"This is like beating a dead house [sic] and I am an animal lover.
We have been down this road before, even here on AVS we have had to clamp down on the SVS threads from being made left and right. This is not a new thing at all, just same same old issue that has been made before but on another site. Other companies that are internet sales based have had similar issues here and elsewhere.
This is why you see that thread stuck at the top of the section that was made way back in 11/04... http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=471854
Issues like this are made when a company chooses to use forums such as this to drive sales from within posts. And they may not even do it directly, but from the users of their products. Companies like this actually own their existence to sites like this. SVS was started by forum members who were helping the do-it-yourself person. They have done quite well.
I myself have used SVS subs, owned and loved the Twin Ultras and was even published saying so in Audio Video Interiors Magazine. I have even helped defend SVS defend from other members just looking to attack them. Ron was even at the 2006 AVS Forum party at CEDIA. (See attached, he is the one in the white shirt. No, not the one on the far right in white, but the one with the big smile.)
Companies in general should not expect to use sites like this to drive sales directly via employees or by asking it's consumers to help. This site and others are only able to operate for it's members based on the ad sales on the site. Thus we have RULES about not allowing direct marketing posts to be made. We have been told outright 'why should I buy ads when I can just ask our customers to promote me?'. NOTE: We were NOT told this by SVS. But it does go to show how an issue can, and does, get made.
All in all we will now close this thread so move on and go enjoy some music or movies. In other words, take it elsewhere please. For at this point SVS has not been an issue as of late here but does know where we stand as a support site. I personally have no reason to not think that it is part of their marketing plan to use forum sites to market directly within posts. I also have no reason to discount this was told to the guys at Audiholics by someone at SVS. (If you think companies do not already do this or consider doing it, you would be sadly mistaken for it is a new age of sales. (Note to self...find a way to make $$$ on that.)
Please note...AVS will continue to remove posts or members that we feel are here for one reason. (This goes for any company in any forum section as a lot of you already know.)
Thank you."
I can understand overzealous fanboys hyping "their" product, but a manufacturer who resorts to this type of tactic is a loser in my book. YMMV.
Jack
"People generally quarrel because they cannot argue." - G. K. Chesterton
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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If they made crap, I could understand behavior like this, but they don't make crap.
The company themselves don't seem to share owners' enthusiasm for their product... either they're worried about, or experiencing, declining sales and have resorted to this kind of huckstering, even after Sony was spanked over doing it for the PS3.
I mean, you always have to take anything you read with a grain of salt... getting to the point where you have to assume everything is a lie until proven otherwise.
Bren R.
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Jack has seen alot of the same fanboy marketing deception over at AVS and has often been subjected to attacks there as well. Its ironic how this kind of unethical conduct has a way of catching up to companies that condone it. Its really short term thinking because many people will not want to buy products from companies that conduct their business to that lowly standard. Especially when there are so many other great competitively priced subs to choose from. What a bunch of lowlifes.  Audioholics must have wrestled with this dilemna but their decision reflects a strong sense of right and wrong. It's reassuring to see that many people will not tolerate this kind of business ethic.
John
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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yes...kudos to audioholics as well. It's always been one of my favorite audio websites.
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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>>yes...kudos to audioholics as well. It's always been one of my favorite audio websites.>>
If it wasn't for Audioholics, I wouldn't even have an Axiom System! They should get my commission check!
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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They (Audioholics) have my cheque (checkU$). The minute I heard about this, I signed up with Audioholics as a (quite small, miniscule actually) advertiser. I felt it was worth a few bucks to support their dismissal of SVS for predatory marketing tactics. I was quite fond of SVS at one point, strictly from the point of view that "hey, those guys found out that you can make subs out of hardware store parts". No argument with their ability to actually build - and sell - bass cabinets (and praises to SVS for hiring Ed Mullen), but I'm fed up with neo-social-network-marketing (all marketing, in fact). It became all too obvious that some companies are using this media to push their product. Audioholics brought me to Axiom, and I decided to give some love back. A drop in the bucket, I know, but it's a good bucket. btw, After checking out many other sub MFGs, I bought Axiom. Had to return the first one (EP-500, WAY too much SPL for my neighbours ), but looking forward to the EP-400 (ooh, yeah - feel it on the inside!) 
Down: 2xM60 2xM3 EP400; NAD T763AV C272 C542CDP
Up: 2xM60; NAD 1600pre C272 533TT PP2
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Quote:
Jack has seen alot of the same fanboy marketing deception over at AVS and has often been subjected to attacks there as well.
Indeed! As David Bott pointed out in the post I quoted earlier in this thread, things have quieted considerably over at AVS. However, even in the thread in which Mr. Bott posted, there were a couple of "fanboys" vigorously defending the company in question by attacking those who posted critical comments about this type of unethical marketing, accusing them of "agendas" and attempting to justify this dishonest marketing with the old "Well they aren't the only one doing it" argument. That may be true, but it's irrelevant. And, both Audioholics and AVS are worthy of praise for clamping down on those who resort to deceptive marketing tactics.
Jack
"People generally quarrel because they cannot argue." - G. K. Chesterton
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Quote:
both Audioholics and AVS are worthy of praise for clamping down on those who resort to deceptive marketing tactics
Someone want to explain to me why we can't do this with car salesmen? 
I think everyone becomes a 'fanboy' at some point or another, until their horizons broaden. To show proof, we could always start another "Axioms are bright" thread.
Last edited by chesseroo; 02/03/07 02:56 PM.
"Those who preach the myths of audio are ignorant of truth."
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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And, both Audioholics and AVS are worthy of praise for clamping down on those who resort to deceptive marketing tactics.
Deceptive marketing tactics don't just stop in the marketing department and are indicative of a low ethical standard throughout a company. In my years in business I've found a fairly high correlation between companies that condone low standards of behaviour and other misleading practices. Specs are often misrepresented for example.
I've noticed that no independent parties have ever been able to replicate the unusually flat FR curves presented at the SVS site except for the PB10. I certainly wasn't able to come up with any linear FR above 40hz with my testing of the Ultra. Neither did the independently done graphs at AVTalk and Home Theatre Shack. It reminds me of my grandmother and how she would always say "you can't fool all the people all the time."
John
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Quote:
To show proof, we could always start another "Axioms are bright" thread.
I prefer instead to think that Axiom owners are bright.
::::::: No disrespect to Axiom, but my favorite woofer is my yellow lab :::::::
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Quote:
Quote:
both Audioholics and AVS are worthy of praise for clamping down on those who resort to deceptive marketing tactics
Someone want to explain to me why we can't do this with car salesmen?
Laughed aloud at this.
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I think everyone becomes a 'fanboy' at some point or another, until their horizons broaden.
I agree with this statement. When I remember how amazed I was upon hearing my Axioms, finding them head and shoulders above anything I'd ever heard and owned, I became an instant "fanboy." However, even though my horizons have "broadened" I still remain a huge "fan" of the company, the people, and the product.
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To show proof, we could always start another "Axioms are bright" thread.
My problem with the "Axioms are bright" statement is that, since some people don't find them bright, any all-inclusive, absolute statement, either way, cannot be accurate. IMHO, such a statement is the classic error of thinking one's experience with a given product will define everyone's experience with that product. Now if you want to make it "some people find Axioms bright," you'll get no argument from me.
Jack
"People generally quarrel because they cannot argue." - G. K. Chesterton
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Jack,
Better yet.........."a few THINK Axiom's are bright"
Axiom 'fanboy',
Larry
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Quote:
To show proof, we could always start another "Axioms are bright" thread.
Or the flipside - many other manufacturers are dull and muddy.
Bren R.
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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I think my point is well proved even in jest.
Mentioning the statement "Axioms are bright" has already incited replies to counter the topic.
Let's not kid anyone. People on this Axiom forum defend Axiom products. To say this Axiom forum is neutral, completely open and forgiving...come on. I was there once myself, first to the charge to defend Axiom speakers from any negative slander no matter how minute.
Just ask Peter. Tempers all over the place.
Nasty nasty.
Then the beer and wine threads started up...oh what a new direction we took way back then.
SVS can market however they feel appropriate within the laws of the land. If people don't like it, the results will begin to show in their bottom line.
Last edited by chesseroo; 02/03/07 09:37 PM.
"Those who preach the myths of audio are ignorant of truth."
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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I was there once myself, first to the charge to defend Axiom speakers from any negative slander no matter how minute.
Until you bought another manufacturer's product and you stay around to try to prove to us and yourself that they're better.
I see your thumb in the eye and raise you two fingers.
Bren R.
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Until you bought another manufacturer's product and you stay around to try to prove to us and yourself that they're better.
You see?
Bren knows how the cycle goes.
And that rhymes.
Speaking of cycles, how about that lovely Arctic air mass this morning hmm? A fresh -46C to start off the day.
Last edited by chesseroo; 02/03/07 09:53 PM.
"Those who preach the myths of audio are ignorant of truth."
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Bren knows how the cycle goes.
Yes, the discussion of the meaning of vague adjectives... and then someone makes it personal... and then someone else is Visiting The Bad Again.
I've never really seen much fanboyism here, relatively speaking. I'm not normally a "sign up for a forum type"... don't need to hear my own voice (SidVicious can attest to that), but the average level of intelligence and general respect around here keeps me coming back... something I can't say about any other audio forums. You won't see a Bren R. post on Audioholics or AVS.
So if I defend the users here, it's because of a kinship I have with them. We don't always agree, but the discussion is usually enlightening on all sides.
Bren R.
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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I think my point is well proved even in jest.
Mentioning the statement "Axioms are bright" has already incited replies to counter the topic.
A false statement will always elicit a reply, n'est ce pas?
Jack
"People generally quarrel because they cannot argue." - G. K. Chesterton
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Quote:
I see your thumb in the eye and raise you two fingers.
Bren R.
And besides that we learn some really witty comebacks here.
LIFE IS SHORT.
DON'T BE A DICK.
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Quote:
I've never really seen much fanboyism here, relatively speaking. I'm not normally a "sign up for a forum type"... don't need to hear my own voice
I can remember you saying something to that effect....ohhh about 2400 posts ago and here you are, still here for the same reasons I keep dropping by, the wit, the banter, the good reviews, etc.
Jason
M80 v2
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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SVS can market however they feel appropriate within the laws of the land. If people don't like it, the results will begin to show in their bottom line.
Well its an interesting point you make. However there is an important distinction between how a business conducts itself legally vs ethically. They are different standards.
Out of curiosity I started a poll a few days ago at another site on this topic. The results are shown below and speak for themselves.
Quote:
Do you accept this as normal business practice at internet forums today?
1. I just want a subwoofer and don't care.
12% [ 3 ]
2. I don't like it but I will still buy their products.
12% [ 3 ]
3. I won't buy the products of unethical companies.
76% [ 19 ]
Total Votes : 25
http://www.canuckaudiomart.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=69227#69227
John
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Quote:
Well its an interesting point you make. However there is an important distinction between how a business conducts itself legally vs ethically.
It is unethical to bash someone else'e product on a forum?
I think that is going beyond the ultra sensitive point for most any human being.
It is a p.c. world but come on, people have thicker skins than that and there are many other companies that use strongarm tactics to get their way. Are they also being "unethical"?
Your poll is rather slanted, esp. in regards to the last question. Obviously anyone would answer no to that third statement compared to selecting the other two options and the poll shows that result, but there is an insinuation that their practices are incredibly malevolent by using the term 'unethical'.
I don't think what SVS has done is unethical at all. Mudslinging at best and even the politicians do that, but it certainly is not unethical.
We may think it is not very "honourable" but honour and ethics are two different things.
"Those who preach the myths of audio are ignorant of truth."
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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We may think it is not very "honourable" but honour and ethics are two different things.
Interesting! From the Merriam-Webster online dictionary/thesaurus
Entry Word: ethical
Function: adjective
Text: 1 conforming to a high standard of morality or virtue <the ethical behavior expected of every member of the police force> -- see GOOD
2 following the accepted rules of moral conduct <the ethical course of action for the senator who lied to congress would be to resign> -- see HONORABLE
3 guided by or in accordance with one's sense of right and wrong <ethical writers do not use the words of other writers without giving them proper credit> -- see CONSCIENTIOUS.
Entry Word: honorable
Function: adjective
Text: 1 following the accepted rules of moral conduct <the only honorable thing to do is to admit that you were wrong and apologize>
Synonyms decent, ethical, honest, just, noble, principled, respectable, righteous, upright, upstanding
Jack
"People generally quarrel because they cannot argue." - G. K. Chesterton
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aficionado
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 853 |
Quote:
I don't think what SVS has done is unethical at all. Mudslinging at best and even the politicians do that, but it certainly is not unethical.
We may think it is not very "honourable" but honour and ethics are two different things.
Well the poll does show that for 25% of the respondents the ethics of SVS business practice won't deter their purchase decision. There will always be a % of any group that say the ends justify the means, which sounds like your postion Chesseroo. The results are actually very close to what researchers find in other business as well. There will always be a hard core group (about 25%)where ethical considerations do not enter into their purchase decisions. I actually slanted the question the other way by giving pollsters 2 answers out of the 3 which supported a decision to purchase.
You say what SVS has done is not unethical. Interesting. Lets look at the facts.
For several years now SVS have used phony plants whom the have hired or are staff to post wonderful descriptions of how much they love their SVS subs whether they own them or not. When criticism or concerns are raised by interested parties or potential buyers they appear en masse to either intimidate or undermine the person making the criticism. They start many false threads about how the plant had sub A but sold it to buy SVS sub B and how much better it is. Every once in a while either Stimpson of Voldahal weighs in giving credence to what the plant is saying. When technical information or a competing comparison is posted the gang goes into overdrive with misinformation about the other sub by starting new threads about how they had an SVS sub and the other sub didn't cut it. When threads are started on other non-SVS subs not even mentioning SVS the marketing gang weighs in with how their SVS sub is so much better. When a forum owner tries to curtail this abusive behaviour he gets threatened that SVS will pull its advertising $$s if their plants are not allowed to disrupt non-SVS threads. I've often questioned these plants and their responses indicated they had never heard either the sub in question or owned the SVS sub they were purporting was better. When a group of honest enthusiasts gets together to do blind tests with an SVS sub and an Axiom sub SVS plants respond en masse with how the results cannot be believed and were fixed. I won't even get into the campaign they waged against Axiom in the fall of 2005 when the EP500/600 made such a splash. There is much more but you get the picture.
At the heart of this is a a lack of transparency and a concerted plan aimed at deceiving readers. I've seen many an unsophisticated first time buyer misled by such deceptive practices. I see the ethical question here as clear as night and day and so do 76% of the sample polled. I don't expect everyone to see the ethical implications of this type of business practice but I'm glad to see the mods at Audioholics and AVS do.
Like I said earlier I don't buy products of any company that condones this kind of business practice because it is all too often symptematic of a corporate culture that will also use other disreptutable techniques. For example independent testers have not been able to replicate most of FR graphs at their site which is no surprise to me. Anyway I look at it SVS marketing practices constitute one of the more blatant unethical lapses I've seen in a while. What's right and wrong was certainly clear to Clint and Gene at Audioholics.
John
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 213
local
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local
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 213 |
I knew a guy who was selling a product online.
He setup forums and did the whole nine yards, setting up several accounts and having conversations with himself, touting his products. He said it worked but took a lot of his time.
All I am trying to say is this is a common, but deceptive procedure. I expect if I was one of the other advertisers on the website, I would have a lot to say about the practice, and maybe one of them did.? Possibly, the website was guided by their overall advertisement income, and it became necessary to let go of a portion of the income, to remain unbiased.
Personally, I have always wondered if a reviewer of a product has to return the item they returned when finished ? . I do know of one case where after a review of a HTPC, the reviewer got to keep the product. I would think that conduct would conflict with an unbiased review also.
Whenever money is involved, I anticipate that the playing field is not level. Sad, but true.
Randy
Axiom M80, Ep600, Qs8, VP150, Crown XLI 2500 , DBX Driverack PA2, Focusrite Scarlet 2i4
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 12,077 Likes: 7
Founder, Axiom Upgrade Club shareholder in the making
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Founder, Axiom Upgrade Club shareholder in the making
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 12,077 Likes: 7 |
I've owned an entry-level SVS sub as well as a record-setting earthquake, and I'm sorry, but Mother Nature's bass extension couldn't keep up. SVS FTW!
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,155
connoisseur
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connoisseur
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,155 |
Interesting thread.
I have an SVS sub and am very pleased with it. However, they seem to have crossed over the line.
Too bad. I guess that they felt threatened.
The Rat.
M80s, VP-150, QS8s,
SVS PC 20-39+, OPPO,
Onkyo 703s, Harmony 880
Sony 60" SXRD HDTV
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 853
aficionado
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OP
aficionado
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 853 |
SVS issued this statement today. It looks like the inevitable spin control to me but I hope it also suggests a new direction for them on how they will run their business.
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This statement is in response to recent allegations made by the owners and operators of “Audioholics”, an Internet Audio/Video Magazine.
Despite repeated requests from "Audioholics" over the last two months for SVS to renew our advertising contract with their website, SVS notified Audioholics on January 31, 2007 that we would not be renewing an agreement for 2007. Our decision was due primarily to lower than expected returns on our investment based on customer surveys. At no point in these contract discussions, or the recent issuance of an Audioholics “Product of the Year Award”, or during the entire previous year, had the conduct of SVS been questioned by Audioholics as less than honest and productive.
After concluding our relationship, we were surprised and disappointed to learn the next day that SVS was supposedly “fired” by Audioholics as an advertiser. Audioholics apparently used the statements of a forum member as a pretense for "firing" SVS, insinuating that SVS "planted" the forum member to create controversy and boost SVS sales. Not only are these allegations patently false, they are damaging to SVS' reputation. SVS has never asked any Internet forum member to post anything on its behalf. We can only imagine that Audioholics "fired" SVS as a preemptive strike to protect its image (we would assume that no online magazine wants to be perceived as losing sponsors).
While we regularly participate in all the major A/V forums, both to answer questions about our products, and because we are still audio enthusiasts -- we ALWAYS identify ourselves as SVS employees whenever we discuss anything related to our products, or competitive products. We are an internet-direct business, and it should be self-evident that a significant portion of our sales revenue is derived from credible on-line professional reviews and from equally credible comments by satisfied customers.
With that said, it bears repeating: SVS does not tell anyone in the public what to say, and by extension has never paid anyone (or provided other incentives) for posting comments on our behalf. Nor do SVS employees post statements without identifying their relationship with SVS. If a given audio forum member questions what he perceives to be biased and preferential behavior on the part of Audioholics’ management with respect to its various advertisers, that is, of course, his or her prerogative, based on an opinion and motivation of his own. That such actions are beyond our control should be obvious as well.
Professional integrity and honesty are the very core values upon which SVS was founded nearly 8 years ago; without them we would have already ceased to flourish. For the tens of thousands of valued SVS customers, our personal commitment to those values and audio excellence remain, even in the face of spurious accusations such as these, whatever their motivation. An even greater array of new and improved world-class products and continued dedication to open and objective discourse are our promises to you for 2007.
John
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,102
connoisseur
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connoisseur
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,102 |
Wow,
so they are telling the opposite of Audioholics.com?
Wow, someone here is lying about the renual of their adds, and I am pretty sure Audioholics would never do such a thing...
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 3,602
connoisseur
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connoisseur
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 3,602 |
At this point, someone is lying.
Opening of some emails would probably shed light on the situation.
Bren R.
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,177
connoisseur
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connoisseur
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,177 |
Quote:
At this point, someone is lying.
Opening of some emails would probably shed light on the situation.
Bren R.
Hey, I know! Let's give John Gomery millions of Canadian tax dollars to get to the bottom of this!!! 
Shawn
Epic 80/600 + M3's + M3 Algonquins + M2 Computer + EP125
I think I'm developing an addiction.
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,177
connoisseur
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connoisseur
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,177 |
Quote:
we were surprised and disappointed to learn the next day........
I swear I only slept with your sister AFTER we broke up.
Shawn
Epic 80/600 + M3's + M3 Algonquins + M2 Computer + EP125
I think I'm developing an addiction.
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,102
connoisseur
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connoisseur
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,102 |
>>Hey, I know! Let's give John Gomery millions of Canadian tax dollars to get to the bottom of this!!! >> While we're at it, lets elect the Liberal party again to they can steal hundres of millions of dollars from Canada!!!
Last edited by Hutzal; 02/05/07 11:21 PM.
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 10,420
shareholder in the making
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shareholder in the making
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 10,420 |
Don't speak to soon, the polls are not too promising...
Jason
M80 v2
VP160 v3
QS8 v2
PB13 Ultra
Denon 3808
Samsung 85" Q70
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Joined: May 2003
Posts: 18,044
shareholder in the making
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shareholder in the making
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 18,044 |
Uh, guys? Politics thread...
I am the Doctor, and THIS... is my SPOON!
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,155
connoisseur
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connoisseur
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,155 |
Now, we need someone like Paul Harvey to give us The Rest of the Story!
LOL!!!
The Rat.
M80s, VP-150, QS8s,
SVS PC 20-39+, OPPO,
Onkyo 703s, Harmony 880
Sony 60" SXRD HDTV
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 16,441
shareholder in the making
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shareholder in the making
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 16,441 |
Oh, come on. It's nice, for a change, to see people discuss politics in which I have absolutely no opinion.
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 3,602
connoisseur
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connoisseur
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 3,602 |
Yes, politics thread.
Bren R.
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,177
connoisseur
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connoisseur
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,177 |
Quote:
Now, we need someone like Paul Harvey to give us The Rest of the Story!
LOL!!!
Ratpack, John Gomery is our version of Kenneth Starr.
Your suggestion would certainly cost less, and the money saved could go to sub research.
Shawn
Epic 80/600 + M3's + M3 Algonquins + M2 Computer + EP125
I think I'm developing an addiction.
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,102
connoisseur
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connoisseur
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,102 |
Quote:
Ratpack, John Gomery is our version of Kenneth Starr.
Your suggestion would certainly cost less, and the money saved could go to sub research.
Back on topic, Mabey SVS is in cahoots with the Liberals? They seem to have "covering up the truth" in the bag!
Last edited by Hutzal; 02/06/07 03:38 PM.
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 6,955
axiomite
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axiomite
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 6,955 |
ahhh Canadian Politics.
Our recent choices?
---An ex-finance minister who lost financial credibilty
(sponsorship scandal and others)
---A new PM who arbitrarily creates insta-policy on the fly then suffers the effects.
(Lets not tax trust funds, OMG! I didn't mean for you big companies to become a trust fund!!)
or... (lets stop wasting money on rebating GST to travellers. Umm no I didn't mean to ruin tourism for you and shut down a whole GST center full of jobs in a province with the highest unemployment rate.)
or
---A funny little man whos greatest leadership talent appears to be an ability to play a Eukele.
Seriously thought, I have no political opinion. I trash them all equally.
Back to topic please. heh heh
With great power comes Awesome irresponsibility.
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Re: Disturbing Conduct by SVS
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 5,236
axiomite
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axiomite
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 5,236 |
I find it quite refreshing to see some political post that have nothing to do with the US.  Back to the topic at hand...It would be interesting to know which company is speaking the truth. From both companies past history of behavior, I'm leaning towards believing audioholics. SVS's rather brash marketing has always left a bad taste in my mouth.
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