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Old vs New Denon Receiver
#19388 09/11/03 01:29 AM
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RobH Offline OP
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I am currently powering my M3Ti's with a 1989 Denon DRA-425 receiver. This is a (very clean) 50wpc receiver with a number of nice features: IS remote control, remote-controlled motorized volume control, variable loudness control,.01%THD, etc. My current system sounds GREAT! Everyone who hears the Denon/Axiom combo is blown away by the sound. Folks who have spent many multiples the price of my investment have commented that the M3Ti's (powered by the Denon) sound better than their systems. My question is this: How do the newer Denon stereo receivers compare with older models such as mine? The price is very tempting on a DRA-395 (80wpc). Would I gain anything by going to the DRA-395 (other than the obvious power increase)? The DRA-395 doe not have a variable loudness control or (I don't think) a motorized remote control volume control. Any thoughts?

Re: Old vs New Denon Receiver
#19389 09/11/03 02:48 AM
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Why bother spending the money if you're losing features?


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Re: Old vs New Denon Receiver
#19390 09/11/03 02:50 AM
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Rob, clean power is clean power regardless of when it was manufactured and a few more watts in power rating aren't likely to be noticeable. Most of the time speakers are using about 1 watt and it could well be that you seldom if ever run into even brief peaks that your 425 can't handle. Doesn't seem like you have a good reason to make a change.


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Re: Old vs New Denon Receiver
#19391 09/12/03 04:46 AM
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I second John. There really is hardly any difference between the new and the old receivers especially if you like the way it sounds now and you're not experiencing any problems. The power required by the M3s to play at audible volumes would be the same irrespective of which receiver you have.

I have the M3s myself and I used to power them with a Panasonic receiver that was new at that time. I then tried powering them with a 7 year old battered (cosmetically) and used receiver. There was no difference in the sound. I currently have a custom built amplifier and there's still no difference in the sound except that it plays louder. IN fact, I have it built with minimal internal wiring, 40,000 mfd capacitors, all gold plated contacts (even the switches are gold plated), 7 inch toroidal transformer and the ability to play down to 3 ohms comfortably. But there is no sound difference at all. In fact, my wife and I were expecting the earth to shatter the day we got this beast home. But nothing happened. It plays clean and loud just like all the others.

So if you're happy with the sound, there's really no financial justification in moving to a new receiver.

Re: Old vs New Denon Receiver
#19392 09/12/03 06:05 AM
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That must have been a real bummer, to bring it home and not have it blow away the house. (note, I am not being sarcastic, here). However, building your own amp is really, really cool.


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Re: Old vs New Denon Receiver
#19393 09/12/03 12:52 PM
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Ken, as always, I need to rephrase my statements a bit to give a clearer meaning. My amp, though 50wpc, does blow the neighbourhood. It drives 83spl speakers without a hitch. And it does get very clean and loud, especially when I hook up 2 pairs of speakers. I rarely take the volume beyond 20%.

What we expected was a superior sonic difference. When this did not happen, we went out to a hi-fi shop and listened to some Jamo speakers being played on a Denon and a Yamaha. My M3s and amp still sounded much better. I then brought a locally manufactured 10-year-old 30wpc amp from my brother-in-law and hooked up the M3s. Same sonic output at a lesser volume.

I have no intentions of taking sides or contradicting anybody on amp differences. But, I haven't found any sonic differences between any of the amps I've listened to. At reasonably audible levels, they've all sounded pretty much the same.

And yes, I know you're not being sarcastic at all. It is indeed quite fulfilling to build my own amp to see it work so well.

Re: Old vs New Denon Receiver
#19394 09/13/03 01:50 AM
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Just gotta say it... The fact that you built your own amp is really, really cool. Not that I want to attempt it; I think I'll stick with basic woodworking at the moment!


I am the Doctor, and THIS... is my SPOON!
Re: Old vs New Denon Receiver
#19395 09/13/03 05:05 AM
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I find your comments extremely interesting.

I'm in the process of building my own phono preamp for kicks - but I also recently changed my amp - and I noticed quite a big difference.

Having said that - I should also state that a lot of variables changed. I've got an all vintage set-up (I actually think it is all 1976, almost on accident)... I originally used an HK A402 integrated (40 wpc) - and just bought a Phase Linear 200 at 105 wpc. So there's definitely more power involved, especially since Phase Linear was known for gear that generally outperformed specs by ~20%.

But it all seems more focused, detailed, and silent when it should be silent. Now I realize that the brands involved are a huge step for the time period - like going from current H/K to something like a Krell, maybe... but I was really blown away by how "new" everything sounds.

Of course, another variable (beyond power) is that the caps in the Phase Linear amp have been replaced with nice new ones, while my old integrated (which now serves faithfully as preamp) was all orig.

I suppose I don't really have a point here, except that sometimes changing gear can actually make a difference - there are just a lot of factors involved.

btw - my g/f noticed the difference with the new amp immediately, and she take no interest in that kind of thing - so I kind of consider that my "super-blind" test


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