Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion The Water Cooler gas grill advice needed

So I buy a bunch of grillin' goodies this weekend, and fire up the grill on Monday only to discover she's died on me. I need a new grill.

I trust you guys for most all of my purchases, so what say thee?

I don't want to spend more than $400 (and that's pushing it!) I don't need a side burner. No need for a rotiserie. I want something that is solidly built, and preferably has really good heat dispersion and control. My old grill had horrible hot spots and cold spots, and was pretty flimsy.

I stopped and looked at some grills today and one stood out as just about exactly what I was looking for, but it was $650!

The scary part is, that was not even the mid-point on the price scale! That's CRAZY. THIS is cheaper than that! - and a hell of a lot better built and useful!

This might fit the bill. Weber Spirit

Yeah...we're going to try to stop by Home Depot and look at that one in person. Seems it's very likely a cheaper built version of the Genesis E-310.

Craig, if you can, buy the Weber's from a specialty shop instead of the big box stores. The Genesis that THEY sell will be about the same $$, but have stainless flavorizer bars and stainless cooking rods. (Instead of porcelain coated mild steel) Far better for longevity.

If you really can't stretch the extra $250 for the EP310 (and I really think you should - it's well worth it), the Spirit is better than most at the $400 price point.

I went to BBQS GALORE at lunch today and liked the Genesis EP-310, but damn...$650? Seriously...that's the same price a a full on convection oven for your home. Why the crazy price gouging for a BBQ?

Because they know you're a guy and won't settle for a wimpy grill.

They don't know me very well.


$650 can buy me a REALLY sweet art commission.

LOL! True.

Maybe you can find a grill with a Daredevil motif? I guess you're not the prototypical shopper Weber had in mind.

Let's see how that convection oven stands up to the elements outside year round! (Especially up here in Ontario)

I guess you would choke when you find out that the average grill sale out of our store is $1700!

But we do have Broil Kings starting at $249, all the way up to full Lynx outdoor kitchens at $25,000.

FYI - Those Broil Kings are a good option for a grill that's still made here in North America

My 48" kitchen range and 30" outdoor grill are both made by DCS, if the Weber is great at 650.00 I would call it a steal. You probably want to get something that you won't have to replace every couple years.

I would say that the Weber is a very solid mainstream consumer grill, and worth every penny of the $650 they are asking. As a step up, without question, I'd buy a Napoleon. But you really can't compare either of them to your DCS, as it's considered a "professional" or "commercial" product.

I've got a Spirit 310. Love it, even without the stainless steel stuff. which I'll buy as soon as what I've got rusts through, which looks like next summer.

Craig, for a less expensive grill which might not have the durability of the Webers you might consider this .

I bought this model from a specialty shop, as one person already recommended, with all stainless steel parts inside. This is key because my previous grill did not have stainless parts and the entire interior corroded within a few years. Over time the graudal rusting causes hot and cold spots, is more difficult to clean, and in the end, the cost of replacing all the rotten parts with quality new ones did not make economic sense to me. Personally, I'd rather apply that $ towards a better, higher quality new one that will last longer.

My father has a Weber Genesis he purchased 8 years ago and it's still running strong.

I've had the new one for 3 months now and am happy as a clam, steak, burger, lamb.......

But just don't run out and buy a Q just because it has stainless innards. There are different grades of stainless..... Units manufactured off shore tend to use 430 stainless which will still rust out within about 3 years. (And then good luck getting parts) The better units from North America mostly use 304 stainless. The best way to tell is to run a magnet over the steel. If it doesn't stick - it's 300 series.

Here is a whole lot of Stainless Steel info you will probably never need to know.

Ours is a Weber Genesis S-320 that we bought from Home Depot which included the stainless flovorizor bars and stainless cooking rods, great grill ... we also sprang for the Weber grill cover which is very impressively made. This grill, so far, looks like it is the perfect grill for the harsh salt water environment where we live.

As far as grilling great tasting food, it's hard to beat a charcoal grill. We had one of these $129 charcoal grills from Lowes for about three years that we were extremely happy with but the steel just didn't last in this environment ... it cooked better tasting food over our $850 Weber gas grill, hands down.

Rick, you need a ceramic "Kamado" - The Big Green Egg!

I never go crazy with my barbaque purchases. I live near enough to a bay on the ocean that I have to constantly clean the salt spray off my windows. I'm not close enough waves are actually splashing up or anything but you'd be surprised how far that stuff carries on the wind.

Even taking care to keep it covered, the salt eats through my barbacues on a regular basis. Even stainless steel. Stainless can last a very long time in a salt environment if you have the time to keep rinsing it clean but I'm just not that ambitious and the steel parts will still fall apart around it anyways.

This story is of no help to you I guess but thanks for letting me rant.

The Spirits are mostly stainless steel. The non-stainless models merely do not have a stainless lid or stainless grates or flavorizer bars. You can get new grates and flavorizer bars for $50.

I'd stay away from John's Walmart special. In those cases, you don't even get what you pay for...

An example.

I am VERY happy with the Weber Genesis Gold B I bought about five years ago. It just works. There are so many details about it that are both simple and well-constructed. I'm fairly certain I'll never be able to convince myself to buy anything except a Weber in this product category.

I bought a Vermont Castings and it works great. I also noticed it was one that Consumer Reports listed as a best buy.

Here is Weber's warranty info that can also be found at: http://www.weber.com/bbq/pub/grill/2007/pop_warranty.htm


Gas Grill Warranty
2007 Weber Summit, Genesis and Spirit Grill Warranties

Aluminum castings-2 year on paint excludes fading 25-years
Stainless steel Shroud 25-years
Porcelain-enameled shroud 25-years
Stainless steel burner tubes 10-years
Stainless steel cooking grates 5-years no rust through or burn through
Stainless steel Flavorizer bars 5-years no rust through or burn through
Porcelain-enameled cast-iron cooking grates 5-years no rust through or burn through
Porcelain-enameled cooking grates 3-years no rust through or burn through
Porcelain-enameled Flavorizer bars 2-years no rust through or burn through
Infrared Rotisserie Burner 2-years
All remaining parts 2-years

Yeah Ken, but you didn't make the connection between the CR report summary that you linked and the Brinkmann grill that I mentioned. The June issue of CR(which I'd read a couple weeks ago)reported on grill tests and ranked the Weber tops for around $700, but also ranked a Brinkmann similar to the one in the Walmart ad(the only difference is that the Walmart one explodes on occasion)as a "Best Buy" for around $200. The link to Walmart was made because it happened to be shown on the site I'd checked on grills, but certainly the Home Depot model should be considered(especially if it's in stock at a local Home Depot)since Craig is looking to spend less.

And for the crème de la crème of outdoor grilling of the 1960s - the plans for a backyard masonry BBQ/fire pit. Beat that coal snobs.

Bren R.

I have the Weber Genesis S-320 grill as well (natural gas version, connected directly to my gas line), and it is outstanding. The all-stainless steel construction is key. SS just stands up better to time and the elements better than the other materials like enamel. So if you can, do try to step up to one of the models that offers SS parts.

Well I took the plunge...and got the Weber Genesis E-310. The grill is great, the buying experience...not so much. I just posted this rant on yelp.com. Enjoy.

I was in need of a new bbq grill. After extensive research I decided upon a Weber Genesis E310. I was told by more than one person to get it at Home Depot if possible, as they would assemble it for free. I hate putting things together, so I sounded like a great plan.

Saturday, June 28th my bf and I went in and asked for the grill. A friendly gentleman wrote up a little slip of paper with the model number and price and told me to bring it to the cashier. I asked if they indeed had a free assembly service and he said they did, I just needed to tell the cashier.

At checkout I gave the woman the little slip he'd given me and she rang me up. $649. Not a cheap grill. I explained we were going to have them assemble it, and I'd pick it up later. (Monday was the day I was told I could pick it up). She advised that I just needed to come back Monday with my receipt and bring it to "Services" and pointed across the room. No problem. As I walked away, I asked if she'd staple my receipt to the little slip the original guy had given me. She said I wouldn't need it, but gladly stapled them together for me anyway.

When leaving, we were stopped by their door monitor who checks your receipt, and she was a bit puzzled, as I had a receipt but no items. I explained they were going to assemble it, and I'd be picking it up on Monday. She almost marked my receipt with her highlighter, but stopped short, realizing I wasn't really leaving with my item.

I know this may seem like rambling...but it gets better.

On Monday I mooch a ride with my friend back to Home Depot to pick up my grill. (He's got a pickup truck) As we're walking towards "Services" I see my beautiful new grill sitting there in the corner. I hand the woman my receipt and proudly say I'm there to pick up my grill, pointing to the beautiful Weber.

She asks for my phone number and after searching her computer, explains she has no record of my grill. I show her my receipt again, and again point to the grill that's not five feet away. A black Weber Genesis E310...just like I ordered and is on my receipt. Her response?

"How do I know you didn't leave the store on Saturday with your grill?"

Excuse me? Did she just essentially accuse me of stealing a bbq? I asked her to explain...and she did indeed suggest I may have stolen a grill on Saturday. She suggested they'd need to view Saturday's security footage before she could do anything more.

As absurd as that was I offered them a photocopy of my ID. Take my ID, give my my grill and if they see me walking out with a grill on the video, send the cops and come get me. No. She said she couldn't do that.

As I felt my blood pressure rising I realized I needed to speak with someone else. She called for the supervisor.

15 minutes later he shows up and sticks with the same course of action. I can't have my grill or a refund until they can be certain I didn't steal one. They said they needed to have an LP (yeah...LOSS PREVENTION.) specialist review Saturdays security footage, but alas there wasn't one there, so I'd have to come back again tomorrow and let them look at the tape then.

I'm ready to explode at this point. My friend and I are in complete disbelief that they're doing this. My friend goes so far as to ask them to call the police for us. I was going to stop them, as I knew the cops wouldn't want to have anything to do with this, but I figured it'd help my case, showing that I had nothing to hide. I didn't steal a damn grill and I wasn't leaving without either a grill or my money back.

The call to the cops seemed to be enough to let them realize I wasn't going anywhere. Mr. Supervisor then got on his cell phone and called one of his "LP specialists" to come in from home.

After two hours of arguing, we left with an assembled grill.

The simple fact of the matter was a mistake was made in that I was never told by either the cashier or the guard at the door that I needed to go to "Services" BEFORE leaving and fill out forms for a "will call" pickup. Adding to that error, they don't print anything on your receipt indicating that your purchase is to be picked up at a later date. Both issues are easily remedied with better training of their employees and something as simple as a printout on your receipt. When I suggested that to the supervisor as I left, he simply shrugged his shoulders and said "he didn't handle that stuff".

As bad as the mistake was, what made it completely intolerable was the way they handled it, and treated me. I was guilty until proven innocent. NOT the best way to treat a customer. Even after I was proven innocent, they did nothing more then say "OK, you're all set".

Do I even need to say this was my LAST purchase at the Depot?

GRRRRRRR...."

That's a story of ignorance alright Craig.
I sympathize with your frustration.

Gone are the days of home town mom and pop shop service; unless you live in a really small town, like Dwight, Ontario where they make these fantastic little speakers...

Craig, that's horrible how you were treated. I'm normally a patient person, but going through something like that would certainly test my limits. The part that really irks me is that they basically accused you of stealing without any proof. That could open them up to serious problems.

Jeez, that is some story, I was over at Home Depot yesterday looking at the same grill, I think you probably handled the situation better than I would have.
Is there a difference between the 310 and the 320? The reason I'm looking is because my wife turned on our DCS grill Sunday to warm it up, forgot about it, it got so hot that the accumulated grease from our last big barbecue (we forgot to clean it ) also caught on fire melting the knobs and frying the electronic ignition. The barbecue is on an upstairs balcony and we only realized it was on fire because a window was open in the house and it set off the smoke alarms. Needless to say she owes me a new grill.

The 310 doesn't have the side burner. Other than that, I believe they are the same. It's a great grill!

I bought mine (not a Genesis, but another Weber) from an Ace. A fairly pleasant experience, although they couldn't figure out the stainless steel option I wanted.

Gotta say, I would have been so livid, although I wouldn't have thought of calling the cops. I'm sorry you had such a crappy experience. It seems to be standard practice for the bigger stores to believe their customers are thieves first these days.

I'm so glad I was blessed with the "love to assemble things" gene. I may never have to put up with crap like that. Dude, Craig, I could visualize the steam blowing out of your ears as you tried to come to grips with the idiocy of the situation.

The worst thing someone can do to me is to suggest I did something I'm innocent of.

Just wow.

You satisfied your wife.

Now we wait for the reaction.

And yeah, what a bunch of crap from those Home Depot employees.

(*piling on*)

Not only does Peter satisfy his wife on a regular basis, he's a funny and well-respected member of these boards!

No, it still here - at the Mom & Pop specialty stores. Craig would have just ended up having to spend another $25 to $50 to get it though. And worth it for the extra service. Let's see how HD treats him if his ignitor fails within warranty. He'll get the standard - "call the manufacturer". Most specialty shops will keep OEM replacement parts on hand.

I actually went with Home Depot because I had $300 worth of gift cards and a 10% off coupon. Though thinking about it, I don't think we have a mom & pop shop that sells this in LA. Does BBQS GALORE count as mom & pop? I doubt it.

Awful hard to find a mom&pop in LA.

Well that's a no brainer then, with an approx $360.00 difference! Kind of like my situation with the TV. Because of gift cards, I'm locked into buying it at Future Shop.

Craig we bought our Genesis Stainless 320, along with the side burner we've never used from Home Depot and didn't have any issues ... nobody else in our small(ish) town carried Weber. Sorry to hear about your troubles.

Don't forget to drain the grease from that small rectangular drip pan often and scrape the caked up grease from the big drip pan directly under the burners, otherwise you'll fire up it up one day and the whole grill lights up ... not that it's ever happened to me or anything.

A buddy of mine down in West Palm bought a very nice Jenn-Aire gas grill a year or so back and was recently complaining about the stupid thing always flaming up and burning everything, I asked him if he ever cleaned the grease drip pans, his reaction was "What drip pans?"

He seems very happy with it nowadays.

Oh. You really have to do that often? Hrm...

Another satisfied Weber owner here. My last Weber was getting long in the tooth, so my wife let me get a Genesis EP 310 for Father's Day. I got mine through TrueValue Hardware and they assembled and delivered it for free. They also hauled off the old one. It's going to get a workout this weekend, that's for sure.

It sucks to hear that you had such a hard time with your purchase. Unfortunately, given the brain trust you were working against, your situation is unlikely to change anything on their end.

My weber is still going strong. If I were to buy again, I'd get a three burner model. Mine takes a while to heat up and doesn't get quite as hot as I'd like.

Peter the 320 has three burners and to me it doesn't do as well as any of our old charcoal grills in the past, we'll put all three burners on high with the lid closed to heat the unit (very hot) but whenever the lid is opened it seems to lose a lot of the heat and will not sear the way we'd like. We've been using charcoal grills for the past several years and it really takes a while to get the hang of using the gas grill ... which I don't believe I have yet.
I've been looking around for a really good charcoal grill/smoker to use whenever we're not doing the daily gas grill cooking.

Yeppers Ken, that thing needs to be cleaned every now and again!

I just got the 310 as well. I got the natural gas one, as we are having a gas line run out to our new deck. The deck is supposed to be finished today. The grill is in a box in the garage waiting for me to put it together. Glad to hear people are liking theirs.

I put together my last grill and didn't have problems...lasted me 11 years. It still works, but is getting rather old. Hopefully this one will be ok as well.

We've had our Weber Summit for two years now and both the wife and I agree we should have bought one a long time ago. It still looks brand new and works perfectly. It gets plenty hot very quickly as well (within 10 mins it hits 700F). We have also found that it is almost impossible to cook food incorrectly on the grill, it always seems to come out just right. We hard piped the grill to the house natural gas supply as well, and it really helps knowing you will never have to run out to the store to change tanks!

We do use the side burner usually for corn on the cob. But, the other nice feature of the grill is the smoker box. I buy the hickory wood chips and smoke baby back ribs on it. The smell of the hickory smoke is just wonderful.

That's a gorgeous barbecue! Tell me, do you have a system to remind you to turn it off since you have it hard-piped in? We ran a line from the propane mega-tank to the barbecue and so far we've only forgotten to turn it off once. Remembered after dinner thank goodness! But we've heard horror stories of friends draining enormous propane tanks because they forgot for days . . .

No official system, but when we are done cooking we always leave the top open to let it cool before covering it. So, we have to go back in 30-60 mins to cover it, and if its still hot we know we left it on (I've never done it myself, but the wife left one burner on once).

Well, I guess I will revive THIS thread.

And Amie has a new picture!

Okay, as always, I need help. My 10 year old Weber has retired.

I'm looking at Broil King, Vermont Castings, Napoleon and Weber. Need NG. I value North American jobs.

Whaddyagot?

I really like my Vermont Castings, built like a tank, but also enjoy using my little Weber Q when camping. If I had to buy a new home version I think I would try a Weber but would splurge and go for the platinum/summit series, my friend has one and he really likes the lifetime parts(replaced igniter 3 times now) and the dual flavorizer bars; no flare ups.

I'm not going for the Summit series; just too much money. A Genesis S330 is going to be ~$1,000 by the time I pay tax. That's probably about my top end.

But I will look. Dammit.

I am still pretty happy with my Spirit E300, although I did replace the grates with stainless steel (Weber original) and the flavorizer bars with aftermarket SS, which I'm very happy with. Next upgrade is probably going to be these.

Go with charcoal and get a Horizon grill.

Thanks for chiming in, Rick. I appreciate you.

It certainly crossed my mind to revert back to charcoal. But I'm SO spoiled now (after being hooked up to NG for 10 years) that I am willing to sacrifice some quality/heat in return for the convenience of a gasser. I know that Grillers are lesser life forms than BBQers, but at least I'm honest.

I was pondering pellet grills, but it appears that - in order to get one that also attains "grilling temperature" - I'd need to buy a MAK, Fast Eddy's or something else that is out of my budget.

I'll probably end up with a Weber Genesis E-330 or S-330, but I always enjoy belaboring these decisions with you guys.

Ken, those are cool.

I remember thinking that the reason I didn't want to get a Spirit was because it didn't get hot enough. But those grillgrates might mitigate that concern. What are the key differences between the Spirit and Genesis lines?

Got me on the differences.

My Spirit (a 3 burner) will get up over 600° according to the (undoubtedly inaccurate) thermometer on the cover. However, it will only get up to ~400 with only 2 burners on, which can produce some less than ideal results with a rotisserie. Still good, but not as good as it might be. I may look up if there's some other retrofit I can do to the grill to mitigate this.

At some point, I'll probably get a Weber kettle for when I want to take more time and fool around with charcoal. As it stands, I'm really happy with the steaks, chicken thighs and other basics I do on the gas. It's when I get fancy that I'd rather have something else.

Not sure if this is important to you Tom, but the next grill I buy will be 100% stainless steel. With the rain, snow and humidity we get around here, grills are either disposable, or you suck it up and get one that will last. Every grill I've got so far has lasted about three years, then whatever component is not SS rusts. It's hard to find a grill that doesn't have some component or panel that isn't just painted sheet metal. I stumbled onto one that was all SS but didn't have the cash to buy it at that moment. I think it might have Kitchen Aid, surprisingly enough. At any rate, if that's important to you, make sure you look them over closely. They may say they are all SS, but they rarely are.

Thanks, Mike. Yes, that's an issue for me, too. I got really great service from my Weber, but eventually even the stainless flavorizer bars rusted/burned through. I don't feel like doing a masonry project, or I'd look at a built-in, which could more easily be all stainless.

You know, it's like most things. The one I want is more than I want to pay.

Not all stainless is equal. Be sure to bring a magnet with you. If it sticks to any of the interior parts, you will be replacing those parts within 3 or 4 years - almost guaranteed.

Shawn!

Tom!

I'm extremely happy with my Weber Summit S-470.

David!

Tom, I got da Consumer Reports tests. The top rated unit was the Vermont Castings VCS322SSP($1,000; cast iron grates). Almost equal was the Char-Broil 463250512($400; Home Depot; cast iron), given a "Best Buy" with price considered. The Weber E-330($800; cast iron)and S-330($950; stainless steel)followed closely. Various Broil King and Napoleon models were ranked lower.

John?!?!

Cam, since Tom asked "Whaddyagot", I thought that response was appropriate.

Thanks, John. Very helpful. Perhaps even the shiznit.

Definitely da schiznit. John, you crack me up. I bet you were a big fan of 'the button down mind'.

Absolutely, Fred.

Awaiting delivery of the Weber Genesis S-330.

I wasn't able to get my hands on a Vermont Castings. I really like the build quality and the design of the Weber, both of which seem significantly improved from the model I am replacing. I am very eager to put it to use.

Thanks, again, as always, for your valuable assistance in clarifying my thinking.

Great choice Tom!

Well, the non-Chinese Napoleons weren't going to save me any money, and I just couldn't find any dealers within 100 miles, anyway.

You guys helped me belabor the decision to the point where I am comfortable, now. Which is my usual process.

Weber Genesis parts are manufactured in China and assembled in the U.S. Weber's own statement. So, they're Chinese grills. *I^ have no problem with this, but thought I'd shed some light on it.

You still have made a great choice, and you'll get a lot of enjoyment out of your new toy, Tom. Congrats!

Shawn's the man with the bbq info!
I trust him with my lif.... uh.... red meats!

Here is a slightly condensed version of the PM I sent Tom:



Everyone will have their own opinions of course, but this is what I learned working 11 years working at a fireplace shop that sold $200,000 to $300,000 BBQ's/year.

It will be almost impossible to find a grill that is 100% North American. All of them have at least some parts sourced in China. Crown Verity will be the closest you will get. The plastic knobs & wheels are the only off-shore parts.

Shawn, I REALLY appreciate your help.

I found a couple things I want to share.

First, unlike most electronics, there is a legitimate "build quality" factor that you really just can't evaluate without being able to touch the thing. I had a hard time - even in the Seattle metro area - putting my hands on many of the models I was interested in.

Second, there are design nuances that - likewise - you can't really ascertain easily solely from web resources. The drip-pan and bottom of the Genesis firebox have been completely redesigned compared to my older model. And they really put some thought into not only how it would perform, but also how much work I'd have to do to maintain it. I looked at a Kitchenaid brand grill at Costco; it was lovely, but the drip pan wasn't removable, and was very close to the burner bars. So, I passed.

Edit: One other thing... Weber makes "premium" versions of the Genesis models that have the enamel (rather than stainless) lid. The E-310 has enameled-cast-iron grates and burner bars but the EP-310 has stainless interior components.

Thank you again.

If anyone is in the market for a top end, hand made in the USA grill that will last a lifetime, take a look at Kalamazoo. Frightfully expensive, but if I were planning to build an outdoor kitchen, or kickass patio, I'd give them serious consideration.

http://kalamazoogourmet.com/

Mike, "frightfully" just didn't prepare me for that.

Hmm. Good used car for the teenager or a grill for the backyard....

+1 Good thing I was sitting down. I do like the cast stainless burners, though...

"For the teenager?"

Try for me...

Agreed Ken. I paid less than that for my last truck.

I paid a third of that for my car.

One of these days I'll need to spend a third of that to replace the transmission, but that's another thread.

Well I said they were expensive..... A coworker told me about them. He used to work at a machine shop that made a lot of parts and fixtures for them, all out of solid 304 SS. You got to admit though, they are impressive.

OUR EGG CAME IN!!
Pictures soon as i'm working on finishing the wood, but also contemplating getting rid of the cedar plank top (looks too light yellowish and i don't want to stain it; prefer a completely natural wood look but darker or mixed browns) and instead i might get a Cherrywood veneer 3/4" plywood and make my own custom shape top.

I guess idea at some point may move to the Gots me Wood thread.

FWIW, I was assuming that you would receive the chicken first.

That is one big chicken, perhaps along these lines.

SFW, as long as you don't get fired for trying to hide your laughing and snorting and generally falling on the floor.