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#231511 - 11/25/08 06:48 AM Re: A question for the sub owners in the house... [Re: bridgman]
MarkSJohnson Online   happy
shareholder in the making

Registered: 09/27/04
Posts: 10694
Loc: Central NH
 Originally Posted By: bridgman

Mark, I hate having to be the one to point this out, but the dimensions of your trap #2 look to be almost exactly 2:1:1, not unlike a cube in terms of bass response \:o


Only when empty...only when empty. And 9 times out of 10, it's usually two-thirds stuffed with Bassi.
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#231521 - 11/25/08 08:50 AM Re: A question for the sub owners in the house... [Re: MarkSJohnson]
Micah Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 11/16/08
Posts: 1789
Loc: Indiana you hoser!!!!
Well this is just GREAT!!! It seems anymore the better you want your system to sound, the more freakin crap you have to buy to achieve said goal. Why can't we just go back to the good ol days of hi-fi when things were much, much simpler... you know, way back in W's first term of office!!!
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#231522 - 11/25/08 09:57 AM Re: A question for the sub owners in the house... [Re: Micah]
alan Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 01/29/02
Posts: 3178
Loc: Toronto/New York/Dwight
Hi Micah,

Don't get carried away by the bass traps movement. Mostly, they don't work unless they're extremely large and ugly, and the biggest proponents of bass traps are. . . .who else but the manufacturers of bass traps!

You're far better off in terms of even bass distribution to get two subwoofers than waste a lot of money on bass traps. Careful positioning of two subwoofers will get you 90% of the way towards the ideal--four subwoofers (!!).

Regards,
Alan
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#232028 - 11/28/08 07:24 PM Re: A question for the sub owners in the house... [Re: alan]
Micah Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 11/16/08
Posts: 1789
Loc: Indiana you hoser!!!!
Four subwoofers??? Ha-ha, yes this seems like a MUCH cheaper way to optimize the sound of my stereo system! Is it just a coincidence that the biggest proponent of a lot of subwoofers is... a subwoofer manufacturer???

LMAO, just busting your balls a litte Alan. I am still battling over the decision to buy two EP500's or the new EP800 to be honest. I am excited about both of the possibilities. Hey I know, if you want me to do a full review on both set-ups why don't you just send both combinations over and I'll get down to the bottom of the question, "which set-up works best"! =D

I will be making a decision and ordering a Home Theater package within the next week... when does the EP800 officially roll out?
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M80's
QS8's
VP150
EP800
Denon 4802
Emotiva XPA-3
Samsung BD-P3600
Sharp 65 Inch Aquos LCD

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#232032 - 11/28/08 08:36 PM Re: A question for the sub owners in the house... [Re: Micah]
SirQuack Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 01/29/04
Posts: 13311
Loc: Iowa
Hello Micah,

This is one subject that I don't agree with Alan. \:\( They don't have to be big/ugly, and they do work, in my opinion if you use the correct proven material. And no, it was not just my brain getting used to the sound. If placed correctly, the sound is far less skewed and there is less ringing and echoing.

I'm a supporter of bass traps and FRZ (first reflection zone) panels. I'm also a supporter of multiple subs. Bass collects in corners of rooms, including floor/wall and ceiling/wall locations, which affects the FR throughout the entire room. The bass traps DO help even out the frequency response for all locations, just like multiple subs do, they can work togethor in harmony. I will say I am not a EQ fan, and plan to sell my SMS-1 soon.

This science applies not only to recording studios, but also to home applications. Engineers would not use them in recording lab settings if there was no benefit. Graphs don't lie either, and they don't have to be expensive. I made all mine myself, it was very affordable and easy. If your not a DIY person, GIK and others are very affordable as well. Other companies can be more expensive.

I've had a few auditions in my home, the last one just last week. The person mentioned how tight/accurate and not skewed the sound was. This was not the case with bare reflective walls. Yes, before the Axioms sounded awesome, but a person could notice the echo or reflective sound bouncing off the side walls and ceiling.

I am not advocating completely covering every square inch of wall and ceiling space, as to much can deaden the sound and you do need a little reflection. If you've ever gone from having a reflective floor (concrete/wood) to placing a pad/carpet/ it is like night and day better. The same applies to FRZ's on walls and ceiling.

Here is a great read on the subject.

http://www.ethanwiner.com/acoustics.html

Here is a before/after graph of my room with measurements taken in 1Hz increments. The only change was adding front corner bass traps using Owens Corning 703, the same material used in recording studios, sound labs, theaters, auditorioms, gymnasiums, sound chambers, you get the idea...

Also, this was when I only had ONE sub, the EP500.


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#232068 - 11/29/08 07:11 AM Re: A question for the sub owners in the house... [Re: SirQuack]
myrison Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 02/03/08
Posts: 1898
Loc: Austin, TX
What dB level were you calibrated to here Randy?
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#232080 - 11/29/08 09:41 AM Re: A question for the sub owners in the house... [Re: myrison]
SirQuack Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 01/29/04
Posts: 13311
Loc: Iowa
It has been almost two years since I plotted this graph manually using the Real Traps download files. I'm pretty sure I had all my speakers calibrated to around 78dB's. When you download the files there is a pink noise clip your supposed to run first and I think you raise the volume to around 78dB's before you start the individual 10-300Hz plotting.
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M80s-VP180-QS8s-EP600-2xEP350 Denon3808 Outlaw7700
M22-OWM22-VP100-Denon2805
Audio Nirvana

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