Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Advice from Axiom Owners Got mad and left

SO the wife and I went down to harry's HiFi to give a listen to some Grado headphones just a hour ago, and I must say they where worth the money (I did not get them just saying how good they sound).

Anyway, when I was sitting down to listen to them the sales girl starts talking to my wife. She asks what we have at home and my wife says, "Axiom I think". That's when the sales person said, "they are crap". I myself did not hear this b/c I had the headphones on. So I take them off not knowing what was said and asked if I could listen to the B & W also to compare to my axiom's.

She side that I would be surprised b/c axiom's are not very good I asked, "What do you mean". She said that they sounded muddy and to high and that the b & w where way better, ect.

I just said they where infact good speakers and had the specs. to back it up, that's when she dropped the crap thing and started with Now get this.

Axiom sucks b/c the reason they went to the internet is b/c no one wanted to sell the product, and the second reason they are no good is b/c it shut downs small business's.

I got told that Axiom is like wallmart.

Then she got kind of bitchy about people just coming to the highend stores and hearing the product and just buying on line.

At about this point I just said thanks for you help and bye. I still wanted to hear there integra amps but I just did not want to be there anymore.

Yes I will admit that is what I was doing, I just wanted to hear it and I will buy online, why b/c I'm not rich if I can save 30$ that is alot to me.

Whether you planned to buy at that store or not isn't really her business. If she assumes that's what potential customers do(buy online), I'm afraid she will actually scare away any possible business with her attitude. Also, I find that retailers in any business who show no respect for their competition tend to turn potential customers away. Sounds like she needs a refresher course in customer relations.

I try to make all my major purchases locally unless something either isn’t available or the price difference it huge. I like to be able to walk into the store within 30 days like yesterday hand them the TV and say I don’t like this one and want to try another.

For computer parts I do most of my shopping on line like at Newegg and then go to Fry’s with the parts list and by what I can on the list from them. It’s made the difference in get a computer up and running that day (bad video card) or having to wait for an exchange through the mail (UPS).

But if someone treaded me like that I would waste as much of their time as I could and then not buy anything from them. I’ve done that to car salesmen. If I felt they or their sales manager were jerking me around I’ll keep them going all day and then just walk away from them. They hate it when you do that on a Saturday during a big sale and there are potential buyers wandering all around the lot.

I think in this case I simply would have told her that I did, in fact, plan on buying there until she opened her mouth.

Oh come on Mark, I know you ... you would have bought the entire store and then fired her azz.

If you want a salesperson whose sole interest is making the sale and who will give you whatever strokes she thinks will assure her commission, you were in the wrong store for you. If you had wanted an honest opinion about your equipment and what you might buy to improve your system, sounds like you were in the right place. But you left, because you didn't want honesty, you wanted strokes.

People are often asses in the name of honesty, it's true.

Greg, I don't follow your post; from R96's description, the saleswoman was either deliberately lying or had no knowledge of what she was claiming. In either case, that couldn't be fairly described as "honesty".

that makes 2

No, in the second case, it could be fairly described as honesty. She could be honest but wrong. If someone agrees with you, it can be because he honestly shares your opinion, or because he is dishonest, but thinks agreeing with you is the best way to get from you what he wants. I think one should prize disagreement.

Only if the disagreement has a factual basis.

I think it is pretty obvious by her statements, she had no clue what she was talking about, and probably doesn't know the difference between a watt or a dB.

My guess is that she (the self imposed expert), was expressing her opinion (based on nothing more than greed), so that she could impress you that her store carried better speakers. Hopefully to sell them to you.

I probably just stated the obvious. I'm pretty good at that.

Sounds like she had an axe to grind with on-line business. Is it just me, or do others see the irony in this post. She ranted on rage-dude because of ID and tire kickers (not a good thing to do, ranting to customers) yet, given that rage bought on line and was just using the store before buying on line, she sure picked the correct target.

Sounds like a win-win. Both parties were pissed off at the right people for the right reasons. Doesn't get better than that.

He could REALLY piss her off and ask her what colour her belly button lint is.

I did acknowledge that I was just going there to test out the headphones but I did really what to test out the other amps, I have been wanting to upgrade my onkyo 806 for awhile now, and it would have been nice to hear them but I did not feel welcomed there.
All most like they knew it all and what I knew was little. yes I don't know lots about audio but I just felt like I did not belong, if that make's any sense. I felt like a teenager in a store and the clerk looking at you.

Also I would like to add when I did come in the store I told the sale person that I was just looking around.

She's pretty much the definition of a self-fulfilling prophesy.

Was she cute?

No, she was in her late 4o's

I know lots of chicks in their late 40's that are still hot.

Mark's absolutely right. Her rant insured that you would not buy anything from them. I know that you had not planned to buy anything going in, but if she had treated you nicer, then she would have had at least some chance of doing business with you. But instead of trying to build a relationship with a potential customer, she got antagonistic and confronational. Way to go, genius.

It's SOOO much easier to see that when you, yourself, are in your 40s!

Or 50's

Touché!

I wouldn't classify them chicks. Maybe hens but not chicks.

I'd personally choose an aged to perfection, wise and experienced hen over a chick any day.

When i get that kind of attitude in a store, i just ask to speak to the manager and explain to them how the salesperson was just rude, assuming, or whatever the issue was that i found offensive as a consumer/potential customer/human being.
It is amazing how fast a manager will reprimand staff and be more open to the customer if they've been told of a situation where the salesperson could have used alot more tact and alot less personal attitude.

I know i posted about an experience i had years ago at one of our local stores, Advance Electronics. Not a box store, but reasonably sized and carry lots of stuff ("high" end to less expensive fair). The salesman came in as i was listening to something in their 'high' end room, Mcintosh amps, Totem Winds (4k/pair), etc. He started in with the cable thing. I told him i don't believe in that, and basic electronic reasoning (30 words or less). He got so offended he made a comment about my Axiom speakers saying i wouldn't hear a difference with such low quality gear so it wouldn't matter.
I called back after and spoke with the manager. Told him i was going to buy some gear and instead left the store because of this attitude. The manager had it right. He said to me "that salesperson should have kept their opinions to himself". He offered me a 5% discount off the item i was considering but i never did go back later.
Perhaps some people are asking for a salesperson's opinion, but if not, and in the audio world of snobbery, they have to be more sensitive to what they say to people especially if they make comments about the personal choices of that person standing in front of them.

"Hey the car you drive is electric blue. What a bad choice for you to have made. You should buy our clearly nicer red car".
Ever hear a car salesman tell you such a ridiculous thing when you walked into a showroom?

One's personal choices shouldn't be criticized by a salesman. If people want criticism, they join forums.

Can't you have both the wisdom and experience in a young package? After all, the kids grow up so fast these days.

It is amazing how much more outspoken people are when not in arms reach.

Of course, people can always take control of your trackball.

I have had some bad experiences and some good ones and to tell the truth I remember the bad ones more. Sales poeple not all expecially in a chain or block store do not seem to take the time to learn about that they are doing to help better provide a service to the customer.

My bad experience at Visions, a Western Canadian chain to which I will never buy something there again (but we won't get into that) was with a 50" plasma. Back a few years ago when the price was still high I went in picked out two modles and was inquiring about them. The sales person tried to fill me with the usual garbel they push until I asked them about a few things that he had no idea. So he went and got the sales manager who didn't know either and took offense to the questions. I said it was not important any way and asked the best price for the TV. He asked if I had been doing some research and I should know a fair price and to make him an offer. I then asked again for a price then he asked me what other prices I had, I told him that I did not want to low ball the competition. He would not let it go or give me a price and demambed to know what I would like to pay and that I had to be serrious about buying. By this time I was pissed and said how about $5 asshole and walked out.

Now the good experiance LOL at a local shop and my truck stereo the sales man wanted to get me to upgade my sub and I said no thanks. He went and got the box and said just take it and put it in when you have time and come back in a month or so. I went back 3 months later..due to work and gave him the $$ differance between the new better sub and my old one. I refer this store all the time to my friends and was looking at buy Paradigms from them.

Later
Phil

Unfortunately, in recent years, I have found dealing with many electronics retailers akin to a similar torture such as "pulling out your fingernails with a pair of pliers"!

I think any of us who are on this forum will know within seconds of talking to someone at a retail store if they have any idea at all what they are talking about. My one piece of advice has "always" been is if the sales person starts knocking equipment they don't sell and obviously know nothing about, turn around and walk out the door!

Actually, from where I sit, I can see it both ways.

The salesperson was disrespectful.

Businesses that do not respect potential customers SHOULD fail.

The nature of this thread reminds me of a situation I had at a Toyota dealer several years ago. I was in the market for a full size pickup truck, but was holding off on my purchase of Silverado because I wanted to see the new (at the time) Tundra. So I went to a Toyota dealer down in Mississauga, naturally the salesman sniffed me out and asked me what I was looking for. I replied I wanted to see the new Tundra(2001) but it looked as if they weren't in yet, which he confirmed. "You looking for a full size truck?" he says...."Yes, I wanted to see it to compare with the other full sized trucks before I make a decision" to which he rather arrogantly says to me.."Is there really any competion for the new Tundra?"

OK!! NOW IT'S OWWN!! I had already read up on the specs for the Tundra from various magazines and articles and also knew the specs on both GM and Ford inside out so I proceded to ask him such questions like why the Toyota had a more "modern" 4 valve engine with a smaller displacement than the GM but got worse mileage and also gave up some 40 hp and similar torque....I then told him I thought the Toyota's brakes were inadequate, as was the towing capacity, payload, cabin room ect ect. He just kind of stood there and didn't say anything.

Anyway, not trying to pick on Toyota here, I've bumped into similar salesmen at Ford and Chev too. I'd much rather have a salesman say something like "Yes, brand 'x' is fine but here's what our brand has to offer..."

i don't

Drink more beer.

This thread is on a roll.

EDIT: Oh crap, did I kill it?

You will.

Do you have a deep sense of loneliness down inside Adrian?

My reaction to salespeople is total distrust. Their interest is to get as much of my money as possible, and mine is to give them as little as possible. I don't dislike them, but our interests are complete opposed. I would never trust anything one said or follow any advice one offered. It's better to deal with an ignorant salesperson than a knowledgeable one, because the ignorant one will not be as good at extracting your money.

Well, I deal a little differently I guess.

I prefer to shop at local stores and talk to people who know what they are talking about. If I feel the sales person helped me out, and knew what they were doing, yes, I will pay extra for that.

If I'm in a local shop and the Sales person gives me that kind of attitude, I make the visit as short as possible and then come back on another day. On the subsequent visit I avoid snotty Salesperson and grab a different on. If SalesPersonB is no good, I don't go back to that store, talk to the manager and tell them why you aren't buying at their store. If SalesPersonB *is* good, I'll buy what I want to buy and let the Manager know that SalesPersonB was genuinely helpful and I bought there because of them.

Learned this with my kids... catch your flies with honey. Reward postive behavior more often than you punish negative behaviour. It works better.

I've also learned that the Managers at FutureShop don't care.

snazzed

I just spit out a tiny bit of coffee at the humorous truth in your last statement. Well Played!

My only choice around here is Best Buy. It is not that the managers / sales people don't care - it is that they don't know anything.

Touche.

Eh, don't sweat it. Buy your Grados online. I did.

The managers at any of the box stores don't care, they are so large to piss someone off just simply doesn't matter.

My buddy bought a Macbook about six months ago, and bought the extended warranty (sigh). Anyway, battery crapped out after about four or five months, Best Buy wouldn't touch it, claimed batteries are not covered. Mind you, this guy is the western Canada regional manager for another very large sporting goods store, so he knows customer relations. Anyway, elevating got him nowhere, so he called Apple. They apologized and had a new battery in his hands in two days.

All BB had to do was make a phone call, and now they've lost a customer.

EDIT: I will add I also work for a substantial company in the online sales business... I HATE that type of customer service with a passion. I just don't understand why someone will piss someone off for a smallish amount of money when if you just make them happy, they will come back and spend more. I think places like Costco may take that attitude a little too far, but that's their business.

Seriously, he bought Best Buy's extended warranty and not Applecare? Yeesh...

Yeah....when I said they don't know anything - I wasn't limiting that to the product - include Customer Service as well. BB has several levels of "store managers". You have to get to the top level of store manager to find any glimmer of caring or intelligence.

BTW.....How old is Marie Osmond?

As I often mention. I had a friend who quit working at a certain Big Box Store from the Future because of the unethical tactics he was being asked to participate in.

Sadly, when you need tech and can't wait for online delivery, it's often my only option. I just make sure I research exactly what I want first before entering the store. That way I can point at the box and avoid all discussion of brighter picture, magic cables or why the item on sale is sooooo much better than what I'm picking.

I really would like to shop local whenever possible, but sometimes the price difference is too great even when dealing with highly reliable internet dealers such as B&H. (I don't go near those low-ball internet dealers that I've never heard of!). I just bought a couple of new cameras from them this morning, and wouldn't really consider buying those from anyone else.

On the other hand, I'm planning on buying two new Hi-Def video cameras in the next couple of weeks, and wouldn't buy THOSE from anyone BUT my local dealer! Well, I COULD buy those from B&H as well, but my local dealer usually gets relatively close on pricing and has benefits like letting me try out a camera for a day at N/C.

I don't feel any loyalty to companies like Best Buy. I don't buy equipment there, save a quick-needed computer part, and they have no depth to their music department, so I don't have much need for them.

In addition to B&H, I don't know if you've dealt with Calumet or Adorama, but I give my approval to both.

I've dealt with Adorama a few times, but have been dealing with Calumet for 30 years, since they were in Chicago only and you could just call and tell them your name and they knew who you were!

I bought Mamiya RB67 and 4x5 stuff from them when I was in high school!

I use Phase One's Capture One software for my raw processing. They've recently made an investment in Mamiya to develop the camera bodies to go with their digital backs. Alas, all I can afford are 35mm DSLRs, I'd love to play with medium format digital.

The medium format stuff was when I was shooting film.... I couldn't justify or afford the digital Hasselblad I would like to play with either!

I miss medium format and large format... something about looking at that big image on the ground glass! It used to be fun to just take off for awhile to do some photography. I don't really do that anymore...

I just ordered a new 5D MKII and 7D, though... they'll be fine this weekend!

There are scan backs for large format digital which can be had for not too much. But they need a view camera, and can't really be used for anything but landscapes (or very slow moving people; maybe sloths).

Cool, you're a Canon shooter. I've just got a lowly 30D, but I'm not a pro. Although, I have made enough money here and there to break about even on my kit.

I was thinking about finding a way to get a 5D MKII, so I could mess with the video side of things too. But it really is a picture camera which shoots video. If I do try my hand a digital video, I think I'll pick up a Red Scarlet, which is a video camera which can also shoot stills.

Hey Phil, which Visions was it? I've found that in general they are pretty good. My extended family and I have had universally good experiences at 2 of their locations, SW Marine in Vancouver, and at the Langley By-Pass.

The King George Surrey, store however, is a nightmare. I had one good experience there and three bad ones. One of the bad ones included their general manager. Never going back to the Surrey store again.

snazzed

lol, I can remember thinking how great that KG store was for car stereo back in high school. I drove past it the other day and laughed because I didn't even think it was still there. I am five minutes from the Langley store so I go there, or AVU in Surrey or Coquitlam.

Mark & Chris,
When I was in college, I bought the new auto camera from Canon the AE1. Bought from a local (now out of business) shop in Winston. Back in the day the AE1 was it. I used it for years - mostly personal but did a couple of weddings for friends. I loaned it out and it came back broken :stupid: and I had a wedding request for my wife's cousin - lots of pressure. I had sent the AE1 out for repair and it was taking forever. As a last resort, I went to another local dealer, Carolina Camera, (now also out of business) all set to buy the "best" camera. I had it in my mind that Nikon was best.

I went mid day in the middle of the week to avoid customers and have full attention of the sales staff. There were several guys and one woman there and I was the only customer. All the guys were canonites and the girl was a nikonite. They were showing me pics of sporting events - the photographers row asking me to count the number of white lenses vs. the number of black lenses. The ratio was high 90's in favor of canon. I kept the scene going, telling them I was not convinced. I had never held an autofocus camera before and I was trying the Canon A2. The Nikon was a 50 or 70? Any way the lead guy challenged me to this test...there was a neon sign hanging in the window. Store was dark compated to the bright sunlight outside. The power cord was hanging from the sign. He told me to focus on the cord 10 times with the Canon and 10 with the Nikon. Whichever nailed the highest percentage on the first attempt each focus - that was the camera I should buy. I still remember the outcome....Nikon 5 of 10....Canon 8 of 10. I bought the Canon. Latest purchase is the 20D - totally happy with it. Like Chris, I have done enough weddings and ad hoc dances/sports photos to pay for the kit - albeit not the better lenses.

I generally mistrust salespeople particularly in the big box stores like Futureshop. They are always trying to pull fast ones. Exaggerating some detail, speaking in absolutes, upselling useless addons.

I do my own research and haggle price that's all. If I don't like what I hear and turn my heel and walk out.

Jennifer Aniston is in her 40's.

i read most of this thread, not all of it... but i don't know if you guys realize or not, but you can not buy B&W's new online. They do not allow any of their resellers to sell their items new online. So the sales persons comment about kicking the tire to buy online is total bull shit.. you cant buy those speakers online.....


I went to spearit sound in Boston, and talked to Leland, he was more than happy to let me listen to anything that i wanted. we talked about quite a bit. They sell B&W there, and that is where i learned that B&W does not allow online selling of their product.

So for her to say that you were just kicking the tires to buy online, is complete B.S. either she has no idea what she is talking about, or she was just being a B!@ch...


I wound up buying some B&W speakers, and to be honest, i enjoy both brands equally.

My vote goes for "just being a B!@ch..".