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#3441 - 06/05/02 12:28 PM Re: Cable match-up to the M60
chesseroo Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 05/13/02
Posts: 4829
Loc: western canada
Ooh the sarcasm abounds in here eh?
_________________________
"Those who preach the myths of audio are ignorant of truth."

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#3442 - 06/05/02 02:05 PM Re: Cable match-up to the M60
CAV104 Offline
veteran

Registered: 04/03/02
Posts: 118
Loc: Lake Worth, FL
Hey Alan,
Glad I could lighten up your day.

CAV104

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#3443 - 06/05/02 02:53 PM Re: Cable match-up to the M60
Randyman Offline
veteran

Registered: 03/29/02
Posts: 184
Loc: Honolulu, Hawaii
Sorry folks I had a typo. Meant to say $650/ft Canadian! (I think that comes out to about $86.75 American!)

CAV104 - I do PM for design and construction projects.


Randyman


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#3444 - 06/05/02 03:41 PM Cable match-up to the M60
Bestboy4 Offline
buff

Registered: 04/15/02
Posts: 45
Loc: Columbia, MD
So you all are telling me that some generic Home Depot wire is as good as enginered speaker wire? I don't think so.

Maybe I didn't explain my question as well as i thought I did. There are some cables out there that can seem bright or warm. Some speakers out there can sound bright or warm. My question then is not about the gauge of the wire. My question is are the axiom m60's bright or forward sounding, and should I buy a cable like the Cardas Quadlink (known for its warm and laid-back sound) to compensate the overall sound in order to make it more neutral?

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#3445 - 06/05/02 05:06 PM Re: Cable match-up to the M60
CAV104 Offline
veteran

Registered: 04/03/02
Posts: 118
Loc: Lake Worth, FL
Hello Bestboy4,
I can only give you my opinion on the 60's, to me they are clean and natural sounding, the bass is tight and the mids, vocals and highs are clear and crisp. They are not an in your face speaker. In so far as the cable selection is concerned, well, whatever floats your boat. While we are on the subject, I would like to know how a length of engineered cable can influence the electrons into a warm and laid-back sound or for that matter, influence or change the characteristics of the electrons after they have departed the source. Anyone care to illustrate and explain.

CAV104

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#3446 - 06/05/02 05:14 PM Re: Cable match-up to the M60
JohnK Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 05/11/02
Posts: 10395
Bestboy, the Axiom speakers do lean in the bright or forward direction, therefore you need a warm cable to compensate. Fortunately there is a simple way to buy this : the red cables are the warm ones.

Seriously, your last post reveals that you appear to have fallen victim to a number of audio mythologies. Your cable decision needs to be based only on something you don't discuss, i.e. the length of the run from amp to speakers. Depending on that length anything from 16ga to 12ga copper wire will allow for full performance at far under$1.00 a foot. Don't allow yourself to be deluded into wasting your money on exotic cables.
_________________________
-----------------------------------

Enjoy the music, not the equipment.



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#3447 - 06/05/02 05:15 PM Re: Cable match-up to the M60
Randyman Offline
veteran

Registered: 03/29/02
Posts: 184
Loc: Honolulu, Hawaii
Bestboy4

My personal experience with the M60s is that they indeed are bright and forward sounding.

When it comes to speaker wire - All joking aside - There are two camps at work here. Those that believe that wire has a sound (or a specific influence on the sound) - and those who believe it doesn't.

If you truly believe that you CAN hear a difference in expensive and/or exotic wite, and the difference is worth the $ to you, then by all means buy it. (otherwise you probably won't be happy) If you will search the posts for the past 2 months you will find info from both Ian and Alan about this subject (and Ian is the one who designs the speakers). Both will tell you that from their double blind testing experiences, they and their listening testors cannot hear any difference between the expensive exotic stuff and good 12 or 14 gage copper wire (the Home Depot or Radio Shack variety).

So, if you want to believe that wire has the ability to make a speaker sound brighter than "normal" or more warm and laid back, then you will probably hear it. (the mind is a marvelous thing!)

Just about everyone who make posts here will have an opinion. If you want mine (and you may not - but here it is anyway) I think that you should aim your energy and $ toward something (like the quality of the source or reproduction equipment) that will make a real difference in the sound you listen to.

Good Luck,

Randyman

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#3448 - 06/05/02 05:19 PM Re: Cable match-up to the M60
chesseroo Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 05/13/02
Posts: 4829
Loc: western canada
If you haven't taken the hints or helpful suggestions yet then let me be blunt.

Very few people in this forum would pay such ridiculous amounts of money for speaker wire and even the OWNER of Axiom has stated that 'regular' speaker wire is fine (gauge is MORE important than brand name).

To quote Mr. Alan Lofft (Axiom resident expert) from several previous notes on this topic:

"Use #12 or #14-gauge copper wire--good, generic cable (Radio Shack is fine) or the bulk cable from Monster if you want... If the cable run is only a few feet or a metre, you can use thinner cable, 16 gauge for example... The only requirement of cables is to keep resistance low over longer cable runs, and that is accomplished with thick copper cable...Good-quality generic cable is fine--just make sure it's thick enough to keep cable resistance to 0.3 ohm or less. You can do that by selecting 14-gauge or 12-gauge cable. (As the gauge number becomes smaller, the cable is thicker.) For example, 22-gauge cable is like telephone wire--very thin. For short runs of cable, 6 to 8 feet or so, you can get away with 16-gauge cable...Others on the boards here will tell you where you can buy inexpensive cable--AR, Recoton, Radio Shack, etc. If you want to use branded cable like Monster, it's okay. The cable is fine but you'll simply pay more for the same copper"

As a biochemist i completely agree with Alan that one company's 99% copper Will NOT be any different from another. Copper is always copper.
If you believe differently well hey, its your money to blow but electrons will still always move at blinding speeds no matter how oxygen free or long stranded it is.

If your ears can actually tell the difference when some of those electrons shift from the p orbital to the s orbitals (using Cardas instead of Radio Shack) then man o man, i hope you work for NASA.

_________________________
"Those who preach the myths of audio are ignorant of truth."

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#3449 - 06/05/02 05:48 PM Re: Cable match-up to the M60
SECfootballFAN Offline
hobbyist

Registered: 05/11/02
Posts: 25
JohnK/Randyman,
You guys crack me up.

I am what many people refer to as "frugal" or "value oriented" and that is why I lurk so much on these boards before a purchase is made. When selecting cables for the system, I chose the generic cables from Home Depot. However, after reading hundreds of posts regarding the subject, even I played it safe with the guage. Following Ian's advice, I purchased 14 guage for all runs under 8 ft. and 12 guage for any runs longer than that. My local Home Depot sells 250 ft. rolls of 12 guage OFC (Oxygen-Free Copper) for only $55.00 USD
How can you beat that?!? You should be able to wire your whole 5.1 system with 250 ft.
Good Luck.....

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#3450 - 06/05/02 06:55 PM Re: Cable match-up to the M60
polara Offline
old hand

Registered: 05/19/02
Posts: 64
as they say theres a sucker born every minute
some day you might see its all marketing
ive talked to a lot of electrical engineers and none have ever said otherwise
but what can i say some people believe in santa till ther 35 years old

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