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Re: Just got the QSC and here's what happened!
SRoode #348152 05/14/11 10:53 PM
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I stand by my previous advice.

Originally Posted By: me

My suggestion is that you return the M80s and just buy something else since your initial hesitation and this experience have likely tainted your opinion of them to the point that if you do get them working properly cognitive dissonance will stop you from wanting to keep them.


http://www.axiomaudio.com/boards/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=346826#Post346826


3M80 2M22 6QS8 2M2 1EP500 Sony BDP-S590 Panny-7000 Onkyo-3007 Carada-134 Xbox Buttkicker AS-EQ1
Re: Just got the QSC and here's what happened!
grunt #348154 05/14/11 11:04 PM
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My only criticism of bobt is his spelling... and an apparent reluctance to take the rational path (verify) instead of the most expensive path (don't bother identifying the problem, just throw money at it).

bobt, do you work for the government?


Enjoy the Music. Trust your ears. Laugh at Folks Who Claim to Know it All.
Re: Just got the QSC and here's what happened!
2x6spds #348155 05/14/11 11:36 PM
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Once again, LMAO..I used to fix large computer systems..well awear of how to trouble shoot problems. I felt no need to subject my old Onkyo to the problem, which these speakers seem to have had. And they do! You don't like my method...too bad.
Don't like my spelling..well...again..to bad. There seems to be something you don't get....the wires came off the speakers after they were here. If that is something you don't get..sorry.

I pulled an old vintage amp, and replaced it with a new amp, that can handle(stated) a 4 ohm load and not blow up. Very simple..what is it you don't get? If i worked for a computer company..i would not care if i blew up the old amp..but since it's mine and vintage..I pulled it from the equation. Period.

Re: Just got the QSC and here's what happened!
bobt #348156 05/14/11 11:53 PM
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I hope you are not yelling at me, because I have been nothing but courteous to you and hopefully helpful. I am only suggesting that it is not worth spending the $100+ on shipping to send these speakers back and get nothing in return when they are under warranty and will be repaired for nothing.

The vintage Onkyo M-504 is not extremely valuable anyway:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ONKYO-M504-AMPLIFIER-/220781655768?pt=Receivers_Tuners&hash=item33679cb6d8

You can pick them up for about $300.

Now, if you do not like the sound of your speakers, that's a different story.


LFR1100 Actives,QS10HPx2,QS8x2,EP800,M3x4,M3x2 (Wood),M5HPx2 (Wood),AxiomAir,ADA1500-8,ADA1500-7
Re: Just got the QSC and here's what happened!
SRoode #348157 05/15/11 12:09 AM
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I'm not yelling at anybody...altho some people on here think i did not take there advice on trouble shooting a problem. Which is NOT correct. I did to a point. If they don't like the path i selected..so be it. Again, i have nothing bad to say about the Axioms...so i'm not sure what the problem is, or why selected people would like to continue to degrade me.

The speakers either work or they don't. For me, they did not, enough said.

Re: Just got the QSC and here's what happened!
bobt #348159 05/15/11 12:26 AM
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That's all that needs to be said, really. I totally understand being unimpressed by the whole situation. I've had my share of issues with Axiom products, but thankfully I started with a very smooth experience when I first got my M80s. Issues only came with later purchases, and by then I was addicted to the Axiom experience. As far as resolutions to my issues, Axiom has been phenomenal, by far the best end results I've encountered in any customer service. While I think there's currently room for improvement in turn-around time and communication, at least I know I'll be taken care of in the end. That's worth a lot to me. However, going back to how I began the paragraph, I'm on board with your frustration. That's just not how it's supposed to go.

Re: Just got the QSC and here's what happened!
CV #348168 05/15/11 12:43 AM
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I hope the next car, tv, mower, etc. you buy Bob doesn't have issues. It is unfortunate you had your issues, and most of us that have been friends of the Axiom company for a long time know they will bend over backward for their customers. I admit, what you experienced is very unusual, and keep in mind most of us are techies to and are familiar with working with a variety of electronics. I myself do HP certified repair for my company, and have built more pc's for people than I can count.

When someone has issues and decides to post on the forums about the problems they are having, it is assumed they are looking for feedback and help on resolving the issue. I will appologize for myself if I came across in a negative manner, but I hope you understand it seemed you didn't want to hear what we had to say.

Audio is a hobby for all of us, and many of us have had equipment going back a long time, your not the only one with vintage equipment.

Anyway, wish you well and hope things work out in the future whatever you decide.


M80s VP180 4xM22ow 4xM3ic EP600 2xEP350
AnthemAVM60 Outlaw7700 EmoA500 Epson5040UB FluanceRT85


Re: Just got the QSC and here's what happened!
bobt #348196 05/15/11 03:40 AM
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Originally Posted By: bobt
so are you guys, just willing to fix NEW speakers all the time???


Hmmm.... Mine have worked perfectly since the day I bought them over 6 years ago. Mine were B Stock too.


Farewell - June 4, 2020
Re: Just got the QSC and here's what happened!
bdpf #348199 05/15/11 04:14 AM
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Originally Posted By: bdpf
I'm just wondering how many speakers he's gonna try and how many problems he's gonna run into before he finds what he wants.

Originally Posted By: bobt
Your stupid comments about how many speakers i will try is useless, i tried these, because of the price point. Period.

There is nothing stupid about my comment. I commented about how many speakers you're gonna try because what I understand from everything that you've posted is that you're basically looking for a speaker that is detailed and accurate in the mids and highs but also emphasized (= not accurate) the bass which was what the woofers of your Polks were giving you (probably typical on most speakers from the 80s), speakers that can handle SPL levels to put you depth and all of this for a relative cheap price. Well let me tell you, you're gonna have a hell of a time finding them. Now regarding my comment about how many problems you're gonna run into, well you might have been a very lucky person by never having any problem. From my experience, on everything you buy you'll find something wrong if you look deep enough in 20/30% of the cases (or maybe I'm just unlucky).
Originally Posted By: bobt
I used to fix large computer systems..well awear of how to trouble shoot problems.

I have to admit that that came out of a surprise to me. As someone who designs and troubleshoot electronics for living, I don't quite understand your "troubleshooting" method. You have a simple equation:
A (M80s) + B (Onkyo) = C (Sound)
You have a problem with C, you know that B works fine with your other speakers and from what other people in this forum tell you (people obviously more knowledgeable than you) it should work reasonably well with A, so the "logic" way is to troubleshoot A which is what 90% of the people told you. You as an experienced troubleshooter decide to bring another variable into the equation D (QSC) so now you have a new equation to solve:
A (M80s) + D (QSC) = C (Sound)
The result of your troubleshooting is A has a problem.
Bob, I'm not sure I would have had my computer repaired at your place.
Originally Posted By: bobt
altho some people on here think i did not take there advice on trouble shooting a problem. Which is NOT correct.

Really, let me just go through a few extracts of you previous thread:
Originally Posted By: ClubNeon
At what level were you playing? Try a lower volume setting. It shouldn't go into protect unless it is pretty loud, any amp should be able to do 4 Ohms at lower levels.But first, check your wiring. It's more likely that there is a short somewhere. Look for one strand out of place on one end or the other. Second, try one speaker at a time. Just in case there is an internal defect.

Originally Posted By: bobt
The Onkyo just dose not like 4 ohm loads...pretty much. There is no other reason for the amp to shut down, It has never done that in 20 years

Originally Posted By: MarkSJohnson
Really, I still think something is wrong. There aren't many amps that can't drive the M80s at moderate levels.

Originally Posted By: bobt
Well this is a 1980's amp. Probably never made to do 4 ohm loads.It works great for 6 ohms as what the Polks are. But 4 ...it dose NOT like. There is nothing wrong with the setup...I've run this for 20 years. I double checked everything. Its basically the amp dose not like the 4 ohm load..period.

Here is how you troubleshoot:
Originally Posted By: bobt
what i did find was 1 guy who said...dose NOT work for 4 ohm stuff. Which now i beleive 100%.

Some more advice shall we?
Originally Posted By: bdpf
Few people have suggested that there might be a problem with the speaker itself, maybe you should investigate that route before investing on another amp.

Originally Posted By: tomtuttle
Try driving ONE speaker on one channel. Then, try that same speaker on the OTHER channel. Then, do the same sequence for the other speaker.

Originally Posted By: bobt
Tom....I hope the hell not. The amp has been perfect for 20 years. I'm not going to try the m80's any more. I'll throw the old Advents on it...make sure it kicks ass.

Originally Posted By: bdpf
A few people suggested for you to check the drivers to take the speakers out of the equation but I didn't see a reply that you did, it might be something wrong with them or not, but worth to have a look.

Originally Posted By: JohnK
As others have said, an intermittent short somewhere in the wiring appears to be a more likely problem. This might even be internal wiring in one of the M80s, so as Tom suggested, try driving then one at a time to see if only one of them causes a shutdown.

Originally Posted By: bobt
The problem would be i'm not about to blow up the amp..to see if the speakers have a problem. I could check 1 speaker at a time...but again.. i have to run it till the amp shuts down. Not my Fav thing to do...as i could blow up the amp doing this.

I'm not even gonna go to the discussion that people had to try to explain to you that the amp was shutting down to protect itself and therefore there is nothing to blow cause it's just a lost cause...
Originally Posted By: SRoode
Tom's idea of trying the speakers one at a time is very valid. There may be a problem with one of the speakers, and that test would root it out.

OK, I'm only at page 6 and there is 15 pages, I'm just getting tired of copy/paste the same thing overe and over again. Does that seem like you're following advices? What was the problem in the end?
Originally Posted By: sirquack
I will appologize for myself if I came across in a negative manner, but I hope you understand it seemed you didn't want to hear what we had to say.

Contrary to Randy, I'm not apologizing as I feel I have never been rude or disrespectful towards you. The opposite cannot be said as you just called me stupid. I'm just amazed in your persistence in rejecting good advice when obviously you don't know what you're talking about.
Originally Posted By: bobt
The speakers either work or they don't. For me, they did not, enough said.

This part, I (and I'm sure most people who gave you advice on this forum) agree with. After having the problems you had, some people (like you) would return the speakers, some people (like me) would just take another 5 min, replace the driver and end up with a good working speaker at a good price, there is no right or wrong, both are valid options. And in case you think I'm talking out of my a$$ and I never had problems I'll point you to this thread in case you want to read it:
http://www.axiomaudio.com/boards/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=334432&page=3
Even though I had to go through the frustration and the headache, in the end I'm glad I did cause now I have a perfectly working system that I truly enjoy and I couldn't be happier, so for me it was worth it, for you it might not.
In the end, the best advice is Dean's
Originally Posted By: grunt

My suggestion is that you return the M80s and just buy something else since your initial hesitation and this experience have likely tainted your opinion of them to the point that if you do get them working properly cognitive dissonance will stop you from wanting to keep them.

and I'll wish you again what I wished a few posts earlier
Originally Posted By: bdpf
Good luck to you in finding what you're looking for.



Bruno
M80s/VP180/QS8s/EP600/AVR-890
------------------------------------
"The problem is choice..."
Re: Just got the QSC and here's what happened!
bdpf #348244 05/15/11 05:49 PM
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+1


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