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#400101 - 01/15/14 02:36 PM Re: M80HP [Re: Socketman]
pmbuko Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 04/02/03
Posts: 16273
Loc: Leesburg, Virginia
Socketman, JohnK is not implying you are an idiot. Another interpretation of his statement is this: Your senses can't be trusted, as has been shown time and time again. In the absence of information to convince them otherwise, most people -- yes, even non-idiots -- will believe their senses.

The fact is, we do have better information about how humans perceive sound. Research has shown that -- and may I point out that acoustic research is performed with equipment that is far more sensitive than human ears -- any break-in that occurs happens very quickly during the first minute that the speaker has ever played. Any changes beyond that are not detectable by the human ear.

It has also shown that adults with average hearing also experience sound in the same way, so a possible defense of "I probably hear differently than you" usually do not hold up.

No need to be defensive. John's dry, clinical posting style is just trying to pass on the facts as he knows them.
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#400103 - 01/15/14 02:58 PM Re: M80HP [Re: brwsaw]
gjtphx Offline
regular

Registered: 02/20/13
Posts: 9
Loc: Phoenix, AZ
My M80HP’s were delivered last Monday and I immediately hooked them up and did a quick audyssey calibration. I upgraded to these new speakers from M60v2 that were seven years old. I am powering them with an Emotiva XPA-2. When I started listening to them the quick difference I could feel was more bass. Apart from that I could not feel much difference. I hope that the speakers will sound better after the so called “break-in” period.

I have a 7.1 setup with these new speakers along with a VP-160, 4 QS8’s and one SVS SB-13 Ultra Sub. The QS8’s and VP-160 are powered by Emotiva XPA-5. I am using a Denon 3312ci as processor.
_________________________
2 M80 HP, 1 VP160 & 4 QS8
Emotiva XPA-2, XPA-5
Denon 3312ci
Oppo BDP-103
Onkyo C-7030
Arcam irDAC

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#400104 - 01/15/14 03:04 PM Re: M80HP [Re: Socketman]
BlueJays1 Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 09/19/08
Posts: 4078
Loc: Porch,enjoying Bombay Sapphire
Originally Posted By: Socketman
Originally Posted By: JohnK
Yes, speaker "break-in", to the extent that it's sometimes claimed to exist is largely nonsense. Periods of use requiring weeks or even months are promoted occasionally and it's been said that "break-in was invented so that we couldn't return anything"! An initial permanent break-in which would take no more than a minute or so(and often would take place in factory testing before being shipped)would show a measurable "loosening" of the driver. Every time a speaker is turned off it partially reverts over a period toward its unused state, but this immediately returns to the "broken-in" state a second or so after being turned on again.

Dr. Toole and others point out the lack of any long term audible changes(in blind listening tests)which can be observed. This may be fortunate. I now have about 30,000 hours on my M22s and if some long-term changes were occurring they certainly would have reached the optimum point long ago and now would be well into a period of deteriorating performance. Instead they continue to sound identically excellent as they did when I fired them up with "The Planets" when first received.



I will take real world experience every time. Watch this Video made by Andrew Welker ,and a 3.54 you will hear Andrew explain the frequency sweep used, and the sweep does not move the drivers appreciably. Your response, no matter how eloquent,implies that people who hear a difference are idiots and that is not the case.

Richard



IMO I think any changes to the driver occur because of the rise in the VC temperature more than the actual physical excursion of the drive-unit.

But its been shown in tests that the driver parameters after the signal is turned off and the VC is left to cool back to its room temperature state, the changes in the T/S parameters are negligible. Unless of course you push the VC temperature so high to the point it permanently destroys the drive unit.
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#400107 - 01/15/14 04:05 PM Re: M80HP [Re: Powell8]
Socketman Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 07/12/09
Posts: 1189
Loc: Whitehorse YT
Originally Posted By: Powell8
Now that was a series of responses! Thanks to all, the speakers are approximately 4 hours away from delivery (yes, the OCD kicked in and I tracked them). I will see if I notice any changes over the time from when I initially use them. Unless Axiom does another worthwhile upgrade, I will be listening to these, however they sound, pre and post "break-in".


Here is what you do.Hook em up, listen to them for 10 seconds then put that song on a replay and leave the house for 3 days then come back and see if they sound different. Oh shit that wont work, our sonic memory Is useless . I guess best thing to do is just hook em up and enjoy them, that's the best way In my opinion.

Enjoy and yeah its ok to track them, but no more than evey 10 minutes. smile
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#400112 - 01/15/14 06:16 PM Re: M80HP [Re: brwsaw]
brwsaw Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 10/12/12
Posts: 1017
My update confirms a weeks wait until they ship.
I hate to do it but I'm torn between waiting and cancelling.
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#400113 - 01/15/14 06:39 PM Re: M80HP [Re: brwsaw]
Socketman Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 07/12/09
Posts: 1189
Loc: Whitehorse YT
you cant quit now. That would be such a let down, why would you even consider doing this. ?? Hang in there, there is a lesson in this for you gwasshoppah
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DOG is GOD spelled backwards.
I blame my terseness on my keyboard. smile

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#400114 - 01/15/14 07:06 PM Re: M80HP [Re: brwsaw]
JBG Offline
devotee

Registered: 06/14/02
Posts: 406
I'm just so curious on the audio differences between the M80's v3 and the M80HP...

keep us posted !
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#400118 - 01/15/14 08:14 PM Re: M80HP [Re: Socketman]
Powell8 Offline
frequent flier

Registered: 12/03/13
Posts: 14
Originally Posted By: Socketman
Originally Posted By: Powell8
Now that was a series of responses! Thanks to all, the speakers are approximately 4 hours away from delivery (yes, the OCD kicked in and I tracked them). I will see if I notice any changes over the time from when I initially use them. Unless Axiom does another worthwhile upgrade, I will be listening to these, however they sound, pre and post "break-in".


Here is what you do.Hook em up, listen to them for 10 seconds then put that song on a replay and leave the house for 3 days then come back and see if they sound different. Oh shit that wont work, our sonic memory Is useless . I guess best thing to do is just hook em up and enjoy them, that's the best way In my opinion.

Enjoy and yeah its ok to track them, but no more than evey 10 minutes. smile


Hmmm, interesting premise. Don't think my wife would enjoy King Crimson on replay, nor would any of the neighborhood animals. I did cut the tracking down to hourly. If they came one day later, would have been 4 months! UPS carried them into the house whereupon wifey texts to say they were here. Packing the M60's for return ought to be fun, the boxes look pretty beat up. Ducktape.


Edited by Powell8 (01/15/14 08:15 PM)

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#400119 - 01/15/14 08:23 PM Re: M80HP [Re: brwsaw]
Socketman Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 07/12/09
Posts: 1189
Loc: Whitehorse YT
Glad to hear they arrived safely, i look forward to your impressions once you have settled in and had time to listen to them. That's pretty good service from UPS, good thing I doubt your wife would want to pack them. We don't have decent delivery folk here. When I got my M80's they came greyhound from Edmonton, that's as far as ups goes. Then greyhound lost one of them, I damn near went off the deep end lol. I had to go to the van and carry them in myself. Best buy shipped my 60 inch LG and freight company would only bring it to the door, from there it was all mine.

BTW I was just being silly about 3 day break in. Maybe it is just psychological. There seems to be a split right down the middle as far as opinion goes , c'est la vie.
_________________________
DOG is GOD spelled backwards.
I blame my terseness on my keyboard. smile

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#400120 - 01/15/14 08:28 PM Re: M80HP [Re: brwsaw]
brwsaw Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 10/12/12
Posts: 1017
Seems time keeps dragging on.
When December 20th was given as the ship date I asked to delay it until after the Christmas freight rush.
I wrongly assumed they would still be produced
and would be ready to ship once requested.
I was told last week they should be ready for Friday and if not Monday.
Yesterdays inquiry says another week before shipping.
I guess I'm a little disappointed with my own decision to delay the shipment. Again, not realizing it meant delaying production for a month.
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