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#401722 - 03/07/14 10:18 PM ADA-1000 for M22 on-wall 5.1 setup?
Phaedrus Offline
regular

Registered: 03/07/14
Posts: 5
Hello, I'm looking for some advice on what amplifier to get.

Last year I upgraded to the M22 on-walls, VP150 on-wall center, and QS8 surrounds. This year I'd like to add a separate power amp in order to get the most out of it.

Right now I'm using a Yamaha RX-A2010 AV receiver, which thus far has been excellent, but is limited in power output as any AV receiver is.

I think the ADA-1000 configured for 5 channels should be adequate, am I right?

The M22's are rated as a max of 200 watts, which the ADA-1000 should put out per channel at 4ohms, which the receiver is set to. Does that sound right? Will I notice a difference with the added power?

Here's a pic of my setup. The on-walls may not be the biggest and best, they sure do look slick.

Thanks in advance. smile


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#401723 - 03/07/14 11:25 PM Re: ADA-1000 for M22 on-wall 5.1 setup? [Re: Phaedrus]
JohnK Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 05/11/02
Posts: 10412
Phae, welcome to Axiom. Amplification doesn't work the way you seem to think. Any amplifier, including those in receivers, isn't limited in power output to any greater extent than its official output rating. In the case of your 2010 that's at least 140 watts per channel. The Axioms are of average sensitivity and use about 1 watt at a comfortably loud average output level. Brief peaks use much more of course, but not likely anything that your 2010 can't handle with ease. So, power wise you're already getting the "most" out of your speakers(unless you're considering extreme loudness levels damaging to your hearing). A separate amplifier with a higher maximum output capability can't do anything but add the ability to sustain a louder listening level or to provide more "headroom" for brief peaks. But as I've pointed out many times, if sufficient headroom already exists, unused headroom is simply that: unused.
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#401724 - 03/07/14 11:35 PM Re: ADA-1000 for M22 on-wall 5.1 setup? [Re: Phaedrus]
Socketman Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 07/12/09
Posts: 1215
Loc: Whitehorse YT
@Phaedrus

While john is very pragmatic I on the other hand am more Tim Allen grin . I don't let anyone tell me what I may or may not hear. I say get it and if you don't like it I believe you have 30 days to return it though I doubt you will. I use 2 Emotiva amps and if anyone wants them they will have to pry them from my cold dead hands. I like Ian's motto, you cant have too much power.
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I blame my terseness on my keyboard. smile

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#401726 - 03/08/14 12:26 AM Re: ADA-1000 for M22 on-wall 5.1 setup? [Re: Phaedrus]
brwsaw Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 10/12/12
Posts: 1130
If you party with them there is the chance you'll use the power.
I agree with both Johnk and Socketman. If you're not using it you may want to consider a second sub on a differnt upgrade.If you do like loud music (out of room listening, party now and then, etc) you'll be happy with the amp.
I have a 1000-4 and think I've used it to its potential once to date, the one and only time my speakers have sounded strained (crazy loud).
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#401734 - 03/08/14 07:30 AM Re: ADA-1000 for M22 on-wall 5.1 setup? [Re: Phaedrus]
Ken.C Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 05/03/03
Posts: 17809
Loc: NoVA
I think there's a few more things that need to be cleared up.

1. Do not set your receiver for 4 ohm operation. Ever. All that does is limit the power from the receiver to comply with certification standards and doing it could actually damage your speakers due to receiver clipping.

2. Since none of your speakers are 4 ohm, you should not set your receiver to 4 ohm. The impedance rating comes from speakers, not amplifiers.

3. Max wattage on speakers is not really relevant. It's a recommendation, but too many people put too much emphasis on it. Speakers do not require a specific wattage nor do they immediately explode or otherwise fail if presented with more than that number. (unless it's a LOT more than that number...)
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#401741 - 03/08/14 10:00 AM Re: ADA-1000 for M22 on-wall 5.1 setup? [Re: Ken.C]
MarkSJohnson Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 09/27/04
Posts: 10965
Loc: Central NH
Thanks for posting that, Ken. You hit all the points that I wanted to make and saved me lots of typing!

Phaedrus, if you're thinking that there are limitations with your receiver, you've likely been imposing them yourself with that "4 Ohm" setting!

Welcome to the forum, BTW.
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#401759 - 03/08/14 02:32 PM Re: ADA-1000 for M22 on-wall 5.1 setup? [Re: Phaedrus]
Phaedrus Offline
regular

Registered: 03/07/14
Posts: 5
I knew I'd get some quick replies. Thanks for posting!

1. I'll double check if I'm set to 4 ohms or not and report back. It's been a while since I set it up. I could be mistaken. I did do a lot of reading at the time on these forums when I set it, so I thought I had set it properly. (just checked and it's set at 8 ohms. I recall my reading now.)

2. The Yamaha is rated to 140W with only 2 channels driven. I'm guessing that drops quite a bit with all 5 driven, no?

3. I do listen fairly loudly. Mostly blu rays and gaming, so there's usually a lot going on in all channels.

4. Given this information, do you still think further amplification won't be worth while?

Thanks again.

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#401761 - 03/08/14 02:43 PM Re: ADA-1000 for M22 on-wall 5.1 setup? [Re: Phaedrus]
Socketman Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 07/12/09
Posts: 1215
Loc: Whitehorse YT
I found this from a past review by HomeTheater Guide before they became Sound & Vision. The are one of the few mags that actually test power into more than 2 channels.

Output at clipping (1 kHz into 8/4 ohms)

• 1 channel driven: 187/268 W (22.7/24.3 dBW)

• 5 channels driven (8 ohms): 62 W (17.9 dBW)

• 7 channels driven (8 ohms): 60 W(17.8 dBW)

Distortion at 1 watt (THD+N, 1 kHz)

• 8/4 ohms: 0.02/0.02%

Noise level (A-wtd): –75.1 dB



My vote is , get the amp. As I said you can return it but I highly doubt you will.
_________________________
DOG is GOD spelled backwards.
I blame my terseness on my keyboard. smile

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#401773 - 03/08/14 06:45 PM Re: ADA-1000 for M22 on-wall 5.1 setup? [Re: Socketman]
Wid Offline
axiomite

Registered: 06/22/03
Posts: 6722
Loc: The Peoples Republic of Il.
Originally Posted By: Socketman




My vote is , get the amp. As I said you can return it but I highly doubt you will.


I agree, I've always said buy as much power as you can afford.
_________________________
Rick


"A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity." Sigmund Freud


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#401779 - 03/08/14 10:05 PM Re: ADA-1000 for M22 on-wall 5.1 setup? [Re: Phaedrus]
JohnK Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 05/11/02
Posts: 10412
Your use of "only" 2 channels driven indicates that you may not fully grasp the significance of the amplifier power ratings. 2 channels driven(at full rated power for at least 5 continuous minutes)is the basic requirement set by law(Federal Trade Commission regulations)for the ratings(a 1 channel rating doesn't comply). The FTC explicitly rejected a suggestion to make the requirement all channels driven, finding simultaneous full power in all channels to be unrealistic in home use.

Blu-rays and gaming certainly do have things going on in all channels at times, but this isn't at full power in all and the 2-channel FTC rating is the more realistic one overall.

The quoted portions of the 2010 review were actually done by Sound&Vision's Dan Kumin(not Home Theater Magazine)some months before the merger of the two under the Sound&Vision title. The numbers shown there on the lab test with 2-channels driven were 161 watts into 8 ohms and 255 into 4 ohms.

Listening distance is a key factor in power calculations and from your picture it appears that you're operating in fairly close quarters. There's nothing to indicate that unless you'd like to employ listening levels that would cause permanent hearing damage that the rather substantial capability of the 2010 isn't ample for your needs. You've stated that it's been "excellent" and there's no good reason to suspect that this would mysteriously change. Purchase of an additional amplifier with unneeded excess capacity isn't economically sensible.
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Enjoy the music, not the equipment.



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