Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Stereo What is Loud?

I'm very close to buying a pair of m80's. After much research - both reading and hearing - and also considering my budget - I believe they're a good match for me, and I won't have any regrets.

My question is this: Where are the BIG speakers? Does anyone make BIG speakers for home audio anymore? I'm replacing my 30+ year old Altec Voice of the Theaters - which aren't all THAT bad, but they do have their troubles. One thing they have no trouble with is filling a room - or a house, actually - with sound. Big sound. Yes, they have an "uneven response," and get muddy now and again, but one thing's for sure. It's LOUD. So, I'm asking - how can I expect a physically small specimen to compare? What are the compromises? Why are large speakers practically nonexistent? When I want LOUD, I mean, HAVE TO STAND OUTSIDE TO PREVENT INJURY kinda loud. Did I mention I'd like GOOD sound too? Thanks for any wisdom you can throw my way!

Your ears will bleed and you'll go deaf before the M80ti's break a sweat. Thuderous bass should be handled by a good subwoofer, regardless of what speakers you end up with. The new EP500 and EP600 subs are up to the task. (As is the VTF-3 MKII from Hsu)

Exactly. The big change is that HT has driven the adoption of subwoofers for the deepest bass, so everything else can be handled by a medium size speaker.

If you have M80s and a big honkin' sub (or two) you are going to have the same kind of SPLs as Voice of the Theaters plus at least an extra octave of deep bass AND scarily accurate response. The only change is that the bottom couple of octaves have been pulled out into a specialized (and still BIG) subwoofer.

The horn-loaded speakers were great for efficiency but the horns tended to emphasize some frequencies over others... I never even heard anyone succeed in EQ'ing VOT's to get the same kind of flat response as a conventional speaker.

You might want to PM Dennis (Tharkun on this board) and talk to him about loud. He runs a 7.1 system with 5 M80s and 2 EP600s and seems to be able to run at literally dangerous SPLs with totally clean sound.

I normally run at 85-90 dB when I'm playing "loud"... I know Dennis runs way over 100 dB and I imagine 110dB+ is more like it when the guests have gone home. A few people here have checked out the system and have pronounced it utterly clean at ear-bleeding levels.

Oops - I should have mentioned I have an SVS PC+20-39.

OK, so you know what's going on then. Cabinets and drivers have gotten a bit smaller but more rigid and give better frequency response and less distortion. Efficiency is down but big-ass power amps are the norm (525W continuous in your sub) and make up for the lower efficiency to give the same SPLs you used to see with VOTTs.

No joke, you might end up needing 2 of the SVS PC+ to keep up with M80s in a large room. I have M60s and the same 20-39PC+ (real nice, isn't it ?) and in my current room that combination will play WAY louder than I want.

Of course the other option is to get another pair of VOTTs... Altec put them back into production recently, $4,300 US each :

http://www.alteclansing.com/legacy/specs.asp

Note that the A7 is a few dB more efficient than the M80 but the M80 can handle twice the power (and apparently is very conservatively rated) so the result is about the same SPL in practice although you do need a bigger amp for the M80s.

Man, those are some humongous speakers. You could literally line your living room walls with m60s for $8600.

BR,
Wow! You have those things in your livingroom?
Geeezzz, aren't those the speakers that The Dead used about 300 of to make their "Wall of Sound" system back in '76 or '77?
Man, your WFA Factor must be off the charts!
TjB

>>Man, those are some humongous speakers

They're not that much bigger than an M80 duct-taped to an EP600

I can see it now :

Tharkun vs. Beethoven Rocks. In this corner, finished in a dull but rugged grey coat, the champion for over 50 years, Voice of the Theater. In the other corner, resplendent in Boston Cherry and Oak, backed by 2700 watts of Halo amplification, the tag team of Axiom M80 and EP600. Ladies avert your eyes. Gentlement place your bets.

Hearing protection must be worn. Eye protection recommended. No children or animals allowed. All beverages must be in plastic containers, no glass allowed due to the possibility of exploding containers. Waiver must be signed before admittance.

If you want big, room filling sound before you get to blistering SPL, you need to go with a larger speaker as Bridgman suggests.

Wow, the 15" driver looks positively tiny in that enclosure.

One thing I should mention lest I give the wrong impression. An M80 alone should be able to play in the same space as a VOTT if the tone settings are left flat... where the big drivers shine IIRC is when you start cranking the bass boost up a bit. The big drivers can handle bass boost without hitting their excursion limits, while the smaller woofers in modern speakers will start to complain. This is just hypothesis -- I have not had a chance to actually HEAR an M80 against a "classic" larger speaker -- but I think it's a pretty safe bet.

If you want boosted bass at high volumes that's where the big sub starts to shine, in addition to its primary role of playing lower notes than a conventional speaker can handle.

BR, if you decide to try M80s and do a comparison against the VOTTs I imagine a lot of people here would be interested in coming over and watching. You might even get Ian out for something like that