Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion The Water Cooler WoW! THAT is LOUD!

OK,
After reading plenty of posts about how loud some folks here listen to their music, I decided to get out the RatShack meter and see what I considered loud.
Geeezzz!
75 dB 0r 80 is what we would consider "Cranked" in our room.
85 was the highest I could go for any length of time.
90-95 was just insane.
And there are people who talk about regularly listening at those levels, right?
I'm not missing something here, am I?
95 dB at the listening position is 95 dB regardless of the room, right?
That's Really Loud.

Tom, I'm with you. When I discuss amplifier power and often point out that 1 watt or less is used for a "comfortably loud" average listening level, I'm talking about somewhere near 80dB. Brief peaks might hit 100dB or a bit more, but using 90dB plus levels for continuous listening is dangerous to hearing.

I know some people that listen with 95dB peaks(without sub) and I think it is CRAZY.....that is supposedly the Dolby reference level peaks.

There is NO way I can handle that for a long period of time. I think I must be listening at about 80-85dB peaks when I have things good and loud.

Decibel (Loudness) Comparison Chart
Here are some interesting numbers, collected from a variety of sources, that help one to understand the volume levels of various sources and how they can affect our hearing.

Environmental Noise

Weakest sound heard 0dB
Normal conversation (3-5') 60-70dB
Telephone dial tone 80dB
City Traffic (inside car) 85dB
Train whistle at 500' 90dB
Subway train at 200' 95dB
Level at which sustained exposure may result in hearing loss 90 - 95dB
Power mower 107dB
Power saw 110dB
Pain begins 125dB
Pneumatic riveter at 4' 125dB
Jet engine at 100' 140dB
Death of hearing tissue 180dB
Loudest sound possible 194dB

OSHA Daily Permissible Noise Level Exposure
Hours per day Sound level
8 90dB
6 92dB
4 95dB
3 97dB
2 100dB
1.5 102dB
1 105dB
.5 110dB
.25 or less 115dB


Perceptions of Increases in Decibel Level
Imperceptible Change 1dB
Barely Perceptible Change 3dB
Clearly Noticeable Change 5dB
About Twice as Loud 10dB
About Four Times as Loud 20dB


Sound Levels of Music
Normal piano practice 60 -70dB
Fortissimo Singer, 3' 70dB
Chamber music, small auditorium 75 - 85dB
Piano Fortissimo 84 - 103dB
Violin 82 - 92dB
Cello 85 -111dB
Oboe 95-112dB
Flute 92 -103dB
Piccolo 90 -106dB
Clarinet 85 - 114dB
French horn 90 - 106dB
Trombone 85 - 114dB
Tympani & bass drum 106dB
Walkman on 5/10 94dB
Symphonic music peak 120 - 137dB
Amplifier rock, 4-6' 120dB
Rock music peak 150dB


NOTES:

One-third of the total power of a 75-piece orchestra comes from the bass drum.
High frequency sounds of 2-4,000 Hz are the most damaging. The uppermost octave of the piccolo is 2,048-4,096 Hz.
Aging causes gradual hearing loss, mostly in the high frequencies.
Speech reception is not seriously impaired until there is about 30 dB loss; by that time severe damage may have occurred.
Hypertension and various psychological difficulties can be related to noise exposure.
The incidence of hearing loss in classical musicians has been estimated at 4-43%, in rock musicians 13-30%.
Statistics for the Decibel (Loudness) Comparison Chart were taken from a study by Marshall Chasin , M.Sc., Aud(C), FAAA, Centre for Human Performance & Health, Ontario, Canada. There were some conflicting readings and, in many cases, authors did not specify at what distance the readings were taken or what the musician was actually playing. In general, when there were several readings, the higher one was chosen.

Well, it depends what you have pushing your speakers. 85db will sound different on an entry level to moderate priced receiver, due to distortion, than it will with a higher-end receiver or a separate amp. I'm sure that anyone here who has upgraded to separate amps can tell the difference when listening to movies or music at the same volume level they used with a receiver. I know with every receiver I have used, when playing music at 80-85 db's, my ears would fatigue after a short while of listening; but with a good amp, playing at the same level or higher, the sound is clean clear and smooth. At least that has been my experience.

He's talking straight SPL here... whether it's a jackhammer, music, or engine, it's the same scale.

Seabear, I'm with you. At some point at those higher levels - my ears, at least, "lose fidelity" - above about 90 dB SPL, the line begins to blur between detailed HT speakers and horn-loaded bar speakers... all the additional vibration of the various parts of your head cavity... the overloading of the cochlea - becomes like doing wine tasting in a room full of methane.

Bren R.

95 dB to you is not the same as it is for me.

In this area, I have bad allergies. Everything's fine except the fluid in my ears.. on the rare occasion that my ears pop and it's gone, I cover my ears due to how loud everything around me is, if I'm in a "loud" area, it's a shock. My normal listening level(I'm only on headphones now, though) would probably measure up 90-95 dB, which to you would sound like your 75-85.

You're right Bren. Thank you for clarifying.

Thasp: Very true. A little fluid in the ears, develop a little otitis, and can affect the sound you hear without you even knowing.

Seabear,

Nope, you aren't missing anything. Levels of 85 dB SPL at your listening position are plenty loud, and when you up that by 10 dB (which we hear as "twice as loud"), 95 dB SPL is very loud. I've only once measured a brief orchestral peak greater than 100 dB SPL in a concert hall. In that case, I was literally in front of the orchestra, in the third row, and there was a 150-voice chorus as well.

Thanks to Ajax for posting the info. I'd argue slightly with a couple of definitions. 1 dB is generally conceded as the least perceptible audible change in loudness, and a change upwards or downwards of 3 dB is "somewhat louder" or "a bit softer." "0 dB" SPL by definition would be inaudible, and 1 dB would be the threshold of audibility.

BrenR is correct about the hearing mechanism. Actual compression takes place in our ears so trying to sort things out at levels above 95 dB SPL is fraught with error.

The list of instruments and vocal SPLs is greatly affected by the distance from the source. A friend of mine is a professional classical double bass player, and when you hear a double bass bowed in an average living (2,100 cu. ft.), the entire room resonates! It truly IS awesome!

But when you place that double bass in a concert hall, and sit 30 feet or more away, the sound intensity is greatly diminished, even when an orchestra has eight or nine double bassists.

Levels I've experienced at some rock concerts have been ridiculous. I guess some people find it thrilling, but for me it just merges into a mush of distortion, bad sound (big horn-loaded speakers), and compression in the inner ear. That isn't always the case, but good amplified sound, at reasonable levels, is the exception at a lot of concerts of pop and rock music.

Regards,

speaking of losing fidelity, whenever I'm in an environment that is loud -- say anywhere from 85dB on up -- I hear a sound in my right inner-ear that resembles static. I especially notice it if I get a bad seat on an airplane -- like my recent flight to Dallas where I was in the right-most seat in the very last aisle of a rear-engined plane.