Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Stereo SACD's....don't jump on the band wagon....just yet

I realized the other day, that I have owned, (thru many years) all releases of : Frampton comes alive!
I am going to use this "experience" to give a non-scietific
review of the various sound quality differences, per type of "disc".

The main thrust of this review is the SACD vs. the re-mastered HDCD versions.
I traded in my original, 2-disc set of FCA, at my local used cd shop, (scuff's) SO...this review will consist of:FCA SCAD 25th anniversary edition,...surround, plus high resolution stereo, 2-disc. Re-mastered classics version 1-disc, and FCA 25th annivrsary deluxe edition.
Although I have the LP's, and cassettes...I think a review of those would be moot.

I tested the (1-disc) RM cd first,...the sound mastering levels were up a bit, over "regular" discs. I played the disc at: -44.5db...the sound quality was fair, but there was distortion on some tracks...not present on any of the other discs I "tested".(Including the original cds).

I tested the SCAD, and thought this would be THE definitive version. No, in fact not even close! I had to play that disc at: -16.0db to set the volume level close to the RM cd.
Even then, the disc, sounded "flat" in compareson to the RM cd. This disc has regular stereo also, but my SCAD player will only play the SACD. I assume the stereo track would sound like the next discs I'm reviewing.

The next cd I am reviewing is: FCA 25th anniversay deluxe edition, 2-disc....HDCD, re-mixed, AND re-mastered. (I abhor the re-mixing of classic, analog music.)
This version, (which I bought on sale, and never expected too much) IS BY FAR THE "BEST".
I played these discs at: -44.5db....(to get the same volume level). Talk about a HUGE difference, one of the best "live" cds I've heard. The ONLY part that was a disappointment was, Frampton's guitar was mixed too far "back"...it kinda lost that "edge", BUT...considering some of the ham-fisted remixes of classic rock cd's I've heard....I can live with it.

In conclusion, I have found by using the same gear, settings, listening situation, etc. and having the unique opportunity to test ALL the cd versions out there, against each other, (that's why I used the Frampton cds) the SACD's are NOT in my non-scientific opinion, always the "best" possible format.
So......before you feel you MUST have a SCAD player, do some more checking on your own, FIRST.
I hope some will find this "review" interesting, and helpful.

Larry
Out of all the SACDs I have (20 or so) FCA is by far the worst, and I dont think it represents SACD as a whole.
The best in my collection would be Elton John Goodbye Yellow Brick Road, Pink Floyd Dark Side of The Moon and Michael McDonald Motown probably in that order.
Other well mastered SACDs Alison Krause+Union Station New Favorite and The Police Every Breath You Take.
About 1/4 of my SACDs are poorly mastered. Another 1/4 are 2 channel SACDs which I personaly cant tell the difference between them and a regular cd.

Brady,

I used FCA....so as to compare apples to apples..I'M VERY familiar with the sound of both FCA, and many of the discs you named.
Maybe FCA was not the best possible choice for testing, but I was "testing" the technology.......not which SCAD, or cd has the best sound, overall.
LT

The playback volume level of SACS's vs. CD's IMHO is not a valid criteria to judge the quality of the SACD recording. In my experience SACD playback volume is always quite a bit lower than standard CD's at the same volume control adjustment. I do agree with you that SACD's aren't always better. It really comes down to the quality of the original recording, and how well the SACD version was mastered. There are a few classic rock SACD's worth listening to: Pink Floyd DSOM (everyone knows this one), Santana Abraxis is also really good. On the flip side, i have listed to quite of few of the Police albums on SACD's and they are are horrible IMHO.

I am a rock fan, but It's hard to find any rock or pop music recorded well, and even harder to find any on SACD or DVD-A worth listening to. Sting's solo albums seem to be well recorded, I have 2 on DVD-A.

Recently I've been getting into jazz, mostly because the recording quality is great, and it really shows off what M80's can do (and the equipment driving them).

At the risk of sounding defensive, I didn't word that too well.....I was calling attention to the volume difference......not using that fact to judge the SACD.
Sorry.

But in this case all you are really testing is the mastering of the SACD version of FCA. That is not a good way to "test" the viability of the SACD technology as a whole. I would think a better way, is to find a well recorded an mastered SACD and compare it to the original. Plus "live" records are notoriuosly poorly recorded as compared to studio records. There is no way to control the acoustic environment in an arena or concert hall, as well as you can in a recording studio.

I think the original recording quality, and the expertise that was employed in the mastering process is far more important that the technology that was used to encode the disc, CD, SACD, DVD-A.

I'm not sure you read all of my post(s)..........the discs I "reviewed".....ALL used the same, analog master tape source material. ANY flaws would have to be delt with in each discs mastering process, therefore...apples to apples.
I did say non-scientific, didn't I?
Tough crowd.

Sorry Larry' not trying to be a tough crowd. I think it was the title of your post that threw me.
I wouldnt base my decision nor would I want anyone else to base there decision to SACD or not on FCA.
I understand now you were just compareing apples to apples, and I appreciate your review.

Yah, no worries Larry... it's just that the thread title suggested that the SACD format was intrinsically weak. Maybe more like "FCA SACD's...don't waste your money!"

eventhough it is the same master source, an engineer was still involved to mix the SACD.

I have heard SACD's and DVD-A's that do not sound as good as the original redbook.....and some that sound much better.