Epic 80-500-180 with 4311ci receiver AND XPA-3 amp

Posted by: hhp

Epic 80-500-180 with 4311ci receiver AND XPA-3 amp - 03/09/13 05:29 PM

Hi,

my current system is Epic 80-500-180 with 4311ci receiver.

i recently bought an external amp xpa-3 (emotiva)to power my M80s and VP180 (after discussing with Axiom rep that I should see quite an improvement).

I hooked up the amp and re-run my audyssey 32 setup again. After the set up, the system worked fine, but i was not sure if some of the settings were set correctly.

the setup on my 4311ci confused me a bit.. please help with the following questions

1) do i need to change my receiver to a different mode than NORMAL based on my set up? From the manual, i do not want to select pre-amp mode unless i am using external amp to power ALL of my speakers. Should I choose 11 channel mode instead of NORMAL?

2) i noticed my m80s were set at "LARGE". should it be small instead?

3) Am I doing the set up in the correct sequence? Run audyssey 32 setup first, then manually tweak some of the settings?

Thanks for your help in advance, I am still fairly new in Home theater system.

HHP
Posted by: SirQuack

Re: Epic 80-500-180 with 4311ci receiver AND XPA-3 amp - 03/09/13 06:49 PM

1) Can't help with this one, maybe someone else will chime in...
2) Yes, set all speakers to Small since you have a sub. Audyssey looks for the -3dB point for each speaker in "your room" and reports back to the Denon, based on that since the 80's are capable of 40hz, Denon uses the setting of LARGE. For my setup I put my 80's and 180 to small, and experimented with 40hz crossover by raising to 60-80Hz. The sub will do a better job in the lower freq regions.
3) Assuming you are running the primary (central location) as the first measurement which for distance/delay, followed by the rest of the locations (8 in my situation) to form a "bubble" around the listening area, you should not have to adjust much. You never want to "lower" a crossover point found by the Denon, but increasing is ok. Also, adjusting the speakers to Small is fine as well.
Posted by: Boltron

Re: Epic 80-500-180 with 4311ci receiver AND XPA-3 amp - 03/09/13 07:08 PM

1) You don't need to change anything on the Denon, the preamp outs are hot (always on). I have the same unit and also use an external amp.

2) Porter's advise is correct and what most do. I however leave my M80s on Large. I personally prefer the sound that way.

3)After Audyssey calibration I always increase my subs (I have two) volume by at least 6db. I find Audyssey never seems to give me enough LFE, maybe it's just me or my room. You can also increase crossover point like Porter says above but do not lower it (disables Audyssey). You can set the M80s to small if you like.
Posted by: Tico

Re: Epic 80-500-180 with 4311ci receiver AND XPA-3 amp - 03/09/13 08:09 PM

Originally Posted By: hhp
my current system is Epic 80-500-180 with 4311ci receiver.


I have the same speakers and receiver. Did you notice a difference with the external amp? I am considering the ADA 1500 for the front stage.

Thanks.
Posted by: hhp

Re: Epic 80-500-180 with 4311ci receiver AND XPA-3 amp - 03/09/13 09:05 PM

Hi Tico,

I only had the system hooked up very recently... I think it helps, but I need to spend a little more time to get a better feel.

I also noticed that I did not have to crank my receiver volume up as high as before..

hhp
Posted by: Boltron

Re: Epic 80-500-180 with 4311ci receiver AND XPA-3 amp - 03/09/13 09:41 PM

I also have a 4311 with M80s and a VP150. I use a 3ch ADA1000 for the fronts. I definitely hear a difference and just love how it all sounds. My room is about 2600 sq ft and it can get pretty loud but I wish I would have a bought a 1250 instead. I will probably upgrade down the road.

Main points:
- I play my M80s in full range (Large) and my Denon would shutdown with some movies (Tron Legacy for one).
- Music sounds so much better with the ADA. I play music as 2.1. The M80s really shine and to my ears is a pretty big improvement over the Denon alone.
- When I watch action movies and have the volume turned up, the external amp really makes a difference.
Posted by: hhp

Re: Epic 80-500-180 with 4311ci receiver AND XPA-3 amp - 03/09/13 10:27 PM

How loud do you turn up your volume for action movie? -15db is a good starting point for my 4311ci
Posted by: Socketman

Re: Epic 80-500-180 with 4311ci receiver AND XPA-3 amp - 03/09/13 10:28 PM

all amps sound the same.
Posted by: dakkon

Re: Epic 80-500-180 with 4311ci receiver AND XPA-3 amp - 03/09/13 11:16 PM

Originally Posted By: Socketman
all solid state amps sound the same.



Fixed it.. Tube amps can sound slightly different than solid state amps..
Posted by: Socketman

Re: Epic 80-500-180 with 4311ci receiver AND XPA-3 amp - 03/10/13 12:57 AM

I bet my xpa3 sounds just like his lol
Posted by: dakkon

Re: Epic 80-500-180 with 4311ci receiver AND XPA-3 amp - 03/10/13 01:19 AM

ah, but both of those amps are solid state amps.. So, i would agree under that premiss..
Posted by: Boltron

Re: Epic 80-500-180 with 4311ci receiver AND XPA-3 amp - 03/10/13 08:55 AM

Depends on movie and mood. I usually end up at either -8db or -3db.
Posted by: SirQuack

Re: Epic 80-500-180 with 4311ci receiver AND XPA-3 amp - 03/10/13 10:11 AM

My Outlaw sounds better than your amp, smile
Posted by: Boltron

Re: Epic 80-500-180 with 4311ci receiver AND XPA-3 amp - 03/10/13 10:25 AM

Oh yeah, mine has 0.00002% less distortion at full power so there!
Posted by: dakkon

Re: Epic 80-500-180 with 4311ci receiver AND XPA-3 amp - 03/10/13 12:05 PM

oh boy... here we go... What i was actually speaking to, was the fact that tube amps can actually add distortion. Some people really like the distortion that a tube amp can introduce.
Posted by: CatBrat

Re: Epic 80-500-180 with 4311ci receiver AND XPA-3 amp - 03/10/13 12:22 PM

No no no. My Pioneer sounds better than your Denen. Hahaha.
Posted by: Boltron

Re: Epic 80-500-180 with 4311ci receiver AND XPA-3 amp - 03/10/13 12:29 PM

LOL
Posted by: troyd

Re: Epic 80-500-180 with 4311ci receiver AND XPA-3 amp - 04/24/13 08:26 PM

What I don't understand is why, do you buy M80's and a VP180 and set it to small with an 80 hz cross over, because the sub will do a better job ???? That, just seems like a waste of money. Why not spend 1000$ less and buy the M22's given that your not even using the lower freq. crossover in the M80's. they have the same drivers less the woofers. anything below 80hz in the small setting is going to the sub anyways. Just seems like a waste of speaker.
Posted by: jakewash

Re: Epic 80-500-180 with 4311ci receiver AND XPA-3 amp - 04/24/13 11:19 PM

Because there is still a difference in sound from an M80 set at 80hz vs. an M22 set at 80hz, the low XO on the M80 is at 160hz so it is still in play with the 80hz setting.
Posted by: troyd

Re: Epic 80-500-180 with 4311ci receiver AND XPA-3 amp - 04/25/13 01:43 PM

OK, that's starting to make a bit of sense.

Almost ...............
Posted by: casey01

Re: Epic 80-500-180 with 4311ci receiver AND XPA-3 amp - 04/25/13 04:06 PM

Originally Posted By: troyd
What I don't understand is why, do you buy M80's and a VP180 and set it to small with an 80 hz cross over, because the sub will do a better job ???? That, just seems like a waste of money. Why not spend 1000$ less and buy the M22's given that your not even using the lower freq. crossover in the M80's. they have the same drivers less the woofers. anything below 80hz in the small setting is going to the sub anyways. Just seems like a waste of speaker.




I once had the alternative set-up you described(M22,s as mains along with subs). I later replaced the M22s with M60s , ultimately replacing those with a special custom set of M80s for my L/R HT application. The problem that I noticed was, even though the cutoff was at 80hz for the M22s, it is a gradual roll-off of frequencies at and below that level and invariably I noticed that at higher volumes, the M22s were straining to handle these lower rolled off low-mid frequencies whereas the M60s and M80s handled these without any issues at all.

With the lossless soundtracks on Blu-ray discs, nowadays, I would always recommend full-range speakers for both center and front application, regardless of the crossover setting.