Well, my M60's arrived earlier yesterday morning (order placed Tue - INCREDIBLE service!)and I eagerly unwrapped the gigantic boxes and stared in amazement at the beauty of seeing these in the flesh. Wow!

After hooking them up, I was hugely disapointed, but I can't help wondering if it's more about my setup then the quality of the speakers themselves, as every review I've read seems to be describing a very different listening experience. What I'm hearing is tough to describe, but far from ideal: Clean yet a little muddy and almost compressed sounding (as if the soundstage elements were all crammed to fit into the same place). The highs are impressive but the midrange is blah and undefined, with details that can clearly be heard on my Mission M74i's (by all accounts a far less detailed speaker in every way)getting almost lost in the din. Surely this can't be right? I really want to love these babies!

Now, I'm powering the M60's with a Yamaha RX-V1300. The speakers are placed (a good few feet from the wall on either side)at the head of a long rectangular room roughly 12 x20. There is wall to wall carpeting and the back of the room has a staircase, which I'd imagine can impact accoustics. Further, one of the long walls opens into a full bathroom with tiled flooring, which I'd assume can also create accoustical havoc. The only furnishings are two couches and lots of shelving.

On the other end, my Missions are in a room with hardwood flooring and minimal furnishings, which should usually create trouble but the slight echo created by the room actually enhances the musicality of the system, oddly enough. In contrast, the Axioms seem uncomfortably cold and less detailed, albeit with better highs. I'm going to try bringing the Missions downstairs to see how they sound in the Axiom room.

Any advice on what I can change in the Axiom room to bring out the best in the M60's?

I would suggest doing exactly what you suggest, or moving the axioms to the mission room since you are probably more used to listening to them in that environment.

There will be more technical weigh-ins before this is done, but ir sounds like a couple of issues. First - you will need to experiment with placement. Closer to the wall front to back and vice versa. Further apart/closer together. Most importantly - these puppies perform a bit better with a bit of toe-in.

The other issue is letting your ears catch up to the new audio.

Not to worry. Several initial reactions spread through the forum like this. Once you find the correct placement and spend some time with them, the love affair will start.

I don't have the M60s, but also consider the quality of the recording you are listening too. Some recordings sound worse the more neutral a speaker is, because the speaker is no longer counterring poor/intentionally boomy bass mixing.
What are you listening to?

jr

Wow, responses have appeared as quickly as the speakers themselves! Thanks!

I've been playing all kinds of music on these, from Ennio Morriconne and Goblin to Coil, Black Sabbath, Nick Cave and Tori Amos. Without exception, there is far less detail and warmth on the Axioms. I will certainly start playing with speaker placement. When you say that they appear to work best with a bit of toe-in, do you mean I should try positioning them slightly more forward than anything else they are near?

Thank god Axiom gives 30 days for their trails period!

The first thing that jumps out at me is the room. Like you said, switch the speakers around. Put the Axioms in the Mission room, and the Missions in the Axiom room. I think you'll be stunned at what a difference the rooms make.

toe in means that you can turn the speakers at an angle so that the tweeters are more pointed twards your head. I have my M80's toed in just so that i can see maybe 3/4 inch of the INSIDE panel of the speakers when im sitting in the sweet spot. Granted, its a small sweet spot but im the only one listening and it produces a more focused image.

Yeh try them on different Amps/ Recievers what kinda Cable's are u using? are they Different in each room Different CD Player ? Can't hurt to try an think of all the Differences in Each Room etc

it may simply be that they're not for you. keep trying, but if something tells you that you don't like them - then pay attention to that something.
i tried rockets and they were not for me. i could tell this within the first day. you, on the other hand, may like rockets.

mdavis,
Although i agree with the suggestions about playing with room acoustics and speaker positions, take things slow at first. You only received the speakers yesterday. Give yourself some time to listen to various music pieces with the new speakers and allow your brain time to adapt to a new sound. You are obviously used to hearing your Missions and music always sounds good from those speakers. They comprise your reference point.
Now you are hearing something different and are unsure whether it is really better, or just different.
Take a gander at a post on my first experience with the Axiom speakers and see if you fall into a similar category.
After listening to the Axioms for a couple of days, if you still feel there is something not fitting, then start playing around with toe in, spacing, etc.

I have M60. When I first hook it up right out of the box, the sound is too bright. However, after positioning the speaker and run auto setup on my receiver, the sound comes back to life. I'm not an expert in sound, but with the price of M60, I don't think you can find any good speaker like that at the same price. I even listen to B&W at local store, and can't tell the difference. Anyway, that's just my opinion.

M, i have the same receiver running 60's. mine are about 9 to 10 feet apart and about 12" from the wall. if you have not "sized" the speakers, that may be an issue. i too have mine toed in slightly. i set mine to small and use a sub with music and movies, and love them. as others have said, they or your ears will calm down slightly in a few days. play a well recorded cd in about 4 days, and crank those mothahs (that's massachusetts for mothers), and i'll bet a dime they sound great.
dan

You need time to run them and get used to the sound. But, as much as I'd getting a whipping for saying so, I think the speakers need time to break in.

Breaking in your ears, breaking in your speakers...in the end it doesn't really matter...as long as something gets broken in. I was a little turned off by my M60s when I got them. Now I love them. What else can I say but that?

kinda funny. I'm sure I reacted like all Axioms owners who read the thread title. Tensing up, thinking, "What the heck is he/she doing wrong?"

I'm sure you'll work it out, the position will make a huge difference.

I can't recall any listener saying the Axioms weren't detailed...

When I first received my M60's I too was taken aback by what appeared to be a lack of bass. I had been running Abtract Acoustics 2.1 two way speakers and liked the sound. I tried the A-B test between the Abs and the Axioms and discovered the reason why. The Abstracts were boomy while the Axioms were tight and clear. After I set my M60's up properly and toed them in toward my listening position I liked what I heard ( and still do). The M60's are very directional and if your room is small or you are sitting outside the "sweet spot" you will notice.

Sean

I too got some m60's yesterday. I didn't get whether the M60's and the other speakers were being compared with the same amp driving them. Then too the room likely makes some difference. I thought my M60's sounded better in my house than the B&W 600's at the dealer, same amp driving them, a Rotel 1056 (75wpchannel-5 channel or 100 wpc-2 channels driven.)

I had 2 friends over when I unboxed my M60s. I set them in the center of the room abut 6' apart and plugged them in. They sounded incredible. The next day, when I put them where I wanted them, I was not impressed. It took several weeks of messing with the position to find the right spot. Position makes a HUGE difference.

On the subject of toe in. Too little and you will hear a "hole in the middle". Too much, and things will get flat or muddy sounding because the sounds from each speaker will be mixing too much in the middle.

Mine are about 9' apart, and have about 3/16" of toe in. I sit 12' back. You'll need to find the right combination of distances from walls (24" or so seems to be correct), amount of toe in, and separation to get the right sound and image. When adjusting, make small ajustments. Sean wasn't kidding when the said they were directional. I describe it as they "shoot straight". Turning them 1/16" can make a difference.

Those aluminum drivers must hold their shape very well while in motion. I think that the paper, and other non-rigid drivers flex as they move in and out. The result is that the sound field produced by them has a "fuzzy edge" that makes them easier to get positioned correctly. With the aluminum cones, you need to be a little more careful to get the edge of the sound field from one speaker to align with the edge of the sound field from the other speaker. When you get them right, the sound and image is incredible.

Good luck,

I was also dissapointed with my m60s (plus stf-2) for the first 5 months i've had them.
I bought them over winter break and listened to them for about a 2 weeks and went back to school. Nice, but not much better then my klipsch promedia on my computer.

I came home for summer break and found that we recently moved the downstairs around and i was able to move the speakers to a better spot in my 20x 14x8 room(LWH).

After some listening to music off my computer i put LOTR:TT in on loud using my crappy DVD player and HK 525.

[censored] unbelievable

Kicked the [censored] out of my house as well

anyways, i've got the qs8s and vp 100 on backorder now after that expierence. My suggestion-if you cant get a good spot for the m60s, try some more forgiving speakers. IF i remember correctly the saphire omni present speakers were really forgiving(didnt sound as nice) but placement was not an issue.

have fun!