Initial Impressions with Upgrade

Posted by: UCONN

Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/18/04 03:39 PM

Hi All

I replace my M22 fronts with M60s and my VP100 with VP150 a few days ago. Axiom's paying return shipping, god love em.

I must say I liked the M22s but I LOVE the M60s. And I think it's not just the low end either, though the difference there is night and day. The mids and highs seem clearer, better defined without being harsh(er). Everything seems "smoother" (sorry - not sure how to describe what I'm hearing). Of course I wonder if this has something to do with the better low end extension, some sort of psycho-acoustics. I'm reminded of the visual illusion where 2 identically colored gray blocks appear completely different because of the difference in the colors of their surrounding blocks. Does anyone know if there is something similar acoustically? I understand that it would make sense that the M60s would sound better in the midrange due to the dedicated driver; I'm just surprised at how MUCH better they sound overall. Of course I only had the M22s a month and the M60s for one week (first week = 100 hours of lilstening LOL). I had originally gotten the VP100 because of a number of posts saying there wasn't much of a difference between it and the VP150 in smaller rooms. I upgraded to the VP150 mostly because I was worried about the 100 being "overpowered" by the M60s, but I think there is a significant (read: noticible by a newbie) improvement in sound. The VP100 sounded a little constrained, "small" (?) maybe, and there's none of that with the VP150. That best I can think of to describe the difference is, to me, the 150 sounds fuller.

One thing: the tweeter on the M60s is about level with my sternum when I'm sitting on the couch. That's fine. But when I stand (small room here) I really lose the highs in the front half of the room (near the speakers). The speakers are on a wood floor so I got a couple of rubber door stops (wedges) to prop up the front of the M60s to angle the drivers up a little. I'm experimenting with them under the cabinet and under the feet (more angle under the feet) to find the optimum amount of elevation. I'm just trying to extend the sweet spot vertically while keeping what I have for seated listening (oops, I better test it laying down on the couch - that's a few hours a week for sure!). Anyone else angling their towers? I'm using the same stops to angle the VP150 (on top of the TV) down which was a suggestion I read elsewhere.

Wow, that's a lot of nothing. Sorry. I'll save my question about upgrading to Denon's 3805 and dual surrounds for another post. But let me thank everyone that contributes to these forums for all the grade information I was able to find before making the plunge (errr, initial foray?). Thanks.

-dale


M60s, QS8s, M3s, VP150, VTF-2 MK2, AVR 2105
Posted by: tomtuttle

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/18/04 04:54 PM

Dale, I just want to say Thank You. I think your comments will be very helpful to others.
Posted by: GeneticDrift

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/18/04 05:42 PM

congrats!! i agree with you there is absolutely no comaprison between the 22's and the 60's (i always laugh when i see posts comparing the 2)

the 60's are an incredible speaker....enjoy!!
Posted by: UCONN

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/18/04 06:46 PM

Thanks Tom, Jeff. I had initially been interested in putting together a system to enjoy the movie surround sound experience, thinking I could use it for music too. But so far I have been listening to a lot more music, re-discovering my music collection that had been languishing (last stereo system is 20 years old now). This means, for me, a lot of listening in direct mode (am I in the wrong forum? LOL). I get a nice smooth stage now using the LFE + main setting. One of the reasons I wanted to try the M60s after living with the M22s was that most Jazz and Classical sounded great, Blues were ok, but they weren't getting it done for Rock. I thought a lot of it was the recordings themselves. You know - the M22s were "exposing" bad CDs. I am much happier with more of my collection after running them through the M60s. Granted, there are some bad recordings in there. And now that I've modernized the hardware, I get hear DVD audio, like Diana Krall''s "The Girl in the Other Room" - MAN-OH-MAN!!!

-dale


M60s, QS8s, M3s, VP150, VTF-2 MK2, AVR 2105
Posted by: SirQuack

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/18/04 07:02 PM

congrats and keep on a rockin
Posted by: ravi_singh

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/19/04 03:10 AM

I have to say I went from M22's to M80's and found the difference to be very noticeable. I was very happy listening to m80's compared to M22's.

that being said, the M22's are some of the finest bookshelves I have heard that won't break the bank
Posted by: MiniRock

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/19/04 10:21 PM

I know what you mean; I always laugh when I hear someone claim that the Paradigm CC-370 sounds better than the Axiom VP-150.
Posted by: GeneticDrift

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/19/04 10:41 PM

I agree, heck everyone knows the paradigm is a superior speaker……..

Posted by: MiniRock

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/19/04 10:57 PM


Posted by: GeneticDrift

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/19/04 11:11 PM

Have you taken the time to actually listen to the 2 side by side, I didn’t think so but that’s ok bury your head in the sand and keep that horrible imaging and fake sounding vp150. It will most likely serve "your" needs.
Posted by: GeneticDrift

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/19/04 11:12 PM

gee, wait till i trade my m3's in for the paradigm mini monitors.....
Posted by: MiniRock

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/19/04 11:20 PM


Posted by: pmbuko

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/19/04 11:31 PM

GD,

I used to own a Paradigm CC-350 before I bought a VP100. Hands down, I much prefer the sound of the VP100. Funny how speakers are all about personal taste, huh?
Posted by: GeneticDrift

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/19/04 11:38 PM

lol the vp100.........no reply required on that one.
Posted by: pmbuko

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/19/04 11:43 PM

Are you sure you're not slownlo? Your immature reaction to my post seems to be something he would write.

Oh, by the way... "Have you taken the time to actually listen to the 2 side by side, I didn’t think so but that’s ok bury your head in the sand...."

What a f***ing hypocrite.
Posted by: GeneticDrift

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/20/04 12:09 AM

yes i had both at my house at the same time, have you? didnt think so! dont take my word for it fool go read all about the 2 yourself.

http://www.audioreview.com/Center+Channels/Axiom+Speaker+Company/PRD_125695_2743crx.aspx

http://www.audioreview.com/Center+Channels/Paradigm/PRD_125317_2743crx.aspx
Posted by: MiniRock

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/20/04 12:11 AM

In reply to:

Are you sure you're not slownlo?




Hahha! I thought the same thing!


(Taking my head out of the sand for a momment) FWIW, I was just joking with you GD (hence the wink and smile) when I made my first post. Try not to get so worked up over nothing dude; just think, in fifty years who is going to care? Anyway, no hard feelings man!
Posted by: Ken.C

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/20/04 12:12 AM

Excuse me if I'm mistaken, but you did NOT have a VP100 and a CC370 in your house at the same time. Peter did. Now stop being so damn rude; you too Minirock.
Posted by: GeneticDrift

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/20/04 12:13 AM

vp100.........no..............it was the vp150
Posted by: GeneticDrift

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/20/04 12:16 AM

perhaps you can call axiom tech yourself and let them explain to you how the vp100 is an entry level speaker. its no secret.
Posted by: MiniRock

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/20/04 12:20 AM

http://www.audioreview.com/Center+Channels/Axiom+Speaker+Company/PRD_125695_2743crx.aspx http://www.audioreview.com/Center+Channels/Paradigm/PRD_125317_2743crx.aspxThere ya go!
Posted by: GeneticDrift

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/20/04 12:21 AM

thanks...
Posted by: Ken.C

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/20/04 12:22 AM

Gah, let's try to get this thread back on the right track.

Dale, congrats on your new speakers. I'm glad you like them. Good luck on the positioning; I still mess with my M50s. When I was trying out Peter's VP100, I found that it sounded better angled down towards me, like you're doing with the 150. How big is your room, btw?
Posted by: MiniRock

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/20/04 12:26 AM

When I want lip from you I'll jiggle my zipper. j/k

Seriously though, learn how to use punctuation dude.
Posted by: MiniRock

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/20/04 12:28 AM

No sweat! Now, let's talk about that crappy tv you have. j/k
Posted by: pmbuko

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/20/04 12:38 AM

are you always this impolite?

Wait, I guess you are.
Posted by: GeneticDrift

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/20/04 12:41 AM

wow u r my hero, what a cool guy. perhaps a job will consume some of the idle time you spend behind your keyboard....
Posted by: pmbuko

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/20/04 12:44 AM

Scoreboard

pmbuko: 2
GeneticDrift: 0

Keep trying there, sport.
Posted by: GeneticDrift

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/20/04 12:46 AM

i love it the fool votes for himself.............lol omg what a moron.........hahahaha
Posted by: pmbuko

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/20/04 12:47 AM

Scoreboard

pmbuko: 4
GeneticDrift: 0

Keep 'em coming, kemosabe.
Posted by: UCONN

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/20/04 12:48 AM

Thanks Ken. The room is only 11 x 15. One problem is that it isn't so much a room as one end of an L. And the rug that seemed like a nice-to-have thing has been bumped up to necessity - I need to soften this space! I just hadn't seen anyone talk about angling their towers, kind of like my old Infinity RS 3Bs which have a built-in tilt even though they are 4 feet tall.

-dale
Posted by: GeneticDrift

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/20/04 12:48 AM

Shouldn’t you be searching Google for my user name.......lol omg what a desperately boring chap. Dude really get a life……….
Posted by: GeneticDrift

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/20/04 12:50 AM

what kind of a hopelessly boring oaf searches google for user names lol omg what an idiot........
Posted by: Ken.C

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/20/04 12:52 AM

I haven't seen people angling the towers (is that spelled right, Minirock?), but some people certainly do put them on stands.
Posted by: GeneticDrift

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/20/04 12:55 AM

here are some great user names for you:

Imab0r3
N0Fri3nds
Clu3l3$$
W0m3nhat3m3
King0fd0rk$
Nakedbikeyb0ard (lol that one is great, dual meaning)
1n33dfr13nds

omg this is toooo easy.


Posted by: UCONN

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/20/04 01:00 AM

Yeah, I found a couple of decorative cement blocks that I thought I could use to raise them 4-8 inches as opposed to tilting. I'll probably try that too for comparison's sake.
Posted by: Ken.C

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/20/04 01:02 AM

I guess I'm just not that patient or discerning. However, I am curious as to what you find!
Posted by: pmbuko

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/20/04 01:03 AM

I was going to tell everyone that you're only 17 (DOB: Aug. 9, 1987), but I think your posts speak for themselves.

Uh, oops. I guess I just told them anyway.
Posted by: GeneticDrift

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/20/04 01:09 AM

Lol if you check every message board you find on Google (which im sure you will) you will see I never use my actual birthdate. Everyone is different.

Go ahead; you have the time....go check them all out.

Then when you are done I order you to post some more useless drabble here for all to read.

DON’T disobey my orders. Post to this thread again!

Posted by: UCONN

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/20/04 01:15 AM

Never thought of myself as particularly patient and I'm by no means discerning. But right now I'm still deep in the throes of new-toy syndrome so a certain amount of toying is expected. (Or am I rationalizing work avoidance?)
Posted by: Ken.C

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/20/04 01:16 AM

All of the above work!
Posted by: bigjohn

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/20/04 01:19 AM

GREAT find peter... i still havent stopped laughing.. goes to show you can find a sucka literally every where. and often, the same one...

troll, be gone.. you are boring us.

bigjohn
Posted by: GeneticDrift

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/20/04 01:33 AM

boring you lol,
verizion, it would figure you would be in a service position....lol

Im sure with your credentials you could easily find gainful employment in either the janitorial or fast food industry.
Posted by: MiniRock

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/20/04 01:44 AM

Hey! I said, "Punctuation," not spelling. I can't speel worth a krap. BigJ:It takes two to tango bra! At this point Petey is just as guilty as GD.UCONN:I believe Lovan makes a tower speaker stand that isn't too expensive; I'll so a search and see if I can find it.
Posted by: bigjohn

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/20/04 01:46 AM

agreed, but still funny...

bigjohn
Posted by: MiniRock

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/20/04 01:48 AM

I agree. I'm glad I'm not the only who is twisted.
Posted by: MiniRock

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/20/04 02:00 AM

UCONN: Here is the one I was thinking about, but it's more expensive than I remember.
Posted by: UCONN

Re: Initial Impressions with Upgrade - 12/20/04 09:37 AM

Thanks for the link. I'd probably want to try them at that height before spending the money. And then if I liked it, I'd probably be too lazy to change it and just stick with the stack of newspapers or whatever.