i had an interesting discussion with my dad the other day. according to him, older amps ( 80s, early 90s) have looser bass.
this got me wondering, how much have amplifiers improved over years? can one hear an audible difference between a 1980s amp and a brand new amp today? ( in terms of sound quality, soundstage, etc)
does it mean an old amp is definately inferior to a new one?

thanks!!
slack : )

I don't think so, slack. For instance, I have an older Yamaha M-80 which has very tight and fast bass. I also use a Pioneer Sx850 receiver in my garage system, and although it has an almost tubie warmth, it sounds great.

I agree with 2x6 on this one, assuming that you are talking about the solidstate amps only. Some solidstate amps from early 70's might have still had the harshness and other "early-solidstate" sonic problems. But 80's and thereafter? -- I don't think so...

Agree with 2x6, slack. Unless your father was specifically talking about certain tube amps that had very high output impedance and therefore a relatively low damping factor, the older amps have ample damping. More generally, if they have ruler-flat frequency response and low distortion, they don't audibly affect the sound. Features and sound processing have changed greatly in the past 10 or 20 years, but basic sound hasn't.

My 16 year old Bryston 4B 250w x 2 and 19 year old Bryston 2B 60w x 2 seemingly sounds better or as good as my 2 year old Rotel RSX1065 100w x 5. Thats why I use my 4B for mains.
My 23 year old Bryston 3B is another story. I think beer accidentaly fell into it. It smells like that when the amp gets warm.

Boy, you really know crappy designs when beer can get into the amp... ;-)

And that happened as soon as Bryston's 20-year warranty expired? LOL

Good one, Masa.

Sushi:
I have my uncle to thank for that. And yes it expired in 2000. The event in question was 6 months ago.

kcarlile:
let me see if your AVR525 can sing as good after it has a pint of Rikers Red ... while it was turned on.

cool, thank man. what about power? how many watts (minimum) does it take to drive a floorstander like the M60? it puzzles me that tube amps can get away with figures like 5 watts, while a solid state amp with 50 amps may not seem enough.
how does an 'underpowered' speaker sound like?.. does it mean the amp is clipping full time due to lack of power? or does it mean the amp simply does not have enough reserves to play the dynamics in the music properly, causing the speakers to sound 'underpowered'?
would a 60wpc intergrated amp be enough to drive a pair of floor standers with a configuration like the M60, ie 2 woofers, a mid bass and a tweeter? what kind of loudess would it be able to achieve? does this depend on the speaker sensitivity and the impedence?..4 ohm being more demanding than 6 or 8 ohms?

hmm, i always end up with lots of questions after browsing sites and reading stuff. as always, thanks in advance for your help guys!!!

slack

slack,

Alan Lofft (the "Axiom resitent expert" guy featured on the front page of this website) just wrote an article about the very topic of your questions in Axiom's AudioFile monthly email newsletter.

Go subscribe to the AudioFile... I guess you can just email Amie (amie@axiomaudio.com) to include yourself on the subscription list.

Btw, folks, where is the "official" subscription page for the AudioFile???

In reply to:

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kcarlile:
let me see if your AVR525 can sing as good after it has a pint of Rikers Red ... while it was turned on.

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The only problem with that challenge is you first would have to get beer into Ken's house.

Hey, I think there's a bottle of homebrew somewhere in the back of my fridge... And we might still have that can of Sharps that you foisted off on us last year... (blech!)

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