M3v3

Posted by: johnaudio

M3v3 - 04/21/13 08:57 PM

Hello,
I was wondering if someone could assist. I purchased a pair of m3v3ís about 6 months or so ago, and now with well over 100 burn-in hours on them and the sound of cymbals, guitars, etc. sounds tiny to me. It doesnít sound right. With the same setup and equipment I had been using the m3 v1ís (which I loved) before I gave them to my father, and those did not sound like these do as far as I remember. I also swapped the v3ís out temporarily with a second pair of speakers in the house (not used anymore) from a Yamaha mini system and the highs even from these cheapies did sound more real to me. Is there some sort of tweak other than the usual IC, speaker cable, etc. swap / replacement that I can do? Again, the same exact equipment was used all along even with the older axioms. For example some sort of cap or resistor added to the tweeter or something? Do I need more burn-in time?

Any help, suggestions will be much appreciated.

John
Posted by: JohnK

Re: M3v3 - 04/21/13 09:18 PM

John, welcome(can always use another one). If what you term "tiny" means a lack of high frequencies, none of the steps you mention are meaningful. If any "burn-in" was necessary(doubtful), 100 seconds rather than 100 hours would be sufficient. An IC or speaker cable swap certainly shouldn't be considered "usual" and would have no effect.

Have you listened to each M3 individually to see if they both exhibit the problem? Can you play high frequency test tones to see if the tweeter is functioning at all on either or both of the speakers? Possibly an internal wire has come loose.

You can be assured that when it's operating correctly the tweeter on the M3v3s is if anything slightly superior to the previous model.
Posted by: johnaudio

Re: M3v3 - 04/21/13 09:40 PM

Hi Johnk
Thank you very much for your feedback and suggestions. I've listened to both speakers and they sound identical even when I swapped them around. I am just not good with audio terms at all, forgive me. By tiny (maybe thin is the right word?), I mean, high hats, steel guitar strings notes just don't linger, the tone vanishes quickly when compared with the other speakers. Hi frequency is definitely there but it just doesn't sound right to me. Maybe its personal preference, but I seriously am considering of getting my old m3 v1's back from my dad.

Thanks again
Posted by: JohnK

Re: M3v3 - 04/21/13 10:00 PM

John, it's of course nearly impossible for someone to diagnose at long range "just doesn't sound right". If both speakers have the identical problem it's extremely unlikely for some defect to have occurred in both, but this can't be some inherent characteristic of the v3 tweeter. Alan has reported that it has a small but noticeable edge on the previous tweeter.

If there aren't any later replies here which catch something that I can't at the moment, contact Axiom directly for possible advice.
Posted by: tomtuttle

Re: M3v3 - 04/21/13 10:16 PM

The only other things I would offer are...

You don't mention source material.

You don't mention the rest of the signal chain.

While it is "identical" to your other scenarios, the high resolution of the current models might be revealing weaknesses in the rest of the chain.
Posted by: exlabdriver

Re: M3v3 - 04/22/13 03:17 AM

My M3v3s in one of my audio only systems are driven by a new, but low end Sony Stereo Receiver with an older Sony 5 Disc CD Player - certainly not audiophile stuff. Their high end sounds fine to me - not unlike my M2s & M22s that use the same tweeter.

If it is not your source material, maybe it is something to do with the interaction of the speakers with your room. Perhaps experimenting with moving the speakers slightly - toeing in, etc - might improve things...

TAM
Posted by: Murph

Re: M3v3 - 04/22/13 08:07 AM

You may also want to double check and/or experiment with the settings on your receiver. Are you using an auto-calibration program that might need to be run again? Are you using a particular EQ or sound mode that might be effecting things? I once accidentally set my EQ to "flat" and was extremely frustrated with the horrible effect it created compared to my previous settings, until I finally discovered my mistake.
Posted by: johnaudio

Re: M3v3 - 04/22/13 09:16 AM

Thank you folks for all your helpful comments and suggestions. My system consists of an NAD c326bee integrated and a c515bee cdp connected through analysis plus oval 9 speaker wire, tara labs vector icís, gutwire and ultralink power cables. I did play with the settings of the amp and moved the speakers around, including experimenting with isolation cones etc. Music material is generally acoustic blues (no rap, heavy metal, pop). Thatís it. Maybe these speakers reveal weaknesses in my system. It is what it is I guess.

Thank you all very much once again.
Posted by: CatBrat

Re: M3v3 - 04/22/13 09:53 AM

For wire, I just use Axiom's 12 gauge bulk wire with banana connectors. Couldn't sound better.
Posted by: MarkSJohnson

Re: M3v3 - 04/22/13 10:47 AM

John, the best process is to go through everything to eliminate variables.

Does your dad live close enough to bring his speakers to your house for comparison there, as well as bringing your speakers to HIS house to compare on his system?

You need to confirm that both tweeters are working and that the system is not imparting a change of sound.

Comparing the new M3s to the old ones is beneficial in removing variables.
Posted by: tomtuttle

Re: M3v3 - 04/22/13 01:07 PM

Unless you've really got some goofy settings, I don't think the rest of your system could be causing you discontent. Just so we're clear, you're playing regular old redbook CD's as a source and minimizing any processing done by the amp?

As much as I (and others) may hate to admit it, it is also possible that you have really great ears and simply don't like the overall profile of the M3v3. Personally, I think it's a pretty terrific speaker, but your ears, your room, your music, etc.
Posted by: exlabdriver

Re: M3v3 - 04/22/13 01:10 PM

My M3s are placed in acoustically difficult positions - on stands in corners where bass response was unacceptably enhanced.

This produced some muddiness, not only with these units but also with my previous speakers in the same placement. Since I have no Audyssey type capability, I ended up manually cutting bass on the Sony Receiver to -4. Similarly, I added +1 to the treble response.

All is well now & I'm very happy with their performance that is surprisingly powerful & clean for a bookshelf in such a large room. Room acoustics can have a huge impact...

TAM
Posted by: 2x6spds

Re: M3v3 - 04/23/13 09:07 PM

Check wiring phase
Posted by: tomtuttle

Re: M3v3 - 04/24/13 12:40 AM

Ooh, good one.