Hi all, my trusty EP500v2 (circa ~2009) seems to have died just before the end of 2023 holidays. It appears to power on ok, but there is no output. I verified the coil and driver are ok - free moving and responds to 9V battery test as expected. I also verified output from my amp over the RCA cable using a multimeter and test tones. So it seems to me like either the input board or RCA inputs on the EP500 have failed.

I am wondering if there are any other suggestions on what to check or how to diagnose/fix?

FYI, I have emailed Axiom and gotten a reply asking for a picture of the amp, though I did already supply the serial number with my 1st contact. I sent the pic immediately and haven't had a reply in a couple of days. I haven't used Axiom support in years as my system has worked flawlessly since upgrading to the M5HP OnWalls when they were newly released. Axiom had an amazing reputation for customer support and I could vouch for that years ago, however I am not finding that same responsiveness that used to be there. Hopefully it's just a holiday season issue, but I'm curious how service and support has been for others more recently?

If my EP500 ends up needing replacement I was considering upgrading to an EP800, but if Axiom isn't the same great company I've known it to be I may start to look elsewhere. I am very open to opinions and experience there as well.

Thanks in advance.

Cheers,

Sorry that your v2 died. It kind of kills me that often these things cost more to fix then they are worth. Even when one knows how to fix it the time it takes may not worth it. I’ve definitely gone that route more than a few times. As far as getting a new one I’d personally stick with the 500. The EP600 and 800 are hugh boxes (which greatly limit placement).

Thanks Rich. Any suggestions for further diagnosis? Have I missed anything?
I am waiting to hear back from Axiom for any suggestions from repair to replacement to upgrade options but communications are slow.

I miss the bass! Been without since just before Christmas. I have recalibrated system without the sub now and I am pleasantly surprised how well the M5HP's manage on their own, but it's still no substitute for a good working sub.

Re placement for bigger sub enclosures - there are 2 ideal spots in my room for sub placement and they both can accommodate a large sub even though my room is small. I have no issues with overkill on the subwoofer! ;-)

I wonder what causes subs to die? Limiting circuitry have been around for decades to prevent overdriving the sub (even my 29 year old Mirage sub has one).

Inadequate switching power supplies appears to a culprit in modern subs, but that's not applicable with Axiom subs and their linear power supplies.

The 500 is just fine for movies but lacks the depth of the 600 and 800 for music. With the 600 and 800, you hear growling and texture that just isn't there with the 500. You'd never know it until you heard it, and then you can't go back.

Ian swears up and down the 600 is as good as the 800...reaches as low. I find the 800 reaches lower but that's only necessary for special effects.

I have one 800, two 600s, four 500s, and two 125s - all v4. I also have a self-modified Sony and Yammie.

Just about anything can cause a sub to die. I can speculate.

Bad design leading to poorly specified parts like power supply capacitors or even $0.02 parts like resistors.

Poorly manufactured boards or assemblies like drivers.

Poorly documented instructions from engineering to the shop floor.

Vendor parts that don't meet spec but pass functional tests during production. This is a tough one. It's expensive and time-consuming to screen parts.

Incomplete production testing. "Just build it and ship it".

I worked in hardware factories for 20 years. Another 10 years in a software factory.

Mojo, sounds like you'd recommend recommend an upgrade to the 600 or 800?

Good point about capacitors or resistors. Since it seems to be just the input, maybe it's one of those simple parts on the board? When I took the amp plate off to do the 9V battery test, the board on the inside of the sub was all covered by a molded plastic housing so I didn't even think to inspect it. Any reason I shouldn't try to see if I can remove that plastic covering and check if it's a cheap part that may have fried?

Also, Andrew F. at Axiom emailed me back today and suggested either an amp replacement or upgrade program. As my amp is so old (v2 circa 2009) I wonder what amp replacement I'd get and is it just 'plug and play' with my ported EP500 vs the new EP500's which are not ported? Room calibration will be done of course. But I thought the DSP is 'tuned' for the full solution of driver, coil, cabinet all together. Does anybody have experience how this would work - getting an amp replacement for an older design?

The amp is plug and play. They'll just change the code in the DSP to match the v2.

My advice is to work Axiom over for an upgrade. There's just no comparison between v2 and v4. I had a 600v2 and wanted to take an axe to it. I worked out a deal for the 800. Even if you just get a 500v4, you'll be god-smacked by the clean, articulate bass compared to v2.

You can remove the plastic covering but be careful you don't zap yourself from the charge stored in the capacitors.

All subs and speakers are now real wood finish. Treat yourself!

Work out into the deal to upgrade the QS8 to QS10. I had QS8s too. Damned glad they're gone!!

Haha, I don't have room for QS10's, but if I have to choose a component to upgrade in my system it would be the sub anyway!
Actually, I am still quite happy with my QS8's - maybe because I haven't heard the QS10's?
Out of curiosity, what did you not like about the QS8's? Of course they are small and are not 'full range' speakers, however I didn't think there was much deeper content in surrounds anyway, so I was never sure there'd be much of a diff between QS8s and QS10s. I'm interested to know what your experience was.

So now I'll have to decide between the amp replacement for my existing EP500 or an upgrade to a current EP500/600 or 800. Thanks to Axiom (Andrew F) for helping out with support so far, answering questions and providing options.

The tweeters on the QS8v2 broke up and distorted. Also the sound was puny. The QS10s have far more presence and clarity. Even so, I have subs on my surrounds. You'd be surprised how much content there is.

Thanks for the insights Mojo - always appreciate your opinions.

Editorial addition - Does anyone have experience on the wired vs wireless subs from Axiom? Wireless wasn't an option last time I was buying from Axiom. Now I see I could order a wireless EP800 with transmitter for cheaper than a standard wired version. Why is the wireless cheaper? How reliable is the wireless connection? Open to thoughts on pros and cons, but same performance for cheaper with easier placement options from wireless seems like a no brainer to me - I feel like I am missing something!

I can't speak on the wireless vs wired but I sent back my 500 for the 600. Granted my room is big but I couldn't hardly tell the 500 was there. The 600 was a massive increase in sound parked in the same location as the 500. I'm adding a second 600 in the near future as we are finally putting our theater room back together.

Do not buy wireless.

Did you hear me? DO NOT BUY WIRELESS!

As for 500 over 600, it's not so much about sound pressure as it is about low frequency extension. There is a massive difference between 500 and 600/800 in this respect. You will hear music with the 600/800 like never before. Yes, even in a smallish room.

Funny, I have a 500 upstairs in the family room and always thought it more than adequate for the room (18x18x9). Have 4 600’s in the HT and feel that 4 500’s would have been almost as good. The 500 would certainly have been easier to place. The big difference between the two is that the 600 goes a few Hz lower (in freq that you feel rather than hear).

I always thought my EP500 was also great, but it always annoyed me that it seemed to have a brick wall filter at 19 Hz instead of a roll off below that. Otherwise it has always been great and shook my little TV room.

Assuming I go the upgrade route I'll just go for a horizontal 800. It'll probably be another 10+ years before I upgrade the sub, so might as well not leave anything on the table. ;-)
The other option would be the SB16 Ultra from SVS, but EP800 should be more cost effective with discounts on the upgrade path.

I still don't get why wireless is cheaper than the standard version, but I hear ya Mojo, I always hardwire when possible, but it just seems like a win-win on wireless for flexibility and cost. I assume you say no wireless for connection stability? Any other issues I may not be thinking of?

I hear texture and growling with the 600 and 800 that I can't hear with the 500. And infrasonics are a bonus of course.

Stability and latency are the wireless issues.

Wireless is cheaper because less hardware is required (no jacks and signal conditioning).

I've been really bothered since I found out Rich has 4xEP600. I only have two! So I'm upgrading my four 500s and two 600s to 800s. I'll upgrade my 800 once Axiom introduces the 1600.

Why wait … just stack two 800s to make a 1600.
Think we talked about this before … house mods if the ceiling is too short

I can stack five...horizontally.

I had a 600 in my HT. Swapped it out for 2 EP500's. I prefer the two 500's. I have since replaced the V2's with V4's, and they are an improvement over the V2's by a large degree. The sealed subs are crisper, and less boomy.

I would like to try an 800, but my room just won't fit one. The 2, smaller subs just work better in my room.

And I hate to add this, but will anyway. I've had 6 Axiom subs over the years. Every single one of them required an amp replacement. One needed a driver too. But, they've worked without issue, for at least five years min now, after the amps were replaced.

Was the 600 a v4?

No, V2

I still have it in use. It's in my great room (28X32). Works well in this room.

The 600v4 is nothing like the v2. I punted the 600v2 out of my place with extreme prejudice.

Thanks M for the perspective. This is the 1st issue I've had since buying the EP500 with my full Axiom system in 2009.
Sidenote - I still have my very 1st surround system purchase from ~2001 with a Polk Audio sub which is still cranking. It's been my garage system since the Axioms arrived. While the Polk sub doesn't have the heft and depth of the EP500 it is a very musical sub and continues to work without complaints in that messy uncontrolled garage environment.
Otherwise I'm still waiting to hear from Axiom for details on my various repair or upgrade options. I am curious if there are any 'improvements' in getting an amp replacement even though the DSP will be tuned for my v2 cabinet and driver configuration?

And how much time have you spent with the EP500 V4's?

I like my V2 EP600 just fine. Your hyperbole is a bit much, although expected.

I know nothing about the V2 subs other than what has been posted here…

The V4 subs I’m very happy with … at least so far. The oldest is going strong (think about 7 years now).
My only pause on the Axiom subs are thier list price. But deals can be had especially if you can get a b-stock or refurb when they have a great sale.

I'd love to eventually post a subwoofer shopping article. I'm in the dark about what makes a musical subwoofer, so I'm like everyone else and rely on price and size as an indicator of quality.

That's a terrible place to be as a consumer, being at the whim of marketing and influencers peddling myths that might have been debunked decades ago.

I have 2 EP500 V4's and they are a step up from my V2 and V3 models I had before, albeit they were 350's.

Agreed on the hyperbole. Factual statements are helpful, but a little much at times.

Mojo was warning against doing a wireless sub. Was wondering if he has had any experience with them.
At one point I was toying with the idea of using a sub to augment my in ceiling speakers in the kitchen (if I could find someplace to put it that worked aesthetically). We use the kitchen speakers a lot and they are kind of thin sounding for the space.

I have not used the wireless subs, but have the M3 wireless and have mentioned in other posts that this is not a great product.

I only have experience with my v2 EP500 which is ported. I'd like to move to a sealed sub but would also like lower extension than my current (still dead) EP500 has. I'm still working on resolving which way to move forward on this, but based on some of these comments I'll play it safe and stick with wired connections for dedicated surround setup. I'll leave wireless for the casual listening Sonos units :-) I do really appreciate the input and information I get from the posts back and forth