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Posted By: donjuanmiguel Newbie Sub Question - 12/03/04 01:06 PM
Hi all. I'm a newbie to this forum and to this type of home theatre. I recently purchased a new system for our living room and have been completly amazed at the difference in setup compared to our old sony "theatre in a box" system. This one is much more complex, which makes it painfully fun. My question is this. According to Axiom, the EP350 automatically detects a signal and changes the rear indicator light from red to green. But I've noticed at times the light remains red while I'm playing a movie or cd. Does this mean that no signals are being transmitted to the sub at certain volume levels or that the sub is not receiving them at certain volume levels?

Thanks for the help!
Posted By: Ajax Re: Newbie Sub Question - 12/03/04 02:05 PM
If the light remains red, it probably means that the sub isn't receiving a strong enough signal to turn it on. You might try entering your receiver's "speaker" menu, and turning up your receiver's output to the sub. Then, to keep the sub at the same volume you now have it, turn the volume knob on the back of the sub down a little. See if that makes a difference.

Balancing your speaker volumes by ear usually doesn't yield good results. If you have not already done so you should invest in a setup disk like Avia, or Digital Video Essentials, and the ever trusty Radio Shack Sound Pressure Level Meter to calibrate your system. It would be money well spent, and can make all the difference in the world. This will give you an idea of what I'm talking about. Don't let the technical aspect of this procedure scare you. It's not THAT complicated, and you're fully capable of doing this.
Posted By: SirQuack Re: Newbie Sub Question - 12/03/04 03:37 PM
I've noticed the same thing occasionally, the other night I put in my Journey's Greatest hit CD, and noticed the light was red at the beginning, but after a short bit when the band started to rock "Anyway you want it, thats the way you..."you know the song from Caddy Shack Anyway, then it kicked on, still it is not like watching a movie with a lot of lowwwws. I may try the trick Jack metioned...I think I have the sub on 12 o'clock, crossover on the receiver at 80hz, and I believe my Auto setup and EQ has the sub at a level of -4dB..
Posted By: expatbrit Re: Newbie Sub Question - 12/03/04 03:50 PM
I have an HSU sub, and although it does not exhibit this problem I noticed that in the manual it say's to just leave the sub turned on all of the time if the auto switching circuit does not operate, and that this will not cause any damage. I guess different receivers have different gain levels on the sub output.

Another thing to try would be to crank up the sub level in your speaker level setup, and reduce the power amp gain on the sub amp accordingly. In theory this will give you a higher 'low level' input for the same overall SPL and may cause the trigegr to operate again.
Posted By: SirQuack Re: Newbie Sub Question - 12/03/04 03:56 PM
I could be wrong, but my sub is turned on all the time, it is my understanding that when there is no signal, the light will be red, and when a signal is being sent to the sub, it turns green, I don't believe there is an option to leave the green status enabled at all times.
Posted By: Ray3 Re: Newbie Sub Question - 12/03/04 06:22 PM
This thread is very timely and I could use a little help. I've just noticed that my SVS isn't "woofing" much right now, but I haven't started to problem solve it yet. It seemed to go from solid LFE to "is it on???". Adjusting the sub volume on the receiver by 2-3 db doesn't seem to help. I usually run it +2db and have turned it up to +5db without any noticeable difference. Previously, a .5 or 1 db adjustment was significant.

Here's what I know:
- The sub is turned on (on all the time versus "auto")
- The receiver settings have the sub "on"
- The speakers are all set to small
- The sub gain is set at about 45%-50%
- When I put my hands on the sub, I don't feel or hear much

I haven't changed the way it is set up with the receiver. Directly plugged into the receiver (I'll double check this) and the receiver controls the crossover, which is set at 80. According to the SVS manual, this set up renders the phase adjustment unnecessary on the sub and that has been the case since I got it.

I have it in a corner and the only thing that is different is placement. I moved it just a bit (in the same corner) a few days ago (may be when the problem started). I'm talking a couple of inches either way. I tried moving it around a bit last night, but saw no improvement.

I am just stumped and getting a little frustrated. Any help will be appreciated. On top of everything else, I have a guy coming over Saturday for my first Axiom audition.

Posted By: mace Re: Newbie Sub Question - 12/03/04 07:14 PM
Ray, try switching the phase to see if it makes a noticable difference.
Posted By: expatbrit Re: Newbie Sub Question - 12/03/04 07:26 PM
A couple of obvious things to check:

Phase switch - did you knock it when you moved it? I do not hear much difference with my HSU when I move this switch, even though it's purpose makes sense - worth a try.
Crossover in/out switch - again did this get moved from out (receiver handles crossover) to in (knob on back of sub is active). This could make a huge difference depending on where the knob is set.
Posted By: Ajax Re: Newbie Sub Question - 12/03/04 07:30 PM
Sorry to hear this Ray, I know it makes me CRAZY when my system isn't acting right.

I'm assuming you've done the obvious, like checking all connections including all pertinent ones on your receiver, and 2900. Believe it or not, I'm always kicking the AC cable loose (not out) on the back of my HSU, and end up wondering WTF! If necessary, replace the line cable to see if that is a factor.

Have you whipped out the trusty Rat Shack meter, and your copy of AVIA, to confirm the loss of woofage? Placement can certainly be a factor. I can't believe that moving it only a few inches would make such a B I G difference, but ya never know.

Worst case scenario is that you dislodged something in the sub when you moved it, or that you've got an amp problem in your receiver, but I would think those are the LEAST likely possibilities.

Keep us posted.
Posted By: Ray3 Re: Newbie Sub Question - 12/03/04 08:14 PM
I appreciate the suggestions. The way the sub is connected, the receiver is in control and negates the phase switch (I tried it - it just turns) and the crossover (another knob). The AC cable is OK - I've got a green light. I agree that the hardware crapping out is not a likely cause.

I think my only options are to:
1. Recheck all my connections
2. Fool with the placement some more
3. Failing a solution with 1 or 2, just start over and pretend like I'm connecting from scratch.

If none of that works, I might need to call SVS.
Posted By: donjuanmiguel Re: Newbie Sub Question - 12/03/04 08:25 PM
Wow! Thanks everyone for the great information. I just returned home and poped in Return of the King to test the sub. I cranked it up a bit, not enough to disturb the neighbors, but enough to get full effect. The sub light went from red to green. Maybe, at low volume levels, the LFEs can be handled by the M80s. But at higher outputs, the signals are sent to the sub. I don't know for sure, but it seems logical.

Thanks again!
Posted By: curtis Re: Newbie Sub Question - 12/03/04 08:42 PM
Ray,
How does it negate the phase knob? That phase control works on the signal being given to the sub. I understand that the receiver can set the sub distance...but if you mess with the phase control on the sub, it will mess it up.....kind of like gain control.

BTW....moving the sub just a few inches can change how the sub sounds at the listening position.
Posted By: Ray3 Re: Newbie Sub Question - 12/03/04 10:16 PM
Curtis, Based on your question, I just took a look at the 20-39 PCi manual. Iwas wrong in my initial statement (result of cursory review of the manual yesterday), The crossover switch sholu be set to "disabled", but the phase switch is still operative.

I've been indiscriminately turning the phase knob thinking it had no effect!! That means the solution might be simpler than I thought.

Yeah, I know about sub placement and the difference a few inches can make. That's why I mentioned it. After all the time I spent getting it just right, I should never have moved it.

I'll add the phase knob to my little troubleshooting session tomorrow. Thanks for the tip.


Posted By: Ray3 Re: Newbie Sub Question - 12/04/04 11:03 PM
Well, the subwhimper has transformed to subwoofer again!

I checked all of the connections and everything was fine, so I concentrated on placement and those few inches closer into the corner I had moved the sub appear to be the culprit. I moved the sub back out to about 7" away from each wall and found the sweetspot.

Curtis, I adjusted the phase knob and found negligible difference, but thank you for the suggestion.

Managed to get everything squared away in time to provide a 2 hour audition for my guest (who came bearing Guinness!!!). He is a friend of mine (from work) and we have been discussing his desire to do an HT setup for a couple of months. He was appropriately impressed with the Axioms (and blown away by the QS8s) and the sub (he's never had one). He left with a shopping list (Axioms, SVS sub and a Denon 1905) in hand. It was a GOOD day!
Posted By: Ajax Re: Newbie Sub Question - 12/04/04 11:32 PM
FABULOUS Ray! Stuart (expatbrit) and I were just sharing stories of the improvement we experienced by moving our subs along the sidewall, but away from the front wall. Placement is sooooo important.
Posted By: Ray3 Re: Newbie Sub Question - 12/04/04 11:49 PM
Thanks Jack! I also used your suggestion from above while I was at it. Added some sub in the receiver settings and reduced the gain on the sub itself. Worked very nicely.
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