Can anybody (Customer Council?) explain this scenario to me ... I've purchased an EP350, EP600, four QS8s, a Pair of M80s, a pair of M60s, a VP100 and a VP150 from Axiom over the past five years. Not long ago I had a cover of one of the tweeters on one of my M80s disintegrate for whatever reason and emailed Axiom regarding the tweeter, I get a reply from JC telling me they (Axiom) never ships speaker with bad speakers and the issue came from 'physical abuse' and will not replace the tweeter. OK.

I'm not so cheap as to seek a free speaker ... *but*.

But yet speaker pairs have been given away for FREE to people for reaching 10k post on the forums.

Oh yea, my speakers were under warranty!

Uh. Let me check on that for you.

It's already been checked out and the reply was no.

I should have said "escalate." I'll let you know what I hear via PM.

Ken I'm a big boy, I've spoken with the powers that be but I wanted everybody to know.

Surprising.

Surprising 2.

I was very surprised myself Tom, at the time half way infuriated and really wasn't too worried about it and left it at that.

Now whenever I see meaningless post by folks who've received a free set of Axiom speakers for post counts I can't help but wonder WTF is the deal.

The first thing that crossed my mind was "there has been a mistake made, a misunderstanding, somewhere." That just doesn't sound like Axiom at all.

That's what I also thought Jack, but unfortunately not.

"But yet speaker pairs have been given away for FREE to people for reaching 10k post on the forums."

Where did you hear that folks who have reached 10K posts get free speakers?

Are they resident shills?

Well I don't suppose my free M80s for not posting a lot will make you happy either?






just kidding, I am also finding it surprising.

Pretty much so 2x6 ... just look over to the bottom left and ask any of the folks with 10k post if they've received a free pair of Axiom speakers.

Now ask how many are on the Axiom Customer Council.

So, how about it fellas, Pmbuko, Kcarlie and Sirquack, did you get free speakers?

Guys, I think you are absolutely going after the wrong thing and the wrong people here.

Axiom's generosity has nothing to do with Rick's odd customer service experience.

Rick, did you talk with someone on the phone or only via email? Did they give you a replacement cost? What did you hope to accomplish by correlating your broken tweeter issue with random acts of Axiom kindness?

I'm confused, buddy.

Ya Rick, WTF is going through my head right now too. WTF were you drinking when you posted this? Check my post count and I’ve never been offered anything from Axiom for free. And you of all people also know I'm not a forum fan boy and signed off for good not too long ago. If it weren't for being asked to help with this counsel thing, I would not be around. I’m also not too bashful expressing my opinion, pro or con toward Axiom and their products either.

I’m sure your tweeter issue will be taken care of. I am also quite surprised to hear your story. Ian needs to slap someone up side the head for that. Customer service is what this company is most good at, and crap like this is not cool.

michael_d, you're the exception.

Isn't it interesting how folks react to FredK for marching out of step.

I don't think it is an issue of random acts of kindness, but rather paid cowboys.

Now that I've cooled down a bit -- my initial reaction for being passive-aggressively called out as a good-for-nothing member of this community got me a little riled up -- I feel I can respond rationally. I get that you're angry for being treated in a manner that by all accounts looks to be unfair. As Tom said, Axiom's generosity toward me and others has nothing to do with your customer service situation and the vitriol you have directed toward other Axiom customers is entirely out of line. WTF, indeed.

Not that I should need to explain why I was selected as a Customer Council member, but maybe, just maybe it was for reasons other than the sum total of my posts.

My point is simple ... I wasn't treated square with Axiom and thought *to myself* why should a few self serving individuals be squandered with free gifts while I couldn't get my stuff repaired or considered for repaired under warranty.

That's nonsense.

I just spent the last hour watching 24. Seems I missed more violence here.

Seriously, guys, y'all need to take a breather.

I like 24.

I never thought of RickF as a good for nothing member. But, I guess I don't have the perspective of one who looks down from on high.

The problem is that you didn't just think it to yourself, but posted it. Seriously, do you think Ian himself told JC to blow you off because he'd already used up his generosity quota on us self-serving jerks? It sounds like you're blaming us.

At least I know how you really feel about me now.

If you read my post again, you'll see that I didn't make that claim.

Perspective, that is a good word.

Well at least y'all know now that I'm not pretentious ... one trait I've never been accused of.

Seriously, this is a appropriate time for the Customer Council to step up in support for a long time Axiom member. He is a customer after all. An individual who has purchased a ton of product and has shown his support for this company over the years and offered great advice. RickF deserves better. What is transpiring in this thread and from the council in making excuses is counter productive to resolving his issue IMO.

Good luck RickF. I am willing to bet Axiom will correct their mistake made to you regarding your replacement tweeter issue in the end.

Cheers!

I don't know about that.

I think you secretly play air guitar, pretending to be SRV, myself.

Doc....2 minutes for interference, my post is reg Rick's post.

RickF is not only a customer. Not all Axiom customers are regulars on this board. RickF participates in the Axiom on line community and I suspect he expected that his problem would be dealt with differently - that is to say, that it would not be dealt with indifferently.

I also expect that Axiom will make this all work out right. But in the meantime, oh, a sense of membership, fellowship and community shaken. Also a sense that some are more equal than others.

OK, Doc, here's how it is. My first several posts were me trying to do just that. I have contacted my main contact at Axiom regarding the situation and have heard nothing back. Via this thread and PM, Rick has indicated that he's not interested in my help. Since then, it has been a series of attacks on me, Peter, and presumably Randy.

I didn't ask to get free stuff at 10K. I didn't ask to be on the Customer Council. I'm honored that they chose me. I'm grateful that Axiom has been so generous. And I think what Rick has reported about what happened when he contacted Axiom for help is pretty screwed up. I also think that attacking us for receiving free stuff is pretty screwed up.

As an addendum, the membership on the Customer Council is not a "for life" type appointment. Not sure if that was made clear in the announcement.

I suppose it can be summed in one word - a bit of hurt. OK, I'm not mathematician.

Rick, I'm also astonished at what you experienced, since it appears to be inconsistent with the reputation for customer service that Axiom has worked so hard to earn. Hopefully this is a misunderstanding that'll be corrected.

What is the "cover" on the tweeter?

I wonder if this "cover" is the point of misunderstanding? Rick, you are referring to the actual 'dome' are you not? or is it the dispersal part over the dome? both?

Here's the original thread with pictures that was sent to Axiom ... Tweeter Damage

I try to keep apologizing to myself for ever bringing this subject up but my rebellious instincts and outspoken personality prohibit me from being apologetic ... sorry guys.

That looks like a sharp stick in the eye.

I'd say you have quite the collection of Axiom towers.

2x6 whenever I uncovered the grill I was extremely surprised with the damage ... looks almost shattered to me.

As a newbie here, it has been very easy to recognize the convivial familiarity so many of you long-timers share. We greenhorns look to your experience, sense of humor (to a man) and willingness to engage in just about anything interesting enough to tag a line onto.

That said, I was really surprised to read the exchanges over Rick's tweeter problem.

In a faceless meeting place, things can get a bit skewed. Typing and hitting "send" (and I do mean "hitting") is not even close to being there.

It seems that hardly anyone here was young enough to have been executing primary communcations electronically during their formative years. It's not how any of us learned to communicate, 'cause we all learned to do that in the real world, in real time, with the same facial and physical cues that primates need to know to stay out of trouble.

Everyone made valid points. Not one of you is a dullard or dimwit, so valid points are always around here in spades.

What you guys have shared together is so far beyond Axiom, speakers of any kind, or anything regarding A/V, or A, or V.
Don't let any of that be compromised over a customer service issue on which none of you has the last word.

The rest of us have too much fun watching you shit on each other when no one is hot and bothered about anything.

And see! You ruined Mark's party! I hope you're all happy. I knew there were girls hiding here!

Maybe they'll sell you a tweeter at cost.

Did you use those speakers with the grills on? If so, is there any damage to the grill cover? If not, maybe that little titanium thingie did blow up.

Hi Rick I don’t mean to add fuel to the fire and certainly don’t know all of the circumstances of both cases but feel I should now post this as it is apropos to this discussion.

I had forgotten about your tweeter issue when I had the following exchange over at the AVS forum or I would have mentioned something to you before:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=18330778&highlight=#post18330778

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=18427491&highlight=#post18427491

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=18463336&highlight=#post18463336

The first two posts seem to indicate the first and the second post possibly indicates second tweeter was replaced by Axiom under warranty. I can’t say for sure what exactly the circumstances were in both situations but right now I am very disappointed in how Axiom has handled your situation and think you should have called them out on it much sooner.

I’ve never expected to be treated better by Axiom than any other customer just because I am a member of this forum but at least treat us as well as some non-member who clearly ruined his own speakers.

Rick,

I’m really sorry about what has happened here. This is certainly not the standard of customer service we aspire to for any of our customers, whether forum posters or not. I hope you’ll give us a chance to make it up to you. We appreciate your posts and we feel like you are part of the Axiom family. I’m just sorry you weren’t treated that way this time.

I can assure you that Axiom cares about our customers. It is threads like this that remind us that we need to be on top of our game every minute. We will use this to improve our experience for all customers.

I’ve sent you a private message so we can work out the details of making this situation right.

Sincerely,

Peter Bell

Peter (Bell) has stepped up to the plate yet again, so I hope everything works out. Please keep us posted, Rick.

I do have to say, though, that while this has been the feeling all along (that Axiom will ultimately do right in the end), I still can't help but feel somewhat disappointed. This situation IMHO should never have gotten even remotely close to where it is now.

Stuff happens. I personally can think of more than one situation that I mishandled.

As long as Rick comes back happy and we can go back to derailing his threads, its all good.

Mistakes are made even when you are extremely good at something. Its a part of life and being human. The important part now is resolving the situation and moving on.

Agreed.

But it made for an interesting read, adding a little spice to my dreary morning.

Funny I don't remember seeing that picture Rick posted of the damaged tweeter. As it is tucked up inside the housing, it is pretty hard to damage that area without actually trying to do so, I would certainly have thought it to be damaged from the factory or via shipping, not that shipping damage ever happens . A puncture through the box would go relatively unnoticed if the outer diffuser/case area wasn't damaged.

Glad to hear Axiom is coming to help

Milk them for all you can Rick .

Could it have been caused by some rouge power surge?

Only in Canada which is full of Reds.

Oops, make that rogue.

So does this mean all the site's dinosaurs can play nice again and return to entertaining the rest of us by crapping all over each other with smiley emoticons?

Canada is full of "rouge." Alaska is full of "rogue."

HEY! Let's watch that "dinosaur" stuff. Personally offing several sabre-toothed tigers in my younger days doesn't make me a dinosaur.

As suprised as I was by the story Rick told, Peter's response comes as absolutely NO surprise. I suspect that somehow something slipped through the cracks resulting in misunderstanding. As noted, stuff happens. The measure of the company is how it handles the "stuff."

Without having heard the conversation between customer service and the customer, who can say what transpired that may have lead to Axiom's conclusion that they would not replace the tweeter because of suspected abuse (not covered under their warranty)?

All in all, i think the forum posters tend to be avid and interested audiophiles who are not prone to destroying their equipment (although some do modify their with other components which could also invalidate the warranty). That doesn't mean a family member wasn't responsible in some way, etc. etc.

Axiom does still have to watch out for their bottom line and perhaps there's been a huge increase in driver replacements lately; people cranking up the power for whatever reasons with the mindset that Axiom customer service is so good, they'll just replace something if it breaks anyway so why worry about damaging one's tweeters/drivers?

I'm just playing devil's advocate and granted the idea is far fetched, but jumping onto a 'bash Axiom' bandwagon into the forum without us non-witness bystanders knowing accurately all that transpired, all the information that was exchanged, really just pushes Axiom to have to fix the problem for fear of PR backlash.

I'm glad they will help to fix the problem but Axiom is still a privately owned, for-profit COMPANY.
Gotta keep that in mind.
They can't be everyone's best friend although it is nice that they do try.

That's right!!

I clicked on RickF's link to the tweeter pics but had to click back a few pages to find the right post. This should be a direct link.

http://www.axiomaudio.com/boards/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=286101#Post286101

Sure looks like the dome itself shattered. Never seen anything like that before - although I have seen a couple of *melted* domes in my years.

That tweeter is worth about $10 to perhaps, and this is being liberal/generous, $25 bucks...

The shipping costs more than the tweeter!!!

I'd just buy a new one from Axiom... unless they want $50 bucks for it or something outrageous!!!

WOW RickF has thousands of posts and appears to not be a Meatpuppet... miracles do happen!

RickF this might be a drop-in replacement.

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=275-055

It sure looks like the same beast to me though Ian opted to use a bucket magnet instead of shielding on the Dayton retail part.

I have to add it's also one of the better titanium tweeters around for the money and is responsible for the "good duty" / "bang for the buck" that SOME of the Axiom speaker line exhibit. It's just a shame he got over zealous and decided to over use them in his designs...

Sorta like a mediocre chief that over uses a certain spice in their dishes but hey at $11.20 a 1000 (pure speculation) for such a good sounding inexpensive titanium driver it's somewhat understandable. LOL

Correction

I believe it's this unit.

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=275-045


It really is a nice sounding metal tweet and it's important to note it's very difficult to build an inexpensive metal tweeter. Personally I feel the Peerless HDS from the same ODM/OEM sounds more "natural" and has less "fatigue". Non the less it's still a great tweeter to build a speaker around as many Axiomites already know! It's just s shame Ian uses two of them in the VP150 and M80 to the design's detriment IMHO

Review on the money regarding this tweeter.

"I experimented with these tweeters several years ago with frustrating results. Although the Fs will allow a crossover point of 3,000 Hz. with a second order filter, the sound quality was sharp, shrill and pingy...very metallic and colored. When I applied it in a smaller 3-way (8"woofer,4"midrange),it sounded very nice crossed over at 5,000 Hz. with a second order filter,although proper attenuation was critical. Several years ago, Bill Duddleston of Legacy Audio used a modified version of this tweeter for his "Studio" model speaker and crossed it over at 2,800 Hz. I,however, would not recommend doing that on this stock model. If you're building a small 3-way and are crossing over anywhere above 4,500 Hz or so, then you can't beat the sound for the price."

And I'm sure Ian's motor has been modified like Bill Duddleston design though I'd assume the modifications are different than Bill's.

Hi SolidState,

I'm under the impression that the tweeters are made at their own factory custom built to their designs. While the tweeters from PE look cosmetically similar they may (or not) be up to the same specs so it might not be as simple as a "drop in" replacement solution.

It is possible Axiom does some OEM but that is not public information.

Have a great night.

You think they actually manufacture the drivers!!!

ROTFL !!!

Ian has trouble with basic speaker design! Just take one look at the original Ti xover ROTFL and VP150 and show me another engineer in this entire industry that designed a TMMMT center!

If he can't even get that right it's laughable that he actually designed the tweeter's motor etc as you suggest.

LAUGHABLE!

The phase lens/wave guide is IDENTICAL! ARE YOU BLIND!!!

What's laughable is that you've decided to post here again after a pleasant absence. Nothing's changed, it seems. You're entitled to your opinion, but your attitude and the way you spew your venom at some people here is UNCALLED FOR. It's why you've been put on 'ignore' lists by so many on this forum. The newer members since you split may tolerate you for a while, but they'll catch on soon. You apparently get a charge out of showing how right you are in a rude, aggressive manner. Enjoy yourself for a few posts, then please go away.

I'm the medic8r, he's the agit8r.

While, I agree to some extent, Rick has bought several thousands of dollars of Axiom equipment and if it takes one $25 tweeter to keep him a happy customer, Axiom should have sent him a new one no questions asked. I appreciate the contributions that Rick has made over the years on this forum and would love to see him stay around. I do feel that his comment about Axiom's generosity towards frequent posters was unwarranted.

Nah, I'm not buying it...this guy's a plant just like bbigwyrs, except there's no entertainment value with SS. Dude, with all your laughing and screaming you come off like a cheesy villian trying to take over the world in a bad flick.

I have seen SS posts on a few other forums. bbigwyrs to me seems more of a running joke than anything else. The funny thing is that on another companies forum he leans more towards the apologist behaviour in his posts. Even when a product ends up being a downright abortion as well as a company that has heavily censored their forum of negative opinions.

Just imagine if Axiom made a pre-pro that had some many problems? I wonder how SS would react?

I can guarantee you that the majority of other companies would not let him voice his opinion in the manner like he does here.

I think his head would explode.

SS is clearly a troublemaker with poor social skills. Funny about the timing of his reappearance....NOT!

OTOH, Bbigwyrres, at least has some entertainment value....'xept the time he parked his rig on my front lawn.

JP!! how's the study coming along on these two characters anyhow?

I wish I knew who Bbigwyres was. The Brain Trust has had some ideas. We meet periodically via group PM to ponder that and other items of import, such as how to get free stuff from Axiom.

Is he good for business?

RickF, c'mon back here buddy!!

On it’s initial posts at Audioholics SS was acting like it does here but then looked like it got it’s wee-wee whacked by a mod and changed it’s tune.

Well I guess the dinner table may be a little awkward quiet for the next few nights, huh.

First I have to apologize to everybody for being so harsh, Monday wasn't a good day at all for and having a few on top of that after cleaning out my email didn't make for a good combination. I won't apologize however for bringing this up on the boards because just like the good, I believe the not so good experiences need to be shared as well.

I did speak with the Axiom folks both through PMs as well as on the phone and I simply cannot stress enough just how good these folks really are, which I already knew, so consequently the issue is resolved and taken care of.

Ian, thank you so much for taking a moment of your time to personally look into this.

Peter, thank you for your quick correspondence and resolving the matter ... you are certainly an asset.

JC, thank you for responding and I do believe now it may have just been a misunderstanding of the two languages.

Glad to hear it, Rick. I suspect you're right about sharing not so good experiences. Unfortunately, having been a recipient of Axiom's largess, I'm not so good at doing that myself--and not necessarily good at reading others' bad experiences...

I need to apologize to you also Ken, I didn't mean to single anybody out but it sure came out that way and I can tell you that for an absolute fact I have not one personal issue whatsoever with you or anybody else on the boards.

No worries, I've been there.

Welcome back, Rick.

Ah yes, Canada and the United States - two great countries separated by a common language.

I just stumbled on this thread and once I saw the first post, my immediate reaction was - .."nope, Axiom doesn't work that way and there is a mistake in the equation somewhere that they will fix." And they did - again!!

Now, if we can just get Peter, Ken and Rick to send each other Christmas cards again....

I guess the only disappointing thing about this thread is the NOBODY insulted Mark.

Funny/tempting as that is, I think the second language may be French [Canadian].

Its nice to see everyone hug and make up. Don't forget to close the lights on the way out.

*Click*

Wow, I stay away for awhile and look what happens, now I'm wondering what I have might have missed in the last several months.

Rick, I'm glad everything got resolved, you are one of the most level headed individuals on this forum, and I would certainly miss your posts if you were to ever stay away.

Also to clarify, according to Axiom the type of shattering of the dome was something they had not seen before and initially was suspected to be something similar to a dented dome, hence the 'physical abuse' comment but after a picture of the part was viewed by more than one it was discovered to be something more than that and will be shipped back to Axiom so that they can take a closer look. Hindsight being 20/20 ... what I *should* have done after the initial email suggesting that I did the damage was to call Axiom and take care of the matter in that manner, which I am quite positive it would have been.

We live and we learn.

Michael we all have our moments and I'm certainly no different, I had not intended to leave or stay away ... yesterday was a much worse day than Monday and I just didn't get a chance to make it here to give my explanation with a much leveler head.

Today on the other hand was a much better day.

Glad to have you back with us, Rick!

Kumbaya, my friends!

::We all ran away in a group hug::

Ooh! Ooh! Me! Me!

Mark's so hairy, Bigfoot is taking his picture!

and ...

Mark's so nasty, he pours saltwater down his pants to keep his crabs fresh!

Mark's so psychologically compromised he goes to JP for therapy!

Lucky guy, I can cure any psychiatric ailment for the low, low price of $129.95!

Even the ones you create?

They are the easiest ones to cure.

When the only prescription JP has written in the last ten years is for more cowbell, one wonders what his qualification are.

He's an excellent eater. It seems very important to drug representatives.

Hey, I make hit records.