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#372978 - 04/11/12 08:36 PM Re: Just the Two of Them [Re: 2x6spds]
pmbuko Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 04/02/03
Posts: 16277
Loc: Leesburg, Virginia
Originally Posted By: 2x6spds
More than 50% of the people in this country don't pay any income tax. These are the freeloaders. They are recipients of transfer payments from the productive sector of society.

By this logic, we should consider kicking out of the union states that receive more federal money than they send.
_________________________
"I wish I had documented more…" said nobody on their death bed, ever.

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#372983 - 04/11/12 08:52 PM Re: Just the Two of Them [Re: BobKay]
2x6spds Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 03/16/02
Posts: 2726
Loc: CA, USA
"union states"? I assume you mean states in the union which receive more than their citizens pay to the Federal Government in income taxes. No one is talking about "kicking" anyone out. In a Federal system, states have rights as well. Once the western territories were admitted, there were undeveloped states and economies in the union. You may recall from your high school text books, the problems of regionalism.

Anyway, now we have earmarks and Congressmen who vie for the most pork for their respective districts. The answer is less of our money for the political class to distribute to the objects of their preference.

When the political and cultural elites decide that some sector of society is entitled to preference, and by that I mean transfer of your money (I assume you're among the 50% that pays income tax though I don't know why I make that assumption), they first decide that group is "needy" in some way. Once they decide members of a group have superior rights to the money of individuals who are productive, then we see "group" rights prevailing over individual liberties. Group rights are always at the expense of individual liberties.

Of course, some would say that it is better to be generous. However, for the most part, it is people who are willing to be generous with other people's money who hold themselves out as the most socially conscious.

Of course that leaves the individual with less to give to charities of the individual's choice. Obama intends to end deductions for charitable contributions. That should finish things off pretty well. He and the liberal elites will drive the Catholic Church out of most medical, adoptions and other charitable enterprises, and pretty soon, the only soup line will be the People's Soup Line with a big picture of Obama on the wall.
_________________________
Enjoy the Music. Trust your ears. Laugh at Folks Who Claim to Know it All.

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#372992 - 04/11/12 09:23 PM Re: Just the Two of Them [Re: 2x6spds]
dakkon Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 02/08/04
Posts: 1846
Originally Posted By: 2x6spds
(I assume you're among the 50% that pays income tax though I don't know why I make that assumption)


It is pretty safe to say that if you have the income that allows you to enjoy HT ect, it would be a safe assumption that you are in the top 50% income bracket...

Originally Posted By: 2x6spds

the only soup line will be the People's Soup Line with a big picture of Obama on the wall.


This is a bit fanatical, don't you think? This is even more extreme than my 20$ lettuce example wink

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#372993 - 04/11/12 09:33 PM Re: Just the Two of Them [Re: BobKay]
2x6spds Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 03/16/02
Posts: 2726
Loc: CA, USA
BTW, I figure you for a tax payer.PMB, I'm not so sure about.

Obama is impoverishing this country. People will have to choose between food-stamps and liberty. Narcisists like big pictures of themselves.
_________________________
Enjoy the Music. Trust your ears. Laugh at Folks Who Claim to Know it All.

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#373006 - 04/11/12 11:34 PM Re: Just the Two of Them [Re: pmbuko]
BobKay Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 03/23/10
Posts: 3158
Loc: Massachusetts Badlands
Originally Posted By: pmbuko
Just move to the New England area. smile

I know, I know---all of the languages, histories, and cultures that the six of us don't share. Why, it's almost as good as Epcot! I will admit though, only Vermont adds wood chips to food.
_________________________
"Ya rolls the dice and ya takes yer chanskes."
Popeye

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#373008 - 04/11/12 11:41 PM Re: Just the Two of Them [Re: 2x6spds]
pmbuko Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 04/02/03
Posts: 16277
Loc: Leesburg, Virginia
Originally Posted By: 2x6spds
"union states"?

My sentence was perfectly grammatical. "kicking out of the union" and "states that receive..." are two separate clauses. You may recall clauses from high school English.
_________________________
"I wish I had documented more…" said nobody on their death bed, ever.

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#373010 - 04/11/12 11:43 PM Re: Just the Two of Them [Re: 2x6spds]
pmbuko Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 04/02/03
Posts: 16277
Loc: Leesburg, Virginia
Originally Posted By: 2x6spds
Anyway, now we have earmarks and Congressmen who vie for the most pork for their respective districts. The answer is less of our money for the political class to distribute to the objects of their preference.

When the political and cultural elites decide that some sector of society is entitled to preference, and by that I mean transfer of your money (I assume you're among the 50% that pays income tax though I don't know why I make that assumption), they first decide that group is "needy" in some way. Once they decide members of a group have superior rights to the money of individuals who are productive, then we see "group" rights prevailing over individual liberties. Group rights are always at the expense of individual liberties.

I'm in 99% agreement with you on this. Pun intended.
_________________________
"I wish I had documented more…" said nobody on their death bed, ever.

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#373070 - 04/12/12 10:55 AM Re: Just the Two of Them [Re: BobKay]
nickbuol Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 09/16/04
Posts: 4473
Loc: Marion, IA
Dakkon, my comment about the number of non-tax paying illegals here in the US is only one factor. I will tell you this, I would rather pay just sales tax than sales tax AND income tax. Even here where the city adds a percent, paying 7% for purchases vs. 18% (or whatever income tax is) AND 7% for purchases.

Let me say this. This country was built on immigration. We shouldn't close our doors, we should in fact make it EASIER to come here. YES, EASIER! But also make it easier to get citizenship. Easier to get legit SS#'s, easier to be a legal part of this country. Then put up strict laws and strict enforcement of those laws for anyone who is here illegally since there is no reason NOT to be a legal (income tax paying) citizen. Instead we have a system where getting citizenship is difficult (at least according to Hillary Clinton) and these people actually don't WANT to be a citizen because they don't want to pay taxes (general statement folks, obviously some of them want to be citizens). They make more money by not going through the hassle of becoming citizens.
_________________________
http://ht.buol.us
M60s, VP180, VP150, QS8s, SVS 20-39PCi, HTPC, JVC RS45, Onkyo TX-NR709, Shakers

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#373071 - 04/12/12 11:08 AM Re: Just the Two of Them [Re: nickbuol]
dakkon Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 02/08/04
Posts: 1846
Originally Posted By: nickbuol
Dakkon, my comment about the number of non-tax paying illegals here in the US is only one factor. I will tell you this, I would rather pay just sales tax than sales tax AND income tax. Even here where the city adds a percent, paying 7% for purchases vs. 18% (or whatever income tax is) AND 7% for purchases.

I feel ya on this one nick, our local sales tax is 8.25%!!!...


Originally Posted By: nickbuol

Let me say this. This country was built on immigration. We shouldn't close our doors, we should in fact make it EASIER to come here. YES, EASIER! But also make it easier to get citizenship. Easier to get legit SS#'s, easier to be a legal part of this country. Then put up strict laws and strict enforcement of those laws for anyone who is here illegally since there is no reason NOT to be a legal (income tax paying) citizen. Instead we have a system where getting citizenship is difficult (at least according to Hillary Clinton) and these people actually don't WANT to be a citizen because they don't want to pay taxes (general statement folks, obviously some of them want to be citizens). They make more money by not going through the hassle of becoming citizens.


I would agree with this paragraph, like i said before.. Many of the people that are coming here, just want a better life for them as well as their families... Which, was the reason people migrated to north america in the first place... There was also some religious fanatics that wanted to "spread the world of god"... i don't feel that people immigrating specifically want to avoid taxes. I think this is a ridiculous though processes.. People would rather avoid taxes, so they can constantly live in fear of deportation and have to be constantly looking over their shoulder....? i think this was proven by the GA and Alabama immigration policys that were instated last summer as well... Those states had a mass exodus of immigrants....

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#373114 - 04/12/12 01:03 PM Re: Just the Two of Them [Re: nickbuol]
medic8r Offline
axiomite

Registered: 02/05/06
Posts: 6396
Loc: Fredericksburg, Virginia
Originally Posted By: nickbuol
From a statistics perspective, I was told that only one time in history was a president up for reelection and he didn't win.

You were so close! Well, not really. It's happened eight times:

George H.W. Bush lost to Bill Clinton in 1992.

Jimmy Carter lost to Ronald Reagan in 1980.

Herbert Hoover lost to Franklin D. Roosevelt in 1932.

William Taft lost to Woodrow Wilson in 1912.

Benjamin Harrison lost to Grover Cleveland in 1892. (Sweet revenge!)

Grover Cleveland lost to Benjamin Harrison in 1888.

John Quincy Adams lost to Andrew Jackson in 1828.

John Adams lost to Thomas Jefferson in 1800.

In addition, Gerald Ford lost to Jimmy Carter in 1976, but as Ford was appointed to the Vice Presidency and then assumed the Presidency when Nixon resigned, Ford was never elected President and therefore was running for election, not reelection.
_________________________
"The Universe is the game of the self, which plays hide and seek forever and ever" - Alan Watts

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