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#372787 - 04/10/12 06:36 PM Re: Exciting News From Axiom! [Re: Amie]
Adrian Offline
axiomite

Registered: 12/27/08
Posts: 6600
Loc: It's all about the location.
Tom is a fan of beer. period.
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Half of communication is listening. You can't listen with your mouth.

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#372788 - 04/10/12 06:37 PM Re: Exciting News From Axiom! [Re: Andrew]
dakkon Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 02/08/04
Posts: 1844
Originally Posted By: Andrew
Originally Posted By: dakkon
If i remember correctly mark, the parts Andrew was looking at to have an "in the field update" would have been considerably more expensive.. So they will update the DSP at the factory, and also put the box on the test bench after the update to verify everything took prior to returning the unit.


I couldn't have said it better myself!


You did say that... i have been paying close attention to your posts crazy

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#372789 - 04/10/12 06:38 PM Re: Exciting News From Axiom! [Re: dakkon]
Andrew Offline
Axiom Engineer
veteran

Registered: 12/18/01
Posts: 171
Originally Posted By: dakkon
Andrew, can you say what the minimum impedance of the front speakers will be?


Don't quote me on this, but I believe it's around 3.5 ohms. This could change depending on the final crossover values. And yes, I'm still tweaking! wink

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#372790 - 04/10/12 06:39 PM Re: Exciting News From Axiom! [Re: dakkon]
Andrew Offline
Axiom Engineer
veteran

Registered: 12/18/01
Posts: 171
Originally Posted By: dakkon
Originally Posted By: Andrew
Originally Posted By: dakkon
If i remember correctly mark, the parts Andrew was looking at to have an "in the field update" would have been considerably more expensive.. So they will update the DSP at the factory, and also put the box on the test bench after the update to verify everything took prior to returning the unit.


I couldn't have said it better myself!


You did say that... i have been paying close attention to your posts crazy


Hmmmm...did I just quote quoting myself then? grin

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#372791 - 04/10/12 07:02 PM Re: Exciting News From Axiom! [Re: Andrew]
MarkSJohnson Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 09/27/04
Posts: 10832
Loc: Central NH
Originally Posted By: Andrew
Hmmmm...did I just quote quoting myself then? grin

I'm not surprised.

Considering that you're tweaking and all. grin
_________________________
::::::: No disrespect to Axiom, but my favorite woofer is my yellow lab :::::::

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#372800 - 04/10/12 07:37 PM Re: Exciting News From Axiom! [Re: Andrew]
dakkon Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 02/08/04
Posts: 1844
Originally Posted By: Andrew
Originally Posted By: dakkon
Andrew, can you say what the minimum impedance of the front speakers will be?


Don't quote me on this, but I believe it's around 3.5 ohms. This could change depending on the final crossover values. And yes, I'm still tweaking! wink


Ok, i am "looking" at a ksa 250... 250w @ 8ohm, and doubles down to 2,000W @ .5ohm....

The gain on that amp is 24dbw.. and the smaller amp is 25.8dbw...

I am not sure if i want to get the KSA 250.. It is a pure class A amp which would be nice; but I have read that it needs a dedicated 12A breaker... i will have to call and verify this....

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#372816 - 04/10/12 09:47 PM Re: Exciting News From Axiom! [Re: Amie]
JohnK Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 05/11/02
Posts: 10361
Thanks Amie, for posting Andrew's very informative discussion on "What Does That Thing Do, Anyway", which many of us have been wondering about. This info and further details which are to come can certainly help prospective purchasers to be more confident and others of us to be able to suggest that it be seriously considered.

Just to put some numbers on the cancellation effect between the front and back drivers which Andrew pointed out as a flaw in some previous designs using a back driver array, a basic point is that two drivers playing the same frequency will partially cancel when separated by about half the wavelength of that frequency. The mid-range drivers in the LFR1100 are separated(from centers of their cones)about 25". The wavelength affected would be about 13,600(speed of sound in inches per second)/25, or about 540Hz. So, a partial cancellation would occur in the lower mid-range around 270Hz, with the effects Andrew described. The DSP processing compensates for this and other effects by modifying the frequency response of the back drivers.
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Enjoy the music, not the equipment.



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#372876 - 04/11/12 10:50 AM Re: Exciting News From Axiom! [Re: JohnK]
cb919 Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 02/17/09
Posts: 1041
Loc: Ottawa, Canada
I have been reading this thread and trying to learn, but I'll be honest and say my 1000 foot view of these speakers is muddy at best. Mark touched on this before when he asked about room acoustics, but that's where my logic falls apart.

With the DSP, I understand that you can get around the cancellation effects of front and back drivers and get the family of curves approaching optimum in an anechoic chamber. But doesn't that all go out the window as soon as you introduce room acoustics/reflections? Andrew (or anybody who actually understands this), can you explain to a dumb@ss like myself how all that careful DSP mapping in controlled conditions still has benefit when introduced to a real listening environment? To be clear, i am not being critical, I just don't understand. I still very much want to hear these bad boys since I missed them at the show (friggin Utah trip mad)

Thanks!
_________________________
Dan
In/On Wall 500 w M2 Center Channel

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#372887 - 04/11/12 12:12 PM Re: Exciting News From Axiom! [Re: cb919]
BlueJays1 Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 09/19/08
Posts: 4070
Loc: Porch,enjoying Bombay Sapphire
Originally Posted By: cb919
I have been reading this thread and trying to learn, but I'll be honest and say my 1000 foot view of these speakers is muddy at best. Mark touched on this before when he asked about room acoustics, but that's where my logic falls apart.

With the DSP, I understand that you can get around the cancellation effects of front and back drivers and get the family of curves approaching optimum in an anechoic chamber. But doesn't that all go out the window as soon as you introduce room acoustics/reflections? Andrew (or anybody who actually understands this), can you explain to a dumb@ss like myself how all that careful DSP mapping in controlled conditions still has benefit when introduced to a real listening environment? To be clear, i am not being critical, I just don't understand. I still very much want to hear these bad boys since I missed them at the show (friggin Utah trip mad)

Thanks!


While the room is ultimately on your end, the family curves are very important to predict how the speaker will ultimately sound in a room because they deal with the direct, early reflected and late reflected sound of the speaker. The direct, first and late arrivals is ultimately makes up what we hear.




_________________________
I’m armed and I’m drinking. You don’t want to listen to advice from me, amigo.

-Max Payne

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#372964 - 04/11/12 06:44 PM Re: Exciting News From Axiom! [Re: BlueJays1]
cb919 Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 02/17/09
Posts: 1041
Loc: Ottawa, Canada
OK, I'm still blurry on this but that helps. Does this hold for an analogy - kinda like performance tuning a car, it may perform better or worse depending on environmental conditions (temp, moisture etc...) but in general will perform better when tuned than in untuned stock trim?
_________________________
Dan
In/On Wall 500 w M2 Center Channel

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