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#77509 - 01/17/05 12:30 PM "Stereo's Intrinsic Flaw"
Riffman Offline
local

Registered: 04/26/04
Posts: 242
Just read it in the news forum.

I find stereo the easiest path to improving sound via better components without punishing my wallet. Better sound in two speakers is better than worse sound in five.

Do you agree that Axiom has an obvious motivation for pushing five channel music? When asked, why does Axiom push the A/V receivers, such as Denon, etc.?

A stereo forum does exist here. I give Axiom credit and praise for this.


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#77510 - 01/17/05 01:02 PM Re: "Stereo's Intrinsic Flaw"
LT61 Offline
aficionado

Registered: 02/23/04
Posts: 836
Loc: Illinois.
I still listen to my music, and movies in "stereo".....and it is my main interest here as well. ( most of my posts are stereo, sound, and cd related).

In my opinion, without "home theater".......the "stereo" business would be in trouble. I see MOST companies "gear" leaning in that direction, plus when one looks in MANY high end stores....their "stock" reflects this.
I think the denon leanings here, may be due to the M80's 4 ohm design, and power requirements.
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#77511 - 01/17/05 01:06 PM Re: "Stereo's Intrinsic Flaw"
Riffman Offline
local

Registered: 04/26/04
Posts: 242
I see your point and it sounds like we agree that stereo seems to be dying at least at the mass market level. I have been looking for stereo intergrated amps and what I have found out is that they aren't as prevalent. The two shops where I live very little in stereo equipment. One only had the little Rotel.

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#77512 - 01/17/05 01:19 PM Re: "Stereo's Intrinsic Flaw"
bigjohn Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 01/21/04
Posts: 3016
Loc: San Angelo, TX
well, i think you guys need to also look at market trends. i mean, 5 years ago, the HT market was fairly small, and unknown.. but now, it is possibly the hottest thing in home entertainment. i think the manufacters push toward 5-channel receivers is because thats simply what the consumers want. and with that receiver , you can still just use it for 2-ch, but you have the option and versatility to set-up a 5-ch system also.

i dont necessarily think there is any "flaw" in the system, i just think consumer expectations have changed. and technology has changed.. i look at it almost like records to cd players.. or TV antenna reception to cable reception.. i dont think the former will EVER go away, but the latter is definitely what most or more people will desire. so, they are just giving us what we want. just my opinion..

bigjohn
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#77513 - 01/17/05 01:25 PM Re: "Stereo's Intrinsic Flaw"
Foghorn Offline
local

Registered: 07/17/04
Posts: 226
"Do you agree that Axiom has an obvious motivation for pushing five channel music?"

Yes. And I agree that it is the home theater possibility that got me (and presumably many other consumers) to look into the audio market. But I basically see it as the industry giving the consumer what they want. That's what businesses do.


"When asked, why does Axiom push the A/V receivers, such as Denon, etc.?"

I don't think they do per se. Denon and HK also make two channel stereo receivers that meet the needs of most consumers that are interested in "just" stereo. I have not heard (read) any pushing of AVRs over 2 channel receivers if it was clear that someone wanted stereo. I just think that home theater is what is bringing most of the consumers to the marketplace so that is the "default" mode, if you will, of most of the people in the industry.


"I find stereo the easiest path to improving sound via better components without punishing my wallet. Better sound in two speakers is better than worse sound in five."

I totally agree, but unless I was REALLY sure that I would not want to ever upgrade to more channels I would start with an AVR and two good front speakers. There is no downside to an AVR and I'm convinced (based on no scientific data) that my cheap CD player sounds better when hooked to an AVR via optical (Toslink) connection (not available on a 2 channel receiver) than it does when connected by analog connections to any receiver.

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#77514 - 01/17/05 01:26 PM Re: "Stereo's Intrinsic Flaw"
Foghorn Offline
local

Registered: 07/17/04
Posts: 226
Bigjohn beat me to it while I was typing....

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#77515 - 01/17/05 02:17 PM Re: "Stereo's Intrinsic Flaw"
Riffman Offline
local

Registered: 04/26/04
Posts: 242
Big John, people don't really want a buggy windows based pc that you need to spend time cleaning all the junk and spyware pushed on it because of its crappy security but...they buy it over the much more secure and easy to administer Apple PCs anyway.

They buy it because they are told to buy it because of mass marketing. There's a reason why companies spend billions of dollars on advertising. And all of the advertising is going into home theatre.



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#77516 - 01/17/05 02:19 PM Re: "Stereo's Intrinsic Flaw"
Riffman Offline
local

Registered: 04/26/04
Posts: 242
Oh but they do. OK, maybe they don't. Today, I just read that Alan has said all receivers are the same. I also remember reading about Alan's recommendations here for the Denon A/V. Trust me, I'm not being critical or think this is necessarily a bad thing. Some things just don't square up.


Edited by Riffman (01/17/05 02:20 PM)

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#77517 - 01/17/05 02:33 PM Re: "Stereo's Intrinsic Flaw"
bigjohn Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 01/21/04
Posts: 3016
Loc: San Angelo, TX
agreed.. we could spend lots of time trying to argue both sides of the fence.. bottomline, i think there is a fair amount of weight to each side of the argument. are the consumers buying more HT cause thats what we want...? YES. are the HT companies packaging and marketing the products to us in a way that make us want to buy...? YES.

i think in your comparison between the windows and the apple, there are other factors. the biggest(in my opinion), being that most people are simply used to windows.. its what most of us first learned on. its what they are using in most schools, and it is what most of us know.. so, in that example, it seems that people continue to buy windows cause thay are comfortable with it, and they know how to use. apple might have less problems, but trying to learn how to use it represents a whole new set of problems. make sense?

i think we both have valid points.. trust me, i aint trying to argue that. i am just offering my opinions.

bigjohn
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EXCUSE ME, ARE YOU THE SINGING BUSH??

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#77518 - 01/17/05 02:45 PM Re: "Stereo's Intrinsic Flaw"
Riffman Offline
local

Registered: 04/26/04
Posts: 242
Part of what I'm getting at is the marketing efforts obviously aimed at removing the level of interest in stereo. Labelling an article "Stereo's Intrinsic Flaw" sounds like marketing and an agenda to me when it comes from a speaker manufacturer. Don't get me wrong, a company that makes 2 channel amps is going to tell you the exact opposite. Its business.

Then, what you have is someone who has a limited amount of money to spend who is waffling over home theater or stereo and decides to get more speakers and lesser quality components in order to have home theater.

Like I said before, my belief is that, for music, higher quality stereo is preferable to more speakers. With limited budgets, people make the sacrifice and mid to hifi suffers. I simply wonder how much of this is because these people really wanted to do this - just so they can watch a few movies.


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