You can be sure that in your comparison with a pure direct mode in effect and MCAAC, Audyssey or other processing intended to change the sound not present that the sound of music through the 876 would be as pleasant as it is through the Pioneer if the unit was operating properly.
John, you clearly have a strong grasp of the tech side of amp design, and I don't mean this to challenge your opinion on that front in any way. I just want to open up this discussion a bit (although I know you are likely tired of having this discussion anew every month.
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But have you considered that the Pioneer and the Onkyo and the Denon and the Lexicon, etc., etc., use different parts in the signal chain before the amp and thus sound different? I understand that a competently designed amp should sound the same. (Although I still don't get how a Class A sounds just like a Class B, A/B, D, and H?) But why does Burr-Brown offer a large number of different DACs, at wildly differing prices based on claimed audible improvement. Why does Denon use different DACs as you move up the line to Burr Brown's top end chip.
In a different arrangement, Lexicon's flagship processor claims "Each output uses two 24-bit/192kHz digital-to-analog converters operating in dual-mono mode. This design provides an improved signal-to-noise ratio and extended dynamic range, resulting in superior sound quality." Is this an inconsequential change as compared to cheap AVRs that use 1 8-channel DAC? I don't know. Maybe it is all hype, but but I can think of a lot of hype that would go further than a change in DACs.
I find it very persuasive that companies like Wolfson offer many DACs and even to the untrained eye, they are not all the same. Their cheap DACs offer SNR/THD(db) rate of 98/84 while the better DACs offer 106/95.
Wolfson That is a huge difference. I have seen unofficial references to the lower cost DACs selling for $.02 a piece, while the higher end DACs cost $10 a piece. So if NAD (random pick) use 4 24-bit 2-ch $10 DACs while the Sony (again random) uses a single $2 16-bit 8ch DAC so they can profitably include the $5 video chip (which NAD eschews), then I would expect the NAD to sound better - even if the amp sections alone sound 100% identical.
In real terms, the Denon 5800 series uses 2 B/B PCM-1796 DACs per ch. But the Denon 1909 uses Analog Devices ADAU1328 DAC, while still other Denons up the chain use B/B PCM-1791 DACs.
Denon Onkyo says the PCM-1796 "improves tolerance to clock jitter."
Burr Can you hear that, or am I just getting sold by the Deaf Monk again?
If we were talking about an analog phono input into directly into an analog amp, I could buy into the concept that all would sound roughly the same. But "its all ball bearings these days".
How one chip decodes the 1's and 0's and converts that into the subtle sound Peter describes from the violin is a function of complex math, and the companies claim some chips do it better. I don't think it is all the same and Peter's experience bears that out.
And this is only one part (albeit a huge part, I think) of the signal chain. Doesn't it matter during a dynamic passage if one amp section uses small capacitors versus large on another? What about the the transformer? What about the interference caused by large transformers in the same cheaper box as a the DAC chip? Why do some amps fail to drive a 4 ohm load, and do they sound the same up to the instant they shut down. I just can't buy it. The weight of the evidence seems to say the "all amps and AVRs sound the same" argument is tied to a by-gone era when all was analog and low powered.
I all seriousness, I look forward to your response as I value your input.
And thanks Peter for taking the time to publish your experience. I don't think your report does anything to undermine the Onkyo owner's experience or the product. If technically possible, I would hope the various products would have different personalities as each buyer can work those into their needs and buying decision. On a more lifeless speaker, the Onkyo may add the sparkle needed to improve the sound, etc.
