Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Advice from Axiom Owners W22 instead of QS8 for rear 7.1 HT

Have many questions and I would like to start with this:
Room size is 22' x 10' x 7.5' H
Thinking of this system:
M60 Front
VP 150
QS8 for sides
EP350
W22 for the rears or would the QS8 rears be a better "fit"?

VP 150 over a proj. screen, pointed down ?

Thanks.
dg

With movies I believe the qs-8's would be hard to beat. BUT I have not heard the W22's.

DG, welcome. The W22s should be very good for rear surrounds. The QS8s provide plenty of dispersion for general ambience and more directional speakers in back would give a more precise location for specific sounds that are meant to be heard in back(although QSs certainly do an adequate job even with those).

As to the center channel speaker, although a VP150 over the screen and pointed down certainly works, my suggestion would be to consider a vertical M60 under the screen if there's enough room or an M22 if there isn't.

From a very small sample space, people with lots of distance between the back of their seating position and the rear surrounds seem to be very happy with direct (eg. W22) rear surrounds; people who have the rears closer seem to prefer QS8s because the sound gets diffused a bit more and so the surround effects are more "natural"...

... if that helps.

I enjoy my Q's for music and HT for the rear channel, they do a great job when using PLIIx or other decoding like DDEx or DTSEs. Ideally, it is best to have the tweeters on the center and mains to be as in-line as possible, I would not agree to put an M60 vertical as a center, it would work best to keep it standing and just raise the screen.

>>I would not agree to put an M60 vertical as a center, it would work best to keep it standing and just raise the screen

Isn't that what "vertical" means ?

From Merriam-Webster Online

vertical
5 entries found for vertical.
To select an entry, click on it.
verticalvertical anglevertical circlevertical filevertical union

Main Entry: ver·ti·cal
Pronunciation: 'v&r-ti-k&l
Function: adjective
Etymology: Middle French or Late Latin; Middle French, from Late Latin verticalis, from Latin vertic-, vertex
1 a : situated at the highest point : directly overhead or in the zenith b of an aerial photograph : taken with the camera pointing straight down or nearly so
2 a : perpendicular to the plane of the horizon or to a primary axis : UPRIGHT b (1) : located at right angles to the plane of a supporting surface (2) : lying in the direction of an axis : LENGTHWISE
3 a : relating to, involving, or integrating economic activity from basic production to point of sale <vertical monopoly> b : of, relating to, or comprising persons of different status <the vertical arrangement of society>
- vertical noun
- ver·ti·cal·i·ty /"v&r-t&-'ka-l&-tE/ noun
- ver·ti·cal·ly /'v&r-ti-k(&-)lE/ adverb
- ver·ti·cal·ness /-k&l-n&s/ noun
synonyms VERTICAL, PERPENDICULAR, PLUMB mean being at right angles to a base line. VERTICAL suggests a line or direction rising straight upward toward a zenith <the side of the cliff is almost vertical>. PERPENDICULAR may stress the straightness of a line making a right angle with any other line, not necessarily a horizontal one <the parallel bars are perpendicular to the support posts>. PLUMB stresses an exact verticality determined (as with a plumb line) by earth's gravity <make sure that the wall is plumb>.

All one needs to rememmber is Bob Segers song Horizontial Bump and figure vertical is just the opposite.

I'm surprised no one has yet suggested putting a second VP150 for the center channel, one above the screen and one below. I'm sure I've read it here on the forum before. That should give you more than enough "presence" and fit better than trying to turn the M60 on its side. LOL!

>>> I'm surprised no one has yet suggested putting a second VP150 for the center channel, one above the screen and one below. I'm sure I've read it here on the forum before. That should give you more than enough "presence" and fit better than trying to turn the M60 on its side. LOL! <<<

This has been discussed several times here on the boards and actually I believe Ian has a couple of VP150s mounted in this manner.

I don't understand JohnK's affinity for vertical centers...

I think he likes matching speaker L/C/R. I thinks it sense.

Yes the only way to ensure a perfect match of left main, center, and right main is to use the exact same speaker in all 3 positions. I believe there are a few other reasons he prefers a vertical center, but I can't remember them at the moment.

I use a horizontal center and am completely happy with it. Would I claim it is a perfect match to my left and right mains? Nope. Do I notice any difference between it and my left and right mains? Nope!

Hi Ajax,

You stated:
"Yes the only way to ensure a perfect match of left main, center, and right main is to use the exact same speaker in all 3 positions."

I'd preface that comment with "In theory, the only way. . .etc."

But in reality, the vertical center that's identical to its two mates at the front will still be subject to all the vagaries of placement (boundaries, the TV screen, walls, etc.) that prevent any three identical speakers from sounding absolutely the same, at least using a pink-noise test signal, when they are in slightly different positions in the room. Noobies are often puzzled why their speakers sound different when fed a test signal like pink noise.

The real test is whether through experimentation with placement you can get the center and the two mains sounding enough alike that with movie soundtracks or music there are no tonal or timbral deviations that will distract you from enjoyment of the music or movie.

Regards,

Agreed! I KNEW I should have mentioned placement differences.

Interesting - I noticed a tonal shift over the weekend when doing a little maintenance tweaking using a pink noise signal. The left M60 sounded different than the right M60. The left speaker is about 1.5 feet from the left wall and abotu a foot from the subwoofer, whereas the right speaker is butted up next to a chaise lounge that partially covers the lowest woofer - there is no wall on the right side. The tonal shift was minimal, but noticeable nonetheless. Obviously, the pan from left to right, through the VP100 mounted at mid-m60 level exhibits some shift as well, but when playing "real" material, I don't notice any difference between the left and right speakers at all.

To add to the original poster's question - I think the In-wall speakers would be a great addition to a 7.1 system. The low profile means that the couch doesn't have to be as far from the back wall to get optimal performance. The downside, of course, is that you really can't aim the speakers by using a wall mount, like you coudl if using a direct firing M2 and the FMB.

In reply to:

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I use a horizontal center and am completely happy with it. Would I claim it is a perfect match to my left and right mains? Nope. Do I notice any difference between it and my left and right mains? Nope!

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You have a very nice RSC200!
<<Drivers: Vifa Ring Radiator tweeter, one custom 4" midrange and two custom 6.5" long-throw aluminum cone woofers >>

My center is below the tv. About the level of the lower mid on the 80s. Above the tv it would be 15 inches above the 80s.

Should I use a 2nd center above the tv to even out the balance?

In reply to:

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You have a very nice RSC200!

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Just noticed that Jack is sitting on top of a reeeeally nice EP500 and yet his profile says "former Axiom owner". Things that make you go hmmmmm?

Good point Bruce. I will change it to former Axiom SPEAKER owner, Assuming I still have enough space to add the word "speaker."

The EP500 is still a speaker, isn't it .

When you guys come to agreement, will you please tell me what you want me to say. Sheesh!

Strictly speaking he is a former "former Axiom owner"...

Sort of a "tried the rest, came back to the best" sort of thing...