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Re: If you had a choice on subs
TroyD #150463 11/02/06 04:27 AM
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I'm not going to go into why your incorrect about freq's below 80hz being not directional, but just an fyi, they are not, and there are plenty of articles from AV professional engineers and scientists which can prove your wrong with factual statistics, not just blah blah blah.

nuf said


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Re: If you had a choice on subs
SirQuack #150464 11/02/06 04:27 AM
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And with Blue ray and the 8 audio channels there has to be a way to have 2 or 3 mono low frequencies channels. And the Reciever engineers and sound engineers have the capabilities and technology to make it happen. if not move over George Lucas, I will show you what sound is spose to be heard like. There problenm is they are stuck on hearing the sound , well I want to feel the sound too, hell I would even like to have fans in my room that are sound controlled so when there is a breeze they come on ..yeh right

Re: If you had a choice on subs
TroyD #150465 11/02/06 01:07 PM
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... and from there it's only one small step to 5 channel smell-o-vision.

I said 5 rather than 5.1 because I sure wouldn't want to be sitting near the smell-o-vision equivalent of a subwoofer


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Re: If you had a choice on subs
SirQuack #150466 11/02/06 02:47 PM
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"I'm not going to go into why your incorrect about freq's below 80hz being not directional, but just an fyi, they are not, and there are plenty of articles from AV professional engineers and scientists which can prove your wrong with factual statistics, not just blah blah blah."

I am just going by what the sales people mention and actuall some conniseurs here mention that if I bought one EP 500 or 600 and position it well I should not notice the direction that the sound is coming from. But, you can tell.

I deally I should have 7 subs and not use the LFE on the amp. Hook all subs up via the speaker wire from that specific channel to the line level on the sub and then use the crossover in the sub. That way when sound goes to the left rear channel and the frequency goes say below 120 hz I hear bottom end in the channel in that specific location. Or if there is a bomb going off on the right hand side of the screen the RF RR RR channel subs would all produce some bottom end and the left channel sub wouldn't do anything. Why produce bottom end sound from a sub on the left when the bomb is going off on the right side of my screen.

Re: If you had a choice on subs
TroyD #150467 11/02/06 04:34 PM
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I think one of the elements that you may be missing is that an explosion isn't one incredibly deep frequency. It is a loud sound that is made up of many, many different frequencies, quite a few of which will be well above your LFE crossover. *Those* frequencies emanating from your speakers will provide the aural clues that the explosion is happening off to the right.

The deep rumbling bass will just ripple through you, but those other frequencies will be what make you turn your head to the right. Ever been in an earthquake? I used to live in the Bay area. Trust me, I was never able to discern the direction of the epicenter based on hearing/feeling those very, very low frequencies.

Regards,
Rich

Re: If you had a choice on subs
samandnoah #150468 11/02/06 06:26 PM
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I'm willing to entertain the notion that frequencies below 80Hz could be directional. I'm sure there IS a lower limit, but I'm not necessarily committed to the idea that 80Hz is IT for Everyone. It's just too convenient.


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Re: If you had a choice on subs
tomtuttle #150469 11/02/06 06:33 PM
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Quote:

I'm willing to entertain the notion that frequencies below 80Hz could be directional. I'm sure there IS a lower limit, but I'm not necessarily committed to the idea that 80Hz is IT for Everyone. It's just too convenient.




No doubt, and I absolutely concur. Rather than what frequency is the cutoff, I was really focusing on the fact that we get clues from multiple sources, and that a bomb exploding wasn't a single pure frequency.

Re: If you had a choice on subs
samandnoah #150470 11/03/06 12:38 AM
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Frequencies starting around 80hz and below are omnidirectional. This has been discussed many times and confirmed by Alan from Axiom on many of the Axiom Newsletters. Also, if you do a google search, or check websites like Audioholics, Ecoustics, etc., this has been covered on the topic of bass management. On reason that 80hz is the norm, and setting speakers to small, is because the smaller drivers CAN'T move the air like the sub's larger driver. This is the purpose of the sub, to MOVE air. You feel this and it is NOT directional. Believe what you want Troy, but your are incorrect, and most likely what your hearing, what Rich describes, is not true LFE below 80hz. The hip/hop *** you listen to is NOT LFE, just an fyi.

A good test is put in Styx's Renegade and listen to the first minute, that is low stuff. Or put in Nemo and watch the seen where Darla is tapping on the Aquirium, now that is killer LFE and it will go right through your bones. You can not tell the direction of the source.


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Re: If you had a choice on subs
SirQuack #150471 11/03/06 03:15 AM
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As has been said, those very low frequencies are omnidirectional. The reason that we can locate a bass drum, etc. which has a very low fundamental frequency is that the higher harmonics of the fundamental(reproduced by the regular speakers)are directional, as Rich suggested.


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Enjoy the music, not the equipment.


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