Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Advice from Axiom Owners Axiom owners w/ Outlaw 990?

Please feel free to read either version.

The Short Version:
Do any Axiom-ites use the Outlaw 990 pre-pro? What do you think about it? Any problems? I want to hear about how much you love it. Convince me to buy one.

The Long Version:
I've had my Pioneer Elite 43TX for about 4 years now. It's a fine receiver, it always does what it's told, sounds fine, and never complains. But it's getting a bit long-in-the-tooth and I think I'm ready to get a real pre-pro. The manufacture date is 2002. In January I finally upgraded to M80's and found that at moderate-to-high volume levels that the Pioneer just couldn't keep up and the SQ would fade quickly. Knowning this, and not wanting to break the bank, I ordered an Emotiva LPA-1. Made a wonderful difference.

Two weeks ago, I ordered an Emotiva LMC-1, which is their low-priced pre-pro designed to complement the LPA-1 amp. I ordered it somewhat on a whim, 'just to see...'. Sonically, I loved it. Its software quirks, however, were irritating. Even after tinkering with with macros on my Harmony remote, I couldn't get enough WAF to get an 'approval' rating from her. So, sadly, it went back.

It absolutely spoiled me. It didn't really hit me until I sat down and did some critical listening this weekend. I'm actually tempted to re-order it, bugs-be-damned.

I know some people will claim that pre-pro vs receiver shouldn't make a difference, but darnit, my system just doesn't sound as rich and open anymore. Ignorance is bliss. It doesn't sound bad, or worse than before, but I just really liked the amazing detail, open-ness, and increased presence that the LMC-1 provided. It brought such a clarity and crispness to music - especially to SACD's. Yes, yes, everything is set up correctly and re-calibrated. Like I said, it's not like something is *wrong* with my Pioneer, it just doesn't sound as pleasant as the LMC.

So, I'm doing some scouting for a pre-pro. I'm coming to the stark realization that I'm not going to spend $500 on a decent prepro that has the features and SQ that I want. The LMC was so tantalizingly close. Emotiva's own MMC-1 ($1200) looks tasty, but it too has a couple of software quirks that I'm not too thrilled about (lack of distance controls for the sub, poor pink noise generator, no bass management on EXT 7.1 inputs, etc). I've also been in contact with someone that owns both the LMC-1 and MMC-1, and they claim that even under hard-core A/B comparisons of the two, they are hard-pressed to notice any sonic differences between the two, though they prefer the MMC with its vast feature set. I'm not sure whether that's a compliment to the LMC, or a slam agains the MMC. Either way, the MMC is 2.5 times as expensive as the LMC, and that's a lot of money for a couple of bug fixes and more buttons on the front.

So at the moment, I'm taking looking at Outlaw. I *know* that they have a good reputation and have been around for years. At $1,100, it still isn't cheap but it's a lot better than the $2k+ pre-pros from other companies, and a $100 cheaper than the MMC. I've been browsing the Outlaw and AV123 forums to find advice, but it's usually pretty biased one way or the other (no surprise).

So does anyone have experience with the 990? Do you like it? What don't you like about it? Does the auto-setup work? I know there have been some tweaks to the bass management - do you like it? If you have any DVD-A/SACD material, do you use the 990's Bass management for this? If you're a *real* geek, do you know what chipsets the 990 uses for DSP and D/A converting? I'm having a hard time figuring out whether the 990 is actually 'newer' than the MMC. The 990's been out for a couple of years. The MMC was just released, of course, but it's heavily based on the DMC, which is a couple of years old too. So I'm curious which DSP chipsets (D/A converters, etc) they use, to figure out which one might be newer/better.

Short version: I love mine, you should buy one.

Peter

I'm not nearly at the level of technical expertise that you appear to be by your thread. However, I will tell you that I went with Outlaw components (990/7500 combo) and am very happy with my setup. I have the M80/VP150/QS8 combo for my speakers. I feel that the 990 brings out much greater detail than my pervious receiver which was an older Yamaha. I tried that as pre/pro with the Outlaw amp and the sound was so much "thinner." It played louder but sounded "tinny." I think you'll be happy with the 990, but they have as good a group of people to help you at Outlaw as the fine people hear at Axiom. They're technical people are very helpful so if you'd like give them a call, or e-mail them, with your questions. They'll be very happy and capable of giving you some good answers. They are also great at making the return of their equipment very easy. I first had the 7125 amp but decided to go with the beefier 7500 when it became available. The exchange could not have been any easier. I was very satisfied with their customer service. So if you try the 990 and don't like it, giving it back within the 30 day trial window is not a heavy lift.

Hope this helps and good luck with your decision. Sorry I'm not more technical savvy. Oh, by the way, the DAC is from Crystal (I believe).

I think you will like the 990. If you go to the outlaw site and check out the manual for the 990, you could get all the technical information you may need. I'm not a salesperson, but you are the one to convince on whether you should buy it or not.

Semi short version:

I love mine. Works great, sounds great, never a problem. Also have the Outlaw 7700, M80's, VP150, QS8's, EP600, and an M&K MX-200 sub also. The bass management thing was a non issue if you ask me. I never had a problem. I did however upgrade to the latest firmware. Couldn't tell a difference but it works fine.

I run a Denon 2910 DVD Player, Optical for DVD movies DD, DTS etc..... and DVD-A, SACD in Direct Pure Mode to the 7.1 channel input. Love it. Also run a Squeezebox 3 via Coax. It sounds great. Tried both Coax and Optical and can't tell a difference. But the analog from the SB3 wasn't as good as the 990's decoding. I've read much to do with people raving about the SB3's DAC and while it is good, I much prefer the 990's DAC. I generally don't delve too far into the super techy things. This is a blurb from the 990 page:

Audio Converters
Digital to Analog: Analog Device AD1852 24-bit/192kHz
Analog to Digital: AKM AK5380
Digital Remastering Chip: Analog Device AD1896

A quick Google should give you plenty of techno stuff on those chips.

I do not use it for any video switching but the guys at the Outlaw hangout board seem to think it works fine. Though no HDMI, just DVI. Not a big concern for me as I run HDMI direct to my plasma. Needed a bit of lip sync tinkering with the 990 and it handles it fine.

Until the whole HDMI 1.3 issues get resolved I don't think any one is going to invest a lot of time and expense to throw it into a Pre / Pro. Maybe for some it's an issue but I think at this point an external switch would do the trick too.

BTW, I use mine 80/20 music/movies. Well mastered/engineered/recorded music sounds wonderful no matter what the format.

Thanks for the info, Robert_W. I appreciate it!