Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Advice from Axiom Owners Separate amp for the fronts make a difference?

I have had my M60's, VP150 and and QS8's for two years and am very satisfied. (Sub is SVS) My receiver is a Denon 3805 and DVD/CD player is the Denon 3910. Again, very satisfied with the system. I've been reading where a separate amp for the fronts sometimes would help. Any comments? Everyone says the M60's are easy 8 Ohm speakers to drive. Would I hear a difference with a separte amp for the fronts?

Paul it depends on who you ask. I would say at lower to moderate levels most may not find much difference. A lot depends on your environment and listening preferences.

For me, I have found that a good solid state seperate amp has better dynamics and headroom overall, especially at moderate to higher levels. They just don't run out of gas or clip like an AVR with everything crammed into one case.

Since the wife travels during the week, I like to crank them up. Weekends they are in the low to moderate level. And the room is not huge 12' by 18'.

Are you happy with the performance when you crank things up, or do you think the Denon is not up to task?

No, I am happy with the sound and I think the Denon does a good job. I think it may be more of "Am I missing something else?" "Would it be a noticable difference?" And maybe a little upgradeitis.

I highly doubt it would make any difference, especially since you are running a sub. Unless, of course, you have a very large listening room, or play it at extremely loud volumes and the bass sounds flabby when you do so.

How loud could you possibly want to go? You're in a room that is less than 2000 cubic feet.

Yea, that's what I thought. And the size of the room was one reason I went with the M60's vs. the M80's. I guess I was thinking what to do with the tax refund. Maybe a pair of the M22's outdoor speakers for the pool area

I run a Rotel amp @ 330 watts per channel in a room of the same size. I never have to worry when I'm in the mood to really turn it up.

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Yea, that's what I thought. And the size of the room was one reason I went with the M60's vs. the M80's. I guess I was thinking what to do with the tax refund. Maybe a pair of the M22's outdoor speakers for the pool area

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Not a bad idea!! You'll only notice a difference with separate amps if you like to crank the system often.. I have the 3805 and I hear it start to strain near its limits when running the M80's. Since you've got the 8-ohm M60's you'd notice even less of a difference than I did.

A Denon 3805 is a darn good receiver, and M60's aren't a hard load to drive. My initial reaction is that no, a seperate amp won't do much for SQ.

However, there's no substitute for actual experience with your ears on your equipment in your home. If you're curious about the dedicated amp route, I'd strongly suggest you check out the fine amps from Emotiva or Outlaw Audio, any of which come with full 30-day return policy. Buy one (or a pair of monoblocks) and see for yourself. You might be out return shipping, but you will cure your curiosity.

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I have had my M60's, VP150 and and QS8's for two years and am very satisfied. (Sub is SVS) My receiver is a Denon 3805 and DVD/CD player is the Denon 3910. Again, very satisfied with the system. I've been reading where a separate amp for the fronts sometimes would help. Any comments? Everyone says the M60's are easy 8 Ohm speakers to drive. Would I hear a difference with a separte amp for the fronts?

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or amps from Odyssey Audio.

Randy, did you get your amp yet? I'm looking forward to hearing how it compares.

It should be here tomorrow I think. Klaus had to leave for Germany earlier than expected on a recent trip and did not get my amp all the way past his QC stages. He called me personally before the plane took off and said he was going to do something special for me when he got back, basically give me some additional options from the higher Extreme mono's.

One thing that people don't understand is that Klaus himself, as well as a few other people build these amps one by one in Klaus's shop in Indianapolis. He has a very high quality control process and does not run into some of the component control problems of products manufactured in China. Your only getting the best available, no substitutes, and everything is checked/tested over and over before it leaves the shop. The 20year warranty is pretty cool as well.

Good suggestions. Since I will be getting some outside speakers, I'll need another amp anyway. I'll try the amp on the M60's, and if I do not notice much of a difference, I'll have it to drive the outdoor speakers.

I got this reply after inquiring about a 2 channel amp for my rig in comparison to a 5 channel amp. "If you use two different amps for your system, you could get a gain imbalance which would destroy the sound stage, so it would be better to use one amp to run all the speakers that has matched gain stages." I thought I would run this idea through this menagerie just to see what you guys and gals think. Has anyone who uses a 2 channel amp to run your front speakers encountered a soundstage problem?

Say what huh? I've never heard that one before.

littleb,

They probably think you are an ignorant consumer. The imbalance that can "destroy your soundstage" can easily be equalized utilizing an SPL meter and setting your levels in your pre/pro.

It harkens back to whether not you believe that amps make a difference in sound quality at 'normal' volumes.

Those that believe that different amps do change the sound quality would say that using different amps for different speakers would cause SQ problems. It's likely that any response from an amp manufacturer will follow this logic, as they all believe that their amps sound the best.

Those that believe that amps are neutral to the sound would say that their email response is hogwash. Just as Hutzal said, in this case you can certainly use different amps for front and rear, provided that you do make sure you calibrate the channel levels. Input gains may be different, and that would lead to different speakers needing more or less trim. On my LPA-1, for instance, the 6-7 channels have a slightly lower input gain (by design) than channels 1-5, which means I have to bump up my rear channels a few DB during calibration. It's not a big deal, and it sounds great.

When I first got my LPA-1, I ran my system with it powering the mains + center and my AVR powering the surrounds for a few days, due to lack of interconnects. I had no problem with soundstage what-so-ever once recalibrated. The calibration levels were definitely different than before, but it worked. I suppose if you had two amps of wildly different input gain levels, you could have them so mis-matched that your pre-pro/AVR didn't have enough adjustment to compensate.

Yeah Bruce, that reply appears to be nonsensical. Different amplifiers can easily vary 2-3dB in gain, just as speakers can vary in sensitivity. The purpose of calibration is to balance the sound levels at the listening position despite such variances.

littleb: that was really a BS answer. Not much more can be said!!!