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Re: Denon 3808CI – one week later
terzaghi #186659 12/04/07 10:44 PM
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You may have the gain control on the 500 turned up too high and the Denon is trying to compensate by setting it to -12.


House of the Rising Sone
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Dedicated mid-woofers are over-rated
Re: Denon 3808CI – one week later
Mojo #186660 12/04/07 10:47 PM
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Definitely a possibility,
However, I had the gain set at about 50% during the auto set up so I am not sure.


-David
Re: Denon 3808CI – one week later
terzaghi #186662 12/04/07 10:55 PM
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50% on the EP500 is still very loud, you could try it at a lower setting,25%, just to see what the Audyssey does.


Jason
M80 v2
VP160 v3
QS8 v2
PB13 Ultra
Denon 3808
Samsung 85" Q70
Re: Denon 3808CI – one week later
jakewash #186667 12/04/07 11:41 PM
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It seems that no matter how I configure settings on my EP600, or where I place it in my room, I always get -12 with Audyssey. It really tames bass for music which sometimes is appropriate, but sometimes, not. If I feel that I need to adjust to taste i.e. to -6 or so I have to go to "Manual" on my Denon because I can't stand the red Audyssey indicator on the front pannel when "Audyssey" settings are tampered with. That's just me though.


"Never, never, never give up "... Winston Churchill
Re: Denon 3808CI – one week later
cgrface #186672 12/05/07 01:22 AM
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hmmm. when does the audyssey indicator turn red? I usually just click in the circular channel button on the remote and adjust the bass from there.


-David
Re: Denon 3808CI – one week later
terzaghi #186709 12/05/07 03:52 PM
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It's at that level because that what it's supposed to do....balance ALL the channels. Until you verify with a SPL meter, all you are doing by changing that setting manually, is guessing.

Re: Denon 3808CI – one week later
michael_d #186713 12/05/07 04:26 PM
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This may not help you with Audyssey but it may help you with sub set-up.

I have an Epic80-600 and I've had one heck of a time getting "tight" bass in my 4,000 cubic foot room. I've been experimenting the last week and have found that by setting the cut-off in my Denon and on the 600 to 40Hz, I can achieve very tight bass. I also found that I had to turn the gain control on the 600 to about 7 o'clock and the gain on my Denon to 0. My previous settings were 10 o'clock, -7 on the LFE channel, 80Hz on the Denon and by-pass on the 600. The full setting works best for my case.

I find that when I turn the gain knob of the 600 up, the bass has too much "overhang" (technically called a long settling time). But I don't have the same problem if I turn the Denon's LFE gain up.

To really experience this tightness, I have to turn the main gain of the Denon up (over 20W/channel). This is extremely loud in my space and I can only do this when everyone is out. But with the previous sub configuration, even when I turned it up it wasn't tight. It was just more full.

Blending between the 600 and 80s is the same...astounding! However, I have lost some "transparency". Prior to doing this, string bass lines had their focal point in the front of my soundstage but nonetheless "floated all around me". Now, I don't have that "bass everywhere" feeling. This just convinces me even more that I can't have bass tight and transparent...at least not in my space.

By the way, this 40Hz setting is great for music and movies. I have found that in scenes like explosions and gunshots, the bass is not as full but it hits very hard...much harder than 80Hz. The criticism to this of course would be that I am missing some action from my QS8s between about 40Hz to 70Hz but I haven't found this to be a problem practically.


House of the Rising Sone
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Dedicated mid-woofers are over-rated
Re: Denon 3808CI – one week later
Mojo #186717 12/05/07 04:43 PM
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Tex, that is some very valuable analysis. Thank you.


bibere usque ad hilaritatem
Re: Denon 3808CI – one week later
Mojo #186719 12/05/07 04:49 PM
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That just means it's time to upgrade the Denon to a newer unit that allows multiple crossovers. I just saw Outlaw has the 970 PrePro/7125 Pwr Amp for $1385 delivered to my door(I was so close to buying it, but the sub must come first)

I just tried to get my sub to match up the M80s at the 40hz mark yesterday and I couldn't even get my sub to match the SPL! I had to increase the level in the receiver to do it and it sounded incredibly awful!

I could have swore I saw something about Santa Ian offering 20% off on the EP500 to those of us with such sucky subs;\)


Jason
M80 v2
VP160 v3
QS8 v2
PB13 Ultra
Denon 3808
Samsung 85" Q70
Re: Denon 3808CI – one week later
jakewash #186730 12/05/07 06:37 PM
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Yeah, Jason that's exactly what I was thinking too. I always thought that multiple x-overs were over-rated but now I think differently.

The problem with the 500 is that it wouldn't fit down your chimney \:\) .


House of the Rising Sone
Out in the mid or far field
Dedicated mid-woofers are over-rated
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