Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Home Theater Over-the-air HDTV tuner?

Okay, I guess I am in the middle of a shopping spree these days.

Has anybody have an experience with the OTA HDTV receiver (set top box)? Six months after getting the 720p front projector, I am finally getting into the HDTV arena.

I am lucky to live in Dallas, where virtually all OTA digital TV stations are broadcasting from one direction (the Cedar Hill antenna park). My home has excellent signals for all network DTV channels. So, instead of upgrading my satellite dish for HDTV, I just installed an old-fashioned UHF/VHF/FM antenna in the attic -- costed $150 but got one of the best signal levels that the installer said he had ever seen. Most importantly, these DTV signals are absolutely FREE!

So, now I have to buy an OTA HD tuner/receiver. Can't decide between the models from Samsung and Zenith. Any suggestions?

I envy you sushi! New car, new speakers, and now high def!

If you are doing DirecTV now, why not go with a DirecTV high-def receiver? Most of them also do OTA high-def as well. You can then get high-def from your dish if you choose to do so, and OTA.

-curtis

Tell me about it. Next thing you know, he'll have one of these!

I thought he had one already. hehehee

I believe he uses it as a universal remote.

Sony's is cheesy. I prefer this one.

Curtis, I have the Dish Network, but plan to unsubscribe it altogether, except for its TV JAPAN international service, which my wife refuses to abandon. This will save over $40/month. Nevertheless, I will see what are available as Dish/OTA combo. Thanks!

I suggest you buy one of each and do an A/B test. By the way Sushi, we're all looking forward to a full report of the results.

Looked at some Dish/OTA options. The ones that are available now are all overpriced, previous-generation models. However, several promising ones seem to be coming in November -- the Dish 811 at ~$300, and the Dish 921 with TiVo-like HD PVR at ~$1000 (way too much for me anyway).

But the Samsung and Zenith are both available NOW for $300-350. Umm... I am almost clicking the Add To Cart button.

By the way, who's TiVo/Replay addict here? I've never owned one -- is it useful???

TiVo good. Very good. Grunt.

It's extremely useful. No rewinding, fast forwarding tapes, trying to keep track of them, forgetting to tape or watch things when you're out...

That, and you don't have the cultural references to commercials any more.

However, I recommend that you get one with a larger (60 GB or more) HD in it, and then upgrade it when the warranty goes out. I've got a 60, and we're always running out of space.

I could go on, but people who don't have TiVos seem to hate that. ;-)

I am a TiVo addict. I have the DirecTV model. Dual tuners, record two things at the same time while watching a previously recorded show....plus all the TiVo functions. The dual tuners is specific to the DirecTiVo models.

I can not imagine TV with out it now. Picture quality is outstanding with the DirecTV model because it is all done in the digital domain. I actually watch less TV now than before....no channel surfing. And I always have something good for the kids to watch. A hi-def model should be out soon.

Ok, after reading this thread, I had a dream last night about that ASIMO robot that Sushi linked to.

Basically, Japan is still pissed that they were beat during the last war, and have been plotting revenge for the last 50 years. The best way to do it? Build an army of clone robots! (Just watched Star Wars again, sorry) But here is the kicker (Stated by the Japanese Colonel) - "We will make them love us with our exceptional cars and electronics! The enemy will finance their own demise! And we will build them right in their own backyards!" (The Accord plant in Ohio, and the Odyssey plant in Ontario)

Now before the rants start - accusing me of being an ignorant, paranoid bigot, please note: The dream was more of an entertaining movie/cartoon than a bolt-up sweating nightmare. I find the Japanese people and culture facinating and their products are amazing. (save for speakers)

Ditto on the hijacked thread Tivo praise. DirecTivo with upgraded hard drive. Anyone who's into TV of any kind needs a Tivo.

I had the RCA DTC-100 HD DirecTV receiver and while it was decent, the transition from OTA HD to sat was not very well implemented. Very nice pictures coming OTA though.

Sushi, just buy both and make sure the company has a good return policy. Return the one you don't like.

Frank

You know, one of the problems of HD TiVo-like PVR is the huge storage space that the HD bitstream requires. The recording time is approximately 1 hour/10GB. So, the Zenith 80GB unit (the first in this category) holds only ~8 hours of HD contents. Is it still worth ~$800?

sushi,

From what I have seen and read, I would not consider any PVR device that did not use TiVo's technology.

That said, I do not think 8 hours of recording time is enough. I have changed the harddrive in my DirecTiVo to an 80gb, which ends up being around 70 hours of recording time, and it is perfect for me and the kids.

-curtis

Yeah, I've read that the Zenith doesn't even come close to a real TiVo with respect to the PVR functionality. Okay, so when the heck is the real HD TiVo (I mean, from the TiVo brand) going to be released??? And with what HD capacity?

sushi,

I don't exactly know when the HD DirecTV PVR is coming out. I had thought it was suppose to be available by the end of the year. Since I do not plan on doing HD for a year or so, I have not been following it. You can try the TiVo forum....www.tivoforum.com

-curtis

Do you think TiVo plans on an OTA-only HD tuner/PVR? I have zero interest in the DirecTV.

I know I can visit the AVS or TiVo forums... but hey, the Axiom forum is supposed to be omnipotent, right?

omniscient, at least.

Yes...I understand a standalone HD TiVo is due out too....just don't know when.

But you have to do the DirecTV versions to get the dual tuner capabilities......that is a GREAT feature.

I see... Just out of curiosity, does DirecTV charge you more on subscription fees if you use the dual-tuner feature, which I agree sounds great?

And Peter, yeah, that's the word!

If you do not subscibe to their highest package, they charge a "DVR" fee of $5/mo.

One thing about TiVo....you can't really understand it(well you probably can sushi) or appreaciate it, until you use it.

In reply to:

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I don't exactly know when the HD DirecTV PVR is coming out. I had thought it was suppose to be available by the end of the year.

---

You might find the third post here helpful:
http://arstechnica.infopop.net/OpenTopic/page?a=tpc&s=50009562&f=67909965&m=5760982585

SOLD! I just cancelled my regular cable (Comcast) and ordered DirecTV with TiVo. Comcast is raising their rates and it's just not that good a deal anymore. I think we'll really like the new service. It gets installed Saturday in 2 weeks.

My wife has been bugging me about routing cable into the bedroom, so I ordered the 2 receiver package. Only one of them has TiVo, though. I bet she'll want that one in the bedroom. We shall see. We shall see...

You guys are lucky. No TIVO in Canada. Got the CRTC to blame for that.

Canadians' lives are so great that they shouldn't need the escapism provided by TV. Every time I learn something new about president Bush, I need to check out from reality for an additional year.

Another vote for DirecTivo. I have the Sony SAT-T60 upgraded to 110 hours. I still have all of Sopranos 5th season on it. Love my 45TX, but it's a toss up which is the true "god box"...

I too will wait for the HD DirecTivo, but that means another cable run

LOOK OVER YOUR SHOULDER!!!!!
maybe someone is watching.......

yeah...don't forget. You will need two cable runs from the dish to the DirecTiVo box...one for each tuner.

You guys without TiVo do not know what you are missing. Find someone that has it, and get a demo.

Oldskool...you are not using the dual tuners now?

Sushi - to answer your original question, I have the Samsung unit you posted a link for - had it for almost a year. I got it because of price point (it is one of the most attractively priced STBs for just ATSC reception) as I just wanted to stick my toe in the OTA HD water and didn't want to go overboard until I'd had a taste.

The amount of HD content OTA has risen dramatically over the last year, and even if it is not HD, the SD digital picture is far superior to the analog equivalent. As far as the Samsung unit goes, mine has worked without a hitch. It has the reputation of being in the top 2 of tuner sensitivity to lock on to distant stations. As an example, I live in the western foothills of the Sierras about 40 - 50 miles east of Sacramento. I get all of the Sacramento market channels without a hitch, and also get the Bay Area (San Francisco) digitals at night and even sometimes during the day (over 100 miles to the towers). Granted, I have a little antenna height based upon my elevation, but certainly not a clear view to that antenna farm.

At this price point, you get just ATSC and component out (no DVI). It has both coaxial and fiber audio outs, as well as the standard analog. Also has S-Video and composite (but who cares...).

I also have HD from my C Band system via 4DTV and it's associated HD decoder for HBO, Showtime, Discovery, etc. and the PQ is the same for the Samsung. Monday night football is stunning in HD with DD 5.1 sound.

I'd endorse the Samsung just from being a happy user. If you have any specific questions, let me know.

Doug

pmbuko,

Clark has made it official. He's going to run. This may be the first person from either party I'm excited to vote for, assuming he can pull off the nomination. Of course, that fact undoubtedly means he won't win the nomination, but I'd still have to consider anyone with him as a running mate.

I need to learn more about Clark. "Real People"(tm) seem to be excited, and from my initial research (Google), so am I. Everybody loves an intelligent, respectable, military guy with charisma. It doesn't hurt that he is critical of how we handled/are handling Iraq , either.

I agree with curtis. Not long ago I laughed at the idea of $12 a month just for the Tivo service. But after switching to DirecTV with DVR2 Tivo a couple months ago, I'd *gladly* pay the extra money (though I don't have to )

Did you get the DVR2?

Be prepared to never leave the couch!

Check this out if you are really curious:

http://www.tivocommunity.com/

There was only one option for DirecTV with TiVo. It did say I coulre record two channels at once, though.

The DVR2 is the only one you can get now new. The original DirecTiVo is no longer being made. Not a whole lot of difference in the two....the new one has some capabilities in the hardware that have not been utilized yet.

Did the original have dual tuners? For me that sealed the deal. When my cable company went to digital delivery for anolog service (don't ask), I could no longer watch one show and record another. With the DVR2, 2 shows can be recorded simultaneously while watching a 3rd! None of the standard Tivo units can do that.

Yes...the DirecTiVo hardware always was dual tuner, but the software was not able to support it until later. The software has been capable for almost two years now I think.

The standalones do not have dual tuners, but they do have some other functions that are nice that the DirecTV units don't.

Hehehe... Just ordered the Dish/OTA combo unit directly from Dish Network for $298 -- one less box cluttering my electronics shelves. James, a new member here (don't know his handle name yet) informed me of the end-of-product-life sale for the unit; thanks, James! I didn't want to wait till a decent OTA PVR model comes out anyway.

Doug, thanks for the detailed info. I would surely have bought the Samsung, if I weren't aware of the Dish promo.

In response to:

----------------------------------------------------------
Every time I learn something new about president Bush, I need to check out from reality for an additional year.
----------------------------------------------------------

(Courtesy of Rick Mercer from This Hour Has 22 Minutes)

On behalf of Canadians everywhere I'd like to offer an apology to the United States of America. We haven't been getting along very well recently and for that, I am truly sorry.

I'm sorry we called George Bush a moron.

He is a moron but, it wasn't nice of us to point it out. If it's any consolation, the fact that he is a moron shouldn't reflect poorly on the people of America. After all, it's not like you actually elected him.

I'm sorry about our softwood lumber. Just because we have more trees than you doesn't give us the right to sell you lumber that's cheaper and better than your own.

I'm sorry we beat you in Olympic hockey. In our defense I guess our excuse would be that our team was much, much, much, much better than yours.

I'm sorry we burnt down your white house during the war of 1812. I notice you've rebuilt it! Nice Job.

I'm sorry about your beer. I know we had nothing to do with your beer but, we Feel your Pain.

I'm sorry about our waffling on Iraq. I mean, when you're going up against a crazed dictator, you wanna have your friends by your side. I realize it took more than two years before you guys pitched in against Hitler, but that was different. Everyone knew he had weapons.

And finally on behalf of all Canadians, I'm sorry that we're constantly apologizing for things in a passive-aggressive way which is really a thinly veiled criticism. I sincerely hope that you're not upset over this.

We've seen what you do to countries you get upset with.

Thank you

No problem Sushi. I get my Dish Network 6000u with the OTA card on Saturday. I will let you know how it goes. For $298 I too could not pass this deal up. I just got my Mit. 65413 2 weeks ago and was very anxious to see how HD looked on the set. I am very happy with how SD D.N. programs look. I will still use my PVR receiver for SD programing though.

By the way, I have been a long time luker on this board. I bought my M60's, VP150 and Q8's about 2 months ago. After I got my speakers I felt that my Onkyo 777 did not do them justice, so I picked up a Parasound 2205 amp (220W X 5). They sound soooo much better now.

I've said it before, and I will say it again, when it comes to this site, please keep yer political views to yerself..
Equipment, music, reviews, drugs, sex and rock n roll, whatever.. But PLEASE, "NO" freakin Politics !!!
This site is known for it's simplier easy going ways, and the last thing we need is The Mother Of All Flame Wars to end it all..
Nuff said... (I hope)..

curtis, i have 2 runs to my SAT-T60. I had structured wire run when I moved into the new house. it has 2 cat 5, 2 fibers and 2 RG6 coax, all run into my hall closet. every room is wired. EXCEPT, I failed to run 2 extra RG6's to the wiring closet for the HD, since I wasn't sure if I need it, still debating on that...

If you run HD and DirecTivo, make sure you run enough cable, before and after the multiswitch. You only want to open your walls once.

I agree that politics is more personal than even feelings about break-in. I apologize for littering.

However, instead of banning it completely, someone should start a politics only thread with the disclaimer ENTER AT YOUR OWN RISK...

And I appologize for jumping in after Peter's start. But after reading my post, most people would realize that it was purely satirical, eh. Sorry if I offended anyone. I'm of to the Elsie Be Oh.

Au contraire, Mikey lol. Real's post was one of the most amusing I've read on this board in quite some time. Loosen the neck tie a few notches and have a pint or two, eh.

Cheers.

You hoser, eh! Go Sens go!

Cheers.

? Que pasa Jose ?
No worries mate, I like good political humor as much as the next.. It's just so refreshing to find a place that is free of all that clutter.. Besides, we put enough 'spin' on our reviews of our stereo gear to keep the planets in their orbits for the next millenium..
As for the tie, weddings and funerals, eh..

curtis,

what outputs does the DirecTiVo unit have on it? I don't have very many options left on my TV or receiver (which doesn't support s-video switching to begin with). I'm thinking I'll have to buy an external s-video switch box -- which would also accomodate the X-Box. Right now, I have to disconnect the DVD player from the TV in order to play X-Box.

It has for video, composite video, S-video. And for audio, standard stereo analog, and optical digital.

I'll definitely have to get that S-video switch. And I guess it's back to analog with my CD player.

Get a new receiver! It is a good excuse.

I'll see what I can do.

"Honey, the guys on the speaker forum say I should get a new receiver so I can hook up all the equipment and not have to swap cables any more. I think it's a good idea. What? You don't think it's fair that I get to spend money on myself? Well, you've had a complete monopoly on our son for the past 6 months with three more to go! You call that fair?"

You think that argument would work?

Give it a shot. And then if you are still physically able, let us know what happenned.

Hey Peter, how about this one:

"Honey, scientific studies have PROVEN that listening to Mozart has a positive effect on children, especially infants. It would be irresponsible of us NOT to provide a suitable listening environment for our son. We could upgrade the main system and move the old receiver into his room".

Go ahead. I double-dog dare ya.

'Spin" is what keeps the planets in orbit Mikey. Agree about the tie.

Cheers.

Well i did try that once. Long ago Semi_on mentioned to me that " I should grow a sack" about a HT issue I had with the fiancee. I did tell her what Semi_on said and ask me where this post was. She did read it over. She has been0 gathering information for the last couple of months on any clues of who,what,where Semi_On is. She plans to visit him one day to ask him personally what it takes to "Grow a Sack".