Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Advice from Axiom Owners M60 v2 with...

dear users,

having considered purchasing a pair of M60's, and not knowing the fundamental difference between receivers, amplifiers, ohms and tons of channels and characteristics, i would like to know what should i look for to hook up these speakers.

my main goal is stereo music, considering a denon avr-2809 or a yamaha dsp-ax863se, for example. to this i would connect a decent turntable (rega p1 is to my budget already decent), a cd player, probably a tuner (if it's not already in the amplifier) and that's it.

now i have two possibilities: multi-channel receiver/amplifier or stereo amplifier. a shop owner told me stereo amplifiers are always better quality and too much inside one of these a/v does it no good. but maybe in the future i want to migrate to a surround system. that's a possibility. what's not is purchasing a second amplifier for this purpose if the one i'm about to consider is stereo only.

what do you guys think about this? what should i look for to connect the m60's in a modest price range? i'm not an audiophile, so i can't spend too much money on expensive brands.

to all of you m60 owners, what amplifier should i use, and also what cd player, turntable?

i'm thinking of buying but will only do in 4 months time. should we have this conversation later on because of new models coming out or should i be aware of price opportunities, like the yamaha amplifier i mentioned?

thank you very much in advance to all of you.

best regards,
tertuliano.

Given that you only want to drive two speakers, I would buy a second hand receiver for now. So many people are selling their older receivers to upgrade to the new bluray formats, that quality slightly used receivers can be had for cheap.

You will not be able to notice any difference in sound quality between a 2 channel and surround receiver.

thanx fred. the second hand thing is a good possibility. thing is what 2nd hand amp should I look for. for example, the m60's have 250W maximum power. should i buy an amp that has at least that on each channel? or the m60's have 125W each?

someone told me i should be aware of what goes with what, in terms of balance, achieving a smooth equilibrium. what i really look for is a compatible amplifier that will give the most out of these speakers.

basically, i am certain of one thing: if another model does not come out from axiom to replace the m60's, i will definitely buy a pair. i'm sure of that, and unsure about everything else.

Here ya go.

Tertuliano welcome....

The m60's are very efficient speakers that don't require lots of power to play loud, clean, and detailed. Any reputable brand like Denon, HK, etc. will be just fine.

A multi channel receiver will work as well as a stereo receiver, plus give you the ability to use it for movies as well.

Most of us listen to tons of music and use AVR for music and home theater.

The M60's are an 8 ohm speaker, so the good news is any decent amplifer will drive them. I would look for names like NAD, Rotel, Denon (new or used) to name a few. These names will have high current amplifers and supply lots of power, even if the wattage seems low (50 wpc of Rotel power is better than lets say, 80 wpc of Technics or Sony). They are also very well built, they use better electrical components, and will last much longer than bargin brands, so you don't have to be worried about buying some else problems as much. Best bang for the buck.

pn

thanx mate. that's what i'm thinking of too, maybe in the future i'll expand the thing and gor for a surround system. that way i must look into a multichannel receiver.

one thing i notice in amps, what speaker cable input should i be aware of regarding the m60's, that metallic rca type of amplifier input or a cable screw? sorry for the incredible newbie questions...

It is a rare case where everyone can agree on such a question, but I fully agree you need a used AVR. With the recent move to HDMI there are many owners (like me) itching to get rid of very good AVR's just to add that one Home Theater option (and/or Dolby True HD, etc). If you can live without HDMI (and you can) you can get a great sounding amp to run your stereo speakers and still have other channels available if you want 5.1 surround later, plus other functions like Zone control, etc. I would not recommend buying a stereo received for that reason - why buy a 2 channel rig when a 5.1 channel rig of near or equal sound quality is less than $500, and remove the need to upgrade later. My personal recommendations would be Denon 3300 series or above, Marantz 7000 series or above, NAD from last 5 years, or any of the B&K, Rotel, or H&K highest-end within last 5 years. Before everyone jumps on me, these are just from my experience, there are many many many others that I am unaware of or can't recall.

For speakers you use speaker wire, there is a + and - side kinda like a battery. Speaker wire can be purchased at Walmart, home improvement stores like Home Depot, Radio Shack,etc. You don't need to spend a lot of money for name brand stuff like Monster Cable, copper is copper.

You can just twist the ends and attach them to the speaker terminals on the receiver and speaker, or us other connectors called banana plugs, most just use bare wire.

I suppose. The receiver I bought in 1977 finally died on my brother last month. It was a mid priced unit of the day. How much longer do you want it to last? In a sense you get what you pay for. The cheaper receivers from brands like Yamaha, Onkyo etc. often do not deliver the power they claim, but otherwise are quality units. The NADs probably deliver everything they promise, but then so does any Denon receiver.

You have a huge range of options available. As to actual power, the more you have the better as far as peak power handling and headroom, but in most cases you will not use that much. I am probably using 30-40w on average to drive my M80s in my 11x20x8' room. My sherwood, which I picked up for around $75 as a refurb, delivers 90wpc. two channels driven. More power would not hurt, but would probably not be used.

Fred, don't confuse the boy, laymens terms.

An RCA cable is what you use to connect the different components togethor like CD players, DVD players, turntables, etc.

Am I audiogeeking out?

Oh Good Gaaawwwwwddddd, here we go again. It's that F'en "Silver and Copper colored wire" argument again. If you can't spring for the "silver copper" try the pure copper sold here at Axiom, it is great stuff at a fair price. Very flexible which helps on long runs. Home Depot and others sell full copper wire in the electrical dept that is not the stuff in the spools with a copper colored side and silver colored side.
I'm still waiting to hear how they changed copper to silver...
(Let the wire rants begin!!!!!)

monoprice online is another good resource for cables.

Just ignore the picture, Zimm! Shield your eyes!

awesome help guys, thanx a bunch!

and no, you're not audiogeeking, all help is appreciate it and this way i learn, which i thank you all in advance.

I get it, pun intended...that's pretty good.
For all those looking to jump in and explain to me why (or more likely just “that”) the wire does not matter, I'll attach my education on this matter as supplied by JohnK some time back. It's intense reading, but has what you need to understand some of the myth in the industry: A Master's Degree in Wire . Later I will attach results of my test on wire replacements where I hooked my amp up to my kids toes and plugged their fingers in the speakers. I was surprised by the results! This last one is less exact, but interesting (and also from JohnK) but look in the contents for the right pages: http://www.theaudiocritic.com/back_issues/The_Audio_Critic_24_r.pdf.
...But I'm sorry, sound our no sound, that silver stuff is not copper, unless Home Depot has an alchemy department.

It is copper that has a silver coating. It makes it easy to keep the polarity straight, it is not rocket science.

I hear you. Cut it. Do you see copper inside the strands? Not on mine, so it is not copper painted silver. And it is not actually silver on top of copper. So what is that silver wire made of? I say it aint copper. Not that it matters, but short of alchemy it aint copper.
"Place your bets, place your bets!" I say tin, lead or aluminum or the most likely choices. Tin is my bet - just to piss people with "tin ears" off.

I change my bet, now I say: "NICKEL SILVER": Not silver at all, except in color, for this alloy contains no silver, but is mostly copper (about 60%), with approximately equal parts of nickel and zinc added. With the addition of a small percentage of tin, the alloy is then called Alpaca. This alloy was first used in the mid-1800s by the Germans as a silver substitute.

Sounds like the stuff.

and now for something a bit different (not totally)...

thanx for the hint about second hand units, i'm searching ebay on denon and rotel and amazing (at least they seem awesome units) deals may come in hand, even with postage to portugal. so that will be more or less solved.

but considering i'm buying a rega p1 or p2, and seeing that rega rs3 speakers are more or less the same price as the m60's, would it be wise to consider this or the m60's will be my best bet when comparing with rega's speakers? any feedback on this speakers guys, i mean rega one's?

thank you very much.

I have never heard Rega Speakers and their web site, nor any reviews I have found online, show any frequency response curves or testing, making even a guesstimate hard as to the difference in sound between the M60 and RS3. I can tell you that the M60 has a sound similar to Paradigm speakers, something along the Studio line, Studio 60's,IIRC, so if you have a Paradigm dealer nearby you might be able to listen to a set of Paradigms to get an idea of what Axiom has to offer. I suspect from the number of drivers and such the RS3's might sound similar to the M50s, but this is pure speculation.

I never trust companies trying out a new market. Rega is famous for its electronics (CD players, etc), not speakers (to my knowledge). For my hard earned money, I would go with a well established company every time, unless you just like risk. I'm not saying just Axiom, but there are lots of speakers with long histories to rely on. Electronic companies always "make" speakers. But they normally suck, because it is not their market - e.g., Sony speakers, Yamaha speakers, Denon speakers, etc., etc. They are just slapping a proven name on box from China. There are no efficiencies of scale, no trickle down of technology, etc. You just don’t get what you pay for.

Charles, is that 500 crystal changer made offshore? just curious

"Offshore"? I mean technically the volcano that the crystals come from is an island, so yes, they come from "offshore". Now the priest that does all the chanting to bring them to the surface is from Jersey, if that helps you any?

Hoboken?

Guzootight.

Guzootight, I thought that was in Upper New York state.

It's Kazoo-tight, you morons.

Who said anything about musical instruments?

A Kazoo-tight is a wind instrument used in marching bands; look it up. (Give me a few minutes, I have to "check" Wikipedia first!)

Kazoo, wasn't he a Flintstones character? oooow...ooo...what is it now dumb dumb!! (Harvey Korman!!)

Not sure what old Lion Face was talking about - or aboat!

Are you changing the subject to boats now (a boat)?

How do you spell the Canadian form of about? It can't be "about", I know how to say that. I always thing they are saying something about a "a-boat". Never mind...

Sorry, Charles, most of us Canucks aren't really aware of the way we pronounce 'about'. I think it's all in your Americans heads...there's noo doot aboot it!!

You know I'm not sure what province that pronunciation is really used in. I can't recall ever truly hearing it except in jokes and commercials. I have visited them all except the Territories. I think this should clear things up for you

I Am Canadian

Awsome Murph!! I hadn't seen that one for a while, made me laugh!

pn

That's funny. I really was kidding, as a Southerner, trust me, I am used to fighting off stereo types. Now if you will excuse me, I need to fry up the rabbit I hit on the way to the store before I head out to work on my alligator-pulled sled.

In a 5.1 world aren't stereo types an anachronism?

Is that a joke about Southerners?????????????? Very uncool.

I ain't afraid of no spiders.

"anachronism" is being afraid of spiders wearing digital watches?

Thought I had some catching up to do on this thread. Boy was I wrong!

No worries Zimm, it's all fun.

To prove it, I posted further fuel for Canadian humor in this thread.... Bacon and Maple Syrop Martini

No Zimm it wasn't. It was simply a play on words and the though by some that 2 channel has been replaced by 5.1.

I know; just causing trouble.

Bugger! I owe you now.

I should have thought more before jabbing someone on this site with actual information to share. I could have punched on Adrian all day and not really lost anything.

Ooopps, I did it again...Sorry Adrian!

Dem's fight'n words.....

Be prepared to be pummeled with a 5lb wad of Canadian Back Bacon!...overcooked of course.

Once cooked it is only ~3.5lbs.

I like bacon - and syrup as it turns out. Maybe I'm Canadian...

You know you're Canadian when you prefer driving in the winter, because the potholes are filled with snow.

You know your from New Orleans if you prefer to drive during Mardi Gras because the potholes are filled with drunk people.

You know you're Canadian if you owe more money on your snowmobile than you're car.

What's a car?

You know you're on the internet if people can't keep "your" and "you're" straight.

Hm. I think you meant "you're" and "your".

Keep your you'res straight.

Advice from Axiom Owners

When did we start giving advice?

Next week.

Yore nuts.