Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Home Theater Looking for a 5.1 system (speakers + receiver)

I've had my eye on the Epic 80-500 5.1 system for some time now. I am planning on using the system for probably 70/30, movies/music in a pretty small room, probably around 1800 cubic feet (but I will be moving into a new place with most likely a larger room within half a year so I need the system to be future proof).

I noticed a lot of people suggest getting the M22 v2 for mains if you're primarily watching movies which seems like what I will be doing.

My primary concerns are 1) how the EP500 sub stacks up against the less expensive EP350 v3 (especially in a smaller room), 2) if the VP150 v2 will be able to keep up with the M80's upfront or if I should spring for something like a horizontally placed M22 as a center channel and finally, 3) what receiver (and possible amp combination) should I use to properly power this set up.

As far as the receiver goes I've heard that a lot of people like the way Denon, and particularly the 3808 sounds with Axiom speakers. I wouldn't mind picking up this particular reciever at a discount with Denon's new line coming out now. However, I've also head people suggest that the Onkyo's are generally a better value for the same price, but I'm not sure how they would run 4/6ohm speakers. I've been considering adding a 2 channel amplifier to run the M80's and let the reciever handle the rest of the speakers (possible upgrading the system to 7.1 later on) but I'm not sure if it will be necessary in my small room.

Thnx for any help.

HI Escaron Welcome. Sounds like exiting times ahead.

While I might ponder a bit the statement regarding M22s being primarily for movies, I think they would make an excellent choice from all that I have read. I myself own M60s and find them simply astounding. The M22's are described as being more akin to the M80s (the M60's big brother) but don't play quiet as loud (and by loud, be aware that both can go louder than you can safely listen to.) and perhaps not quiet as deep as the big M80s as they are, of course, a smaller design. They are highly regarded for accurate clarity for movies but also for music. perhaps even more praised by music lovers as movie buffs like to take more comfort (if even at a subconscious level) of a big speaker.

Because you are choosing a package with an Extremely capable sub (My EP500 is one of my favorite possessions) and you have described a relatively small room, I think the M22s would be an excellent choice.

If you want to future proof for a much larger than normal room in the future, M80s will also sound incredible and you won't later wonder if your new room size is a factor. down the road.

Also, most people on this board will tell you that any quality digital receiver will convert sound so accurately within volume levels that are within it's spec and that any differences in sound or quality are inaudible. There are some who disagree. Those who disagree, often tend to invest in very expensive units to gain what are noticeable improvements to their ears.

never having participated in any properly set up listening tests for receivers, I can't discount either side but the technical arguments made by Camp A. tend to make the most sense to my level of electrical understanding.

My advice to people is usually that their first receiver purchase should be based on making sure you get all the features that you need. Experimentation with this type of gear can be expensive so start with what will meet your immediate needs from a technical setup and possible future needs. Then just listen and enjoy. After everything is tweaked the way you want it and you still feel the need for more, then you can always experiment down the road as time and money permits. My guess is, after you hear the Axiom speakers (Even camp #2 agree that it is the speakers that make the largest difference in sound quality, not the electronics.) you will be completely satisfied.

All that being said, Denon's are highly regarded for their feature set, tend to be conservative in their ratings so you are getting what they promise and maybe more, and have a solid build quality from a trouble perspective. I own a Denon 3608 and am very happy with it.

Edit:
Hope I didn't get any sandwich on ya. I'm babbling on here while I eat lunch.

Escaron, welcome.

The Epic 80-500 5.1 would be a wonderful and basically future-proof choice. In a small room with a good sub (like the EP500), the M22's would also be amazing. However, in a larger room, you will not be able to attain the same SPL as you would with a larger speaker like the M80.

I would not consider a horizontal M22; it is not designed for that placement/orientation. The VP150 is Axiom's flagship center channel speaker. It will match fine with either the M22 or M80.

People seem to really like the EP350v3. But if you are looking to "buy once" since you are moving to a larger space, I would recommend stepping up to the EP500.

If you are looking to spread the purchases out over time, you could consider the Epic M22-500 5.1 now, then move the M22's to the rear and add the M80's when you move to the larger space.

I have an Onkyo TX-SR805 and think it is a fine piece of equipment. That being said, I am using M60's and the M80's are a somewhat more demanding load. There seems to be universal love for the Denon 3808CI; if you can afford it, I doubt you would either have any regrets or feel like you need an external amp.

I do not know how people feel about the 3808 remote control. My best AV purchase ever - by far - was a URC MX-700 remote. It is now discontinued, but has been replaced by the MX-850. You can get one for about $200 by calling http://www.surfremotecontrol.com/. Some people like the Harmony series, some people don't have other family members that need to operate the system. I don't know that my family could survive without the MX-700. Just a thought for your budgeting.

What he said. But in terms of a small room, take note of the size of M80s. You can always move M22 to a rear position or second zone in a bigger house, but you can't hide towers. I like big towers - and that is all I mean by that! - but you have to be willing to accept a certain aesthetic motif to put them in a small room. My HT is not called the "Man Cave" for nothing.

1) I have a 350 in a large room and find the sound great but miss some of the pressure and really deep movie bass that I've felt/heard from some of the various flagship subs (EP600/800, PB13 Ultra, etc). Mind you, it was wayyyy cheaper.

2) I don't think placing a vertically designed M22 horizontally would be much of an improvement on the VP150. I would advise using a vertical speaker (I use an M60) if layout permits, otherwise I'd just stick with the specially designed center channel.

3) I now use the 3808, but have not noticed any difference in sound from the Sherwood Newcastle I was using. Receivers can, generally speaking, be bought based on features vs price. The new Onkyos are unlikely to have any problems driving 4 ohm M80s, I think most of their problems were limited to models from two years ago. They do tend to run pretty hot, however. If you are moving to a larger room, or are, like me, open to the idea of future experimentation with outboard amplification, just make sure you get one with pre-outs. Also, some of the lower line Rx still don't do audio over HDMI. Confirm via the owners manual.

Thnx for all the quick replies. Couple more questions. How does the EP500 compare to subs from SVS, specifically something like the PC12-Plus or the PC13-Ultra (seems like they're are all relatively close in price). Also, how do people feel about NAD C270/272 amps for use with the M80's if I was to go that route. Seems like they can be bought used for around $400-500. I've never had any experience with separate amps and was wondering how safe would it be buying one used vs new and if it would even make a significant difference over just the Denon alone. The only reason I would consider a separate amp is to take the load off the Denon for driving the 4ohm fronts since it's not really designed for that (as far as I can tell they only mentione 8/6ohm ratings in the manual). I don't want to damage any of my speakers or the reciever itself and it seems safer to pay the extra money for a separate amp for at least 2 channels.

Ditto that. You won't be "missing" anything with a 3808 or Onkyo (or any other AVR in that $1500+ price range). But adding more power is not as expensive as I thought. By sacrificing some fancy box options, and working around a loud fan, I got a pro amp to push over 500watts (when needed) for under $500. I found parts of music I did not know where there (and thus did not miss them) after years of happy listening to my Denon 3300.

On that note, I have an interesting (to me) A/B comparison of the 3300 to the pro amp. My FL and FR are on the QSC GX5, my center is on the Denon 3300, rated at 110w. What I had always perceived as a limit to my PSB towers was a harshness on the high end of male vocals over 98db. Doing some intense listening to the new Dave Matthews Band album in 2 channel, I loved every second and never heard a drop of that sizzle I had always been able to find on DMB vocals, some horns, etc. But when I switched to 5 ch, I could hear that little bit of distortion/error/sizzle again. It was coming from the center channel on the Denon. When the Denon was running all 3 fronts, I heard that from all 3 (or 2 as the case may be), routinely. Now, its gone when the separate amp is in the chain.

So in a quasi-A/B test, I can say the additional power of the separate amp makes a "cleaner" sound than my Denon. Since all amps "sound" the same, I chalk this up to more power and clipping, not better amplification. Important note: my 3300 is now almost a decade old. So this may not apply to the newer Denon amps, but then again, the modest power increases from 110 to 130 should make almost no difference and amp section has not changed much, if at all, from what I have read, since they still use the same processing path and amp design.

Don't spend all these two cents in one place.

Another quick note.
In consideration of your small room, huge power in an amp is not going to be an issue for you at all. In a 15x15x8 foot room (easiest way I could come to 1800 sqr feet. You might be surprised to learn that according to online wattage calculators, to maintain an average of 85db (common sound levels in movie theaters) you will only use about 2 watts nominal.

Of course, there needs to be some room for headroom. For instance, a loud musical burst in classical music could go 10db higher than normal. A movie special effect might hit 15db above normal. To get 15db extra above 85db requires 61 watts. Well within the specs of practically any quality receivers or amp.

Of course, if you like things LOUD, the number jump very quickly. Lets say you have chosen to slowly but surely deafen your friends at a 95db average with 10db spikes. You are now looking at 194 watts required to handle the peaks and this is out of the range of many common receivers and off sounding and potentially damaging clipping could occur depending on how bad it is pushed. Most receivers will shut down before damage is done but it's still not where you want to be.

In short, unless you like it very loud, I think most receivers will do you just fine until you move into a much bigger home.

Note: For reference sake, I used this online wattage calculator and used a distance of 3.5 meters and a sensitivity of 93 to match up with the M22s. Of course there are many other factors as to producing an "exact" calculation but it can serve to give you a rough idea of your own requirements.

Online Wattage Calculator

I'd just like to add that if you can fit the M80's or M60's within your aesthetic demands, they both play very well at low volumes. I have not heard the M80's personally, but I listen to M60's daily with both movies and music, and find the M60's to be very good at low levels. Everyone says that the M80's do a better job on top of that. So just because you don't want to use the M80's to bring down the walls in your current house, doesn't mean they won't still play spectacularly at lower volumes.

That said, the M60's just are awesome when I blast them at high levels, haha.

In terms of receiver, if you are going the Onkyo route with M80s, I would suggest staying at or above the TX-SR7xx level at the least. If you stick with anything below that (M60 or M22), than even the lowliest Onkyo makes serious music.

If you're really talking about the SVS CYLINDER subs, be aware that they are gigantic. Now, depending upon your furniture arrangement and aesthetic demands, that may not matter. But be ready for a big, black water-heater.

I have an older SVS box sub (PB12-ISD?). It is a good piece, but it is a fugly black box and is nothing at all like the PB13-Ultra and EP600 I heard at myrison's. Totally different league in terms of output and articulation. I believe that the DSP in the EP500/600/800 makes a big difference.



Well, there are about 37 noctillion interweb threads about whether people can hear differences in amplification. Depends on how loud, your ears, your room, the material, etc. Personally, I think buying used, quality amplifiers is pretty safe since they have no moving parts.

Thnx for all the input. I took a look at the SVS website and their subs are definitely large. I suppose it's hard to say how exactly it would look in my room until I buy one but just with a tape measure I can tell the footprint is quite a bit bigger than the EP500.

I have another question now about the Factory Outlet. I realize that basically you're getting a 10% discount because there will be cosmetic blemishes on the speakers but it seems like too good a deal to pass up. Are there many people who order through the FO and if so, how severe are these blemishes?

If looking at receivers in the 3808ci price range, don't rule out the Yamaha RX-V3900. 6th ave has it for about the same price of the 3808 but you need to call them.

All my speakers are FO. I'm hard pressed to find anything wrong with them.


Go to flip22's HT in the Gallery to see the SVSs beside a pair of M60s.

On my way out the door, but two quick points: Almost everyone who buys through the F.O. can barely find blemishes, and (I don't think anyone mentioned this) another advantage of an Axiom sub over another brand is matching finishes... maybe very important if your next setup puts the sub up front alongside the Mains.

Welcome, BTW...

Just checked out Flip's HT, and holy crapola the SVS cylinders are huge! I've never seen them in a comparison shot before...

How big is the room are you might be moving into?

Reason I ask, is I went through the same decision a couple days ago (I am sure you read the thread). Brent at Axiom basically told me in a room this small it is not necessary to go into the tower speakers unless it's a mental thing for you, or you like things obscenely loud. He told me the whole point for developing the M22 was to allow small to medium sized rooms with a sub have the sound of the towers without having the footprint. That was what pretty much sealed the deal for me. If you go with the W versions the price difference is even higher because you don't have to buy stands.

If you aren't willing to compromise, or money isn't an issue, by all means I would go with the bigger setup. I do like the idea however of what the other guys said... Buy the 5.1 now, and buy larger mains and move the 22's to the 6 and 7 channel later on.

I'm really glad that flip22 put up those shots. It really puts everything into perspective (esp with that 102" screen). Numbers really can be meaningless without the context.

Excellent calculator example Murph! Power just isn't an issue in a small room. One thing the Crown calcualtor does not compensate for is room gain. Being in an enclosed space gets you another 6 db or so.

In my space, being at 8' from the speakers, I use between 2 and 6w including 12db headroom to get me to reference.

I second fredk's comment, that calculator is enlightening. Thanks Murph! Would someone refresh my memory on what db level is considered reference level?

For movies, reference level is 85 db, this would be the level when calibrating the system. Music has no reference level, just what ever you would normally listen to could be considered reference level.

Thanks Jake. Good to know.

My room is small - about 1800 cubes. Maybe I'm just deaf.

It does in my room. I much prefer music at around 75-85db.

You've been hanging around the monk for too long.

I didn't realize your room is so small. Mine livingroom is 1700 cubes, but the kitchen & diningroom adds almost as much. I never quite know how to classify my room because living-dining-kitchen area is semi-open.

Why, I remember when reference level was 70dB. Ya damn kids, get off my lawn!

Couple more things I would like to get some advice on. I'm not sure if I should start a new thread on this or not but here goes.

I'm sort of leaning towards getting an Emotiva Amp (specifically the XPA-5) and then using a less expensive receiver than the 3808 as a pre/pro. I kind of want something that will really drive the Axiom speakers, specifically the M80's. Does anyone know of some decent receivers (price < $1000CAD) that have similar features to the 3808 but are less power capable. I basically need my receiver to have at least 3 HDMI inputs, handle all the latest lossless codecs including MPCM over HDMI, preferably have different crossover settings for different channels and have basicac calibration akin to Audyssey or YPAO. I'm not too concerned with video processing, as long as it does upconverting/deinterlacing over non HDMI inputs as my Xbox 360 is still hooked up with component cables.

The other alternative I've been mulling over is like I mentioned previously, picking up the 3808 and a simple 2 channel amp for the M80's like the Emotiva UPA-2 or maybe a NAD C272 if I can find one for cheap.

Wait a month or two and keep an eye on the AVS for sale boards or other for sale places. There should be a bunch of used 3808's pretty soon as those owners move to the 4310. No need for external amplification either. I'd hold off on that.

The XPA-5 is not universally loved with M80's. I'd stick with the Denon and perhaps a 2-channel amp.

Do you mind explaining why the XPA-5 doesn't work well with the M80's? And what 2-channel amp would you recommend that would go well with the M80's?

Escaron, you appear to be paying too much attention to relatively small differences in maximum power capability rather than what is actually used in home listening(1 watt for a comfortably loud level and rarely if ever more than around 100 watts even for split-second peaks on the most dynamic listening material). Any of the typical home receivers rated anywhere in the 100-150 watt area(e.g. the 3808 or Onkyo 876)will "really drive" any of the Axioms, including the M80s which are a little more sensitive and require less power than the others.

Escaron,

Some Emotiva models have been known to shut down and go into protect mode with the M80's, I am not sure if the xpa-5 is one of those models. I know there are happy Emotiva/Axiom owners out there.

Alright, well I finally ordered my system. I decided to go with the two M80s in the end, along with the EP500, QS8 and the VP150. It's not often that I buy new speakers so I felt that it might be a long time before I upgrade to 7.1 and even longer before I will get different speakers period, might as well get something now that I will be proud to own and listen to.

Thnx for all the help and advice I received in this thread thus far. Unfortunately I'm still all over the place in terms of receiver + amp selection. I was dead set on the Emotiva XPA-5 until people mentioned that Emotiva and Axiom don't play well together which I'm having a hard time understanding since I get nothing but praise from just about every other speaker owner about their Emotiva amps. Unless something major changes I'll probably end up buying the Denon 2809 from FS - for use as a pre/pro - (they have it for $200 off for the next week which puts it at $999CAD). I know this is expensive for you US guys (this is what you usually pay for the 3808) but I couldn't find a better deal anywhere else, most places I called just told me that it's a discontinued model and they no longer carry it. Odly enough, I was able to find a 3808 demo model but it's $300 + the software update for Dynamic EQ more than the 2809, which although not totally out of my price range is a little much considering I don't really need the extra power for a pre/pro.

As for the amp, I'm still really strongly leaning towards the XPA-5, I just can't see why it would have any issues with the 4ohm M80's. Just about everything else that's 5 channels (NAD or Outlaw) is out of my price range. Unless I go with a 2 channel amp or monoblocks just for the fronts there's no way I can fit into my budget.

I did a quick search and I came up with these 3 threads that talk about the xpa-5. You might find some of this information useful.

http://www.axiomaudio.com/boards/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=207493

http://www.axiomaudio.com/boards/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=223727

http://www.axiomaudio.com/boards/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=207398&fpart=1

Cheers!

Congrats Escaron. You certainly won't be dissapointed with your choice. Even after a year of listening to my M80 system I am still amazed by the sound.

Go ahead and pick up that Dennon, but hold off on the prepro. Try cranking the Dennon and see if you can actually hear any distortion.

Right on, good to hear about the order. What finish did you end up going with?

For the finish I just went with regular black oak, finish and speaker aesthetics aren't really a big priority for me.

I did do a lot of reading last night, both here and on the Emotiva forums regarding the whole M80v2 and Emotiva amps debate. It's weird how this has been reported for almost several years now and no one still has a definitive answer as to what is going on. It seems like most if not all of the cases of powering down occur with either the older MPS-1/2 or the newer XPA-2. I don't believe it has been reported with an XPA-3/5 yet or the older LPA-1, which of course doesn't mean that it won't happen. It seems like all the new amplifiers, starting with the MPS-2 don't have a current limiter in them and will try to draw as much as they can. From what I understood (and I'm not even close to an electrical expert) is that the reason the issue is more prevalent with the XPA-2 is that it has higher voltage rails compared to the other XPA amps, and when the M80's do dip below 4 ohms it actually tries to draw the current whereas other models would just run out of power. And of course the reason that other amps, even low quality receivers manage to run the M80s fine is that supposedly they all feature a current limiter that helps when the M80s dip to low impedance (which, to add to the confusion, different people and impedance curves contest whether this does or doesn't happen)

I've also seen posts of people suggesting that if you set your crossover to 50hz or higher you shouldn't have issues because the impedance dips occur below that however it seems as if different curves the show the dips at different areas and no one has been able confirm any of it.

All in all, it seems like I'm basically at the mercy of the chance as to weather my system will or will not exhibit these issues.

I don't pretend to know who is right and who is wrong in the long standing discussion of Emotiva vs. Axiom M80s. However, just to make sure you are reading both sides of the story, there are some who would provide evidence that the M80 design does not drop below 4 Ohm at any frequency.



http://www.soundstagemagazine.com/measurements/axiom_m80v2/

I'm not saying that there's something wrong with the design of the M80s or whether they do actually drop below 4ohm. It's just clear that for some reason the Emotivas have problems with them. I have no clue as to why since according to both sides they should work perfectly fine together. The problem is I'm not sure I want to risk the money to find out if the XPA-5 will work well with the M80s. If I lived in the US then maybe yes, but it's so expensive to get the XPA-5 shipped to Canada to begin with and then to have to ship it back to Emotiva for a refund I would lose probably like $300 just doing that.

I was considering ditching the Axioms and just going with Emotiva's offering for speakers but with a decent sub from SVS it just becomes too expensive. I figure I'll stick with the Axioms and look for another amp from Outlaw or NAD that can power the M80s. What do people think of the Outlaw 2200 Monoblocks (one for each tower) and then letting a Denon 2809 handle the center and surrounds?

I would suggest that you try out the 2809 first before you take the plunge on a separate amp, I am using the 2809 and have had no issues driving the M80s along with the VP150 centre and QS8s. You can add an amp down the road if you like, but I'll say that the 2809 can play at uncomfortable levels if needed(for me anyway). BTW, check around at some other Denon dealers in your area, I'm sure you can find a 2809 closer to $900 or less esp. if they know it's on sale at one of the box stores. avu.ca are located across the country and have given me excellent deals(in person) on Denon and other brands. If you stay with FS, you can haggle with them as well...'round here, I have a half dozen FSs', if one doesn't want to haggle to my liking, I'll either find another salesman in the same store or go to a different FS. Good luck!!

Personally, I find the idea of trying to get speakers that work with a particular amplifier (ie, I want the XPA-5, so I won't get the M80s) some what backwards. Now, since you haven't heard the Axioms, so you don't definitely know that you like the sound. Remember, speakers make a whole hell of a lot more difference in the sound than amplifiers.

I wholeheartedly agree with what you're saying. I haven't heard the Axioms so for me it's not necessarily a loss going one way or another since I wouldn't know what I'm missing. Just that for $799US the XPA-5, at least on paper, is such a steal I almost feel bad not buying one. If you try to find a comparable amp from just about anyone else, including Outlaw and the likes, you're looking at about $800 or so premium. But again, this is all on paper and if the XPA-5 doesn't jive with the M80s in real applications then I'm not going to risk buying it. Doesn't mean I have to feel good about that

I'm just hoping that regardless of what I do I will hear a difference between my current set up and what I'm moving to.

Don't forget, many feel that same comparison you are making with the amps also applies to Axiom vs B&w/Paradigm ect as far as performance/price is concerned. Axioms tend to cost roughly half the $$ of many of the brands they are compared to(sometimes more).

I picked up an Onkyo 876 on sale at Visions today. It was some kind of one day only grand opening although they weren't actually opening a new store. I snagged the last one but its still in the box, I'm not sure if I want to keep it or not. I was very much set on either the 2809 or the 3808, leaning more and more towards the 2809 simply from a price stand point. Then 876 ran me $1200CAD which seems like a decent deal, nothing crazy, but honestly I didn't call around much for Onkyo prices. From what I checked online that's not a bad price at all. I would have had to pay $1300 for a demo model of the 3808 + $100 for the firmware upgrade, or get the 2809 for $1000. Seems like the Onkyo lands in the middle.

There's only two things that sort of worry me about the Onkyo, I hear that it's a "bright" receiver and so are Axiom speakers and that it has heat issues. I notice a lot of people mention that the unit runs hot and tends to shut off when the M80s go beyond 100db. Now, this isn't really that big of an issue because I'm going to be using the Outlaw monoblocks for that. I'm assuming the Onkyo shouldn't have this problem powering the 6ohm center and surrounds. As a pre/pro the Onkyo is absolutely wonderful from a feature standpoint, it's also certainly much heavier than the 2809 (25 vs 50lb) so if the Denon can run 3 speakers, I hope the Onkyo can manage. Anyone have any experience with the 876. I have 15 days to return it still, so let me know

Escaron, hopefully as you become more experienced with high quality audio equipment you'll learn not to take seriously reports of amplifiers being either "bright" or "warm". Since it's routine these days for even moderately priced units to have an audibly flat response from 20Hz-20KHz, one would have to designed with gross incompetence to have the major frequency response inaccuracy that would be necessary to exhibit an audible coloration.

No, "a lot of people" haven't said that it shuts off when the M80s go beyond 100dB, and as long as it doesn't, that means that the temperature is within acceptable design limits.

You got an excellent price on the 876 and at this point you should assume that since it's a quite powerful amplifier that it will power all your Axioms to very high levels and that no separate amplifier will be needed. Stop worrying about problems that are highly unlikely to develop and just enjoy.

that receiver should do just fine, I would not assume you need additional amps unless you try it out first as is.

A quick update for those who still care :P

I returned the Onkyo 876 today and instead picked up a Denon 3808 (albeit a demo model) for the same price. Price/Value the Onkyo was probably better but it just didn't sit right with me. The heat issue seemed to be pretty well documented and even though it only rarely resulted in shutdown problems or artifacts I still can't imagine that heat is good for any kind of electronics. Regardless of what kind of heat a component was designed to take it's not going to last as long as if it ran cooler, and I want my receiver to last a long time. I also don't want to pay 1200 for a component and then have to worry about aftermarket cooling for it :| It also seemed like Onkyo had really poor customer service and many people dropped their products after their experiences. I've read nothing but great things about Denons and their reliability and seen many Axiomites using older models with absolutely no problems. Plus, it seems like the 3808 is the poster boy receiver for Axiom speakers.

Now I just have to wait for the speakers to actually arrive so I can set it up and see how it runs

Denon 3808 is a great choice. Axiomites love their Denon .

Yeah, I almost don't feel like I belong on this message board with my wildly unpopular Integra.

We must shun you now.

I'm late to this thread, but congrats on the purchase of the 80/500 system. That's what I have, with the VP150 and QS8s in 5:1, and they've been great for three years now (80/20 movies/music). My room is almost the same size as yours: 16 * 14 * 7.5 = 1680 cu ft, and I've not had any problems. I stuck the sub in the front left corner (didn't even do the sub crawl) and even at low power it gives good chest-rattling bass and LFE.

Let us know how things go when the speakers arrive! We love write-ups!

Heh, I couldn't even afford any Newcastle with my Sherwood, but you fellas have been good sports about it.

Thats one nice system Escaron. You got a good price on the 3808. Now comes the really hard part. The wait...

We talk about you behind your back, Fred. A lot.

Sometimes in the beer thread we pass around Newcastles and snicker.

*snicker*

For you Canadians, that's *snickre*

*urp*

Bah, you can't even "burp" right......

If you didn't have the good taste of liking Green Day, and if the other Axiomites wouldn't kill me since they like your cartoons so much, I'd give you what for, you blargle blargle blargle ...

snicker

I can see from JP's avatar that my longstanding and perfectly rational cries to "burn him!" are having some effect.

Been done.