Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Advice from Axiom Owners Budget receiver for m3ti: HK 225 or Denon 1603 ?

I'm putting a budget speaker system together for my dorm room and am planning to order the m3ti and a velodyne vx-10 sub. I don't want to spend much on the receiver(no more than 250). Would the HK avr-225 ($225) or the Denon avr-1603 ($249) be better?

From what I've read, the HK is a better match for the axiom speakers, but I'm wondering if I'd be happier with the extra power in the Denon. The HK is 55 watts and the Denon is 70. Would it be safe to say they put out about the same effective power due to the way they rate their power?

I think either one would be a fine choice, and you will undoubtedly find advocates of each brand both here and in other forums.

I don't think, however, you will find much support here for the notion that one is a better "match" for a particular speaker. I think the general consensus is that the sound of most comparably-priced, solid-state equipment cannot be readily distinguished. Look for features and shop hard for price, both on the internet and elsewhere. 6ave.com sometimes runs specials on the Denon; I ordered a 1803 and they upgraded me to the newer 1804 because they were out of stock (try that - might work for you too). The 1604 has meaningful upgrades compared to the 1603, I believe.

You might also consider the Yamahas - lots of people love them, and I have an old Yamaha integrated amp that has given me excellent sound and faithful service for about 13 years.

Mostly, I'd look for the feature set rather than the brand. And see if you like the remote.

As to power ratings, either of the models you mention will make it very very loud in all but a large room. I wouldn't get hung up on specs; HK does seem to measure very conservatively in that regard.

I recently purchased a factory refurbished Denon DRA685 from Dakmart to power my M3ti's. The 685 is Denon's top of the line stereo receiver. Great combination. The M3ti's have never sounded better. $218.00 plus shipping...1 year warranty. A great deal! More than pleased. Unless you have a pressing need to purchase a surround receiver, I would highly recommend the DRA685.

i would have to disagree with TTuttles opinion on matching speakers and receivers. I have read countless times not to match bright receivers with bright speakers, and warm receivers with warm speakers.

That being said, the Denons are ussually considered bright, and the axioms also have been said to have a bright sound to it.

Bright and Warm is not bad, its just a different type of sound. Speakers can be clear, imaged, and excellent, but also be bright or warm at the same time.

Because of that i am getting the m22 with an H/K 525(which is not a bright receiver). But thats the m22. The m3 is tuned differently in the mid bass range so you may like the Denon's.

Anyways, if you want a good budget receiver my best advice is to look at last years models. They are still being sold online and through stores and direct from the company, but are much cheaper then this years models.(look on ebay for factory direct models for most brands and companies) And if you read the reviews, you will find most recievers change sligthly from year to year, but not that much(then again, you should read reviews just to make sure)

Hawkson, in the interest of retaining a bit of decorum, I'm going to try to restrain myself.

However, I'm going to ask you directly whether you've actually "heard" these differences you claim in these receivers, and if so, under what conditions.

I've owned HK, Yamaha and Denon receivers. Most of my listening has been on Polk, Klipsch and Axiom speakers. My experience is that the speakers sound quite different, and that the electronic components simply don't. I do not believe that it is possible to scientifically prove that they do.

I believe you would be doing your fellow Axiom board members a greater service by supporting your assertions with personal experience or scientific data rather than simply relating the disembodied mutterings of god-knows-who from god-knows-where. Posters from other boards are not inherently more reliable than Axiomites. Reading something "countless times" does not make it true.

While surfing at lunchtime I found posts on various boards stating that "Denon" was bright" then I find one that says Denon is "warm". Repeat this for H/K and then for Yamaha.

I doubt if there is any science behind this, just people repeating something that they heard elsewhere.

This is one case where I think you let YOUR ears decide and take everything else with a grain of salt.

I would have to agree that both of your recievers are an exelent choice and you will not be able to hear a "warm" or "bright" sound coming from the electronics. IMO.

Something that you might consider, would be the purchase of the Axiom M2i with a sub...Might leave you a little extra cash for the reciever...Just a thought.

"I don't think, however, you will find much support here for the notion that one is a better "match" for a particular speaker"
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"I have read countless times not to match bright receivers with bright speakers, and warm receivers with warm speakers. That being said, the Denons are ussually considered bright, and the axioms also have been said to have a bright sound to it. "


This is what i have read. If relaying information i have read to other forum members is innapropriate, then there would be very little axiom customers around. Word of mouth is what axiom is based on.

In fact, a regular/senior member of this forum recommended the HK 525 based solely on the fact that while Denon 3083 and Hk 525(the models i looked at) were comparable, one matched better with the other, for the reason one was bright and one wasnt. I did my research and found indepent sources claiming this fact. I was attempting to relay this information. If you think i was out of place for relaying my research, so be it. I did at no point claim i listened to them. I stated clearly this was only what i had read.

If you disagree with the fact that recievers can be bright and warm, then our opinions differ.

"I believe you would be doing your fellow Axiom board members a greater service by supporting your assertions with personal experience or scientific data rather than simply relating the disembodied mutterings of god-knows-who from god-knows-where"

If i cant 'provide' such a service, then my best help is to offer what information i have read.

In any case listen to these recievers yourself, and make your own opinion.

Hi Hawkson101,

I don't think that anything you posted was "out of place".

I was just pointing out that "warm" and "bright" labels are used with no consistency, so to me it's simply meaningless information.

I imagine the room environment has much more impact on a speaker than a receiver ever will.

Jserv,

I have a pair of M22, contrary to the belief of many people here, there is a difference in sound btwn different receivers when I pair it up with my M22. I have try both the Denon AVR3803 and Harman Kardon AVR320. I have to admit even though I don't want to, the M22 in my opinion sounds better with the Harman Kardon for music. Now you can say I like the Harman Kardon better because it is warmer or whatever, but the fact is different receivers do sound differently.