Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion The Water Cooler Black Ice and not the good AC/DC kind

Well, for anyone who actually noticed I haven't been here to harass them for a few days, it's partially because I took a trip last week to my brothers to go see Collective Soul which was awesome but then had to return after hearing news my wife was in a car accident.

Most importantly of all things, she is fine and so is her Mom that was riding with her. Sharon's neck is very sore. She already had a bad neck from being rear ended 2 or 3 years ago and this re-aggravated it. Her Mom took a bad bump to the head but no concussion. Slight bruises for both.

They hit a patch of black ice at 9:00am on a sunny day but it was a spot where the sun doesn't hit that side of the hill until noon or so. The Jeep skid sideways until it ran out of ice and then flipped when the tires hit the traction of solid pavement again. Judging from the fact that the roof is totaled & much of everything underneath was beaten off when it landed back on the tires (of which three blew off the rims) but the two sides are relatively unscathed, I'd have to say they had some air time before and after the bounce to the roof.

In any case, the roll bars did their job and kept the roof from crushing in on them and the seat belts kept them tightly in their seats so they were released from the hospital quickly after being checked out with no serious injuries.

I can't tell you how scared I was when a fellow Jeep club member & buddy called me to see how I was because he was on his way to go help out after hearing the news from yet another Jeeper who came across the accident and stopped to help. I was doubly scared after calling my wifes cell phone only to have it answered by a nurse.

Thankfully, they were safe and my fears turned to frustration as I was a 4 hour drive from returning home. My buddy kindly continued on straight to the hospital and was there to greet them when they got released and were just starting to try and figure out how they would get home.

The Jeep is probably a write off. Although that's irrelevant because it did it's job and kept them safe. The investigating officer said that after looking at the skid marks and the huge patch of near invisible ice, any vehicle would likely have ended up rolling if it had skidded sideways so although some may say Jeeps (any tall vehicle) rolls a little easier, in this case it was the vehicle that saved them with the sturdy roll bars (and wearing seat belts) from the crushing blow that the roof took.

I met with the adjuster while he looked over the vehicle and he said it would be an easy write off from what he sees so far but since it is a specialty vehicle (Rubicon plus the thousands of aftermarket parts I put into it myself) he is going to reserve his decision until he has the frame measured and he checks to see if things like the axle tubes are bent.

At this point, I really don't care as everyone is safe.

In another interesting note, the adjuster told me that my wife was double lucky that she was in a Rubicon because the drivers air bag is calibrated to not go off unless it takes a very specific frontal impact. This is because a Rubicon is expected to be driven in rough conditions off road, even more so than a regular Wrangler. In any case, a steering wheel airbag serves little to no purpose in a sideways roll and would have likely injured her further in this specific scenario.

Sorry for the long explanation. It started as quick paragraph but I suck at executive summaries.

Andrew, I'm very glad to hear she her mom are safe. That sounds like a pretty horrific accident. Kudos to the Jeep for keeping them relatively unharmed.

Wow.... well as you said, what's important is that they're OK.

Joyce works at a hospital and deals with ER traumas frequently. She's really instilled in me how a life can change in a moment.

I'm glad your family's hasn't! Scary, though!

Glad to hear they are safe. Stressful situations...

Wow!! I was thinking to myself yesterday "Where's Murph"?

Happy to hear they are both doing well, life indeed can change in a heartbeat.

I'm very happy to hear that your wife and mother-in-law are ok, WoW, what a ride that must have been...

I'm also glad to hear that both of them came out of the deal relatively unscathed, good thing they were fastened up well.

Scary stuff. I hope her neck feels better soon. And I appreciated the long explanation.

Murph, glad to hear that the safety features worked as designed and the trusty Jeep delivered your wife and her mom relatively safely from their ordeal.

Thanks for sharing the silver lining with us.

Wow, good to hear everyone's safe.

Fortunate that your Jeep was able to take the brunt AND you had the roll cage.

What those other guys said.

Thank you for telling us this story.

Hugs all around.

Glad to hear everyone is alright, sorry about your Jeep. I hope they write it off, it will never be the same if they try to fix it.

I was thinking the same thing. I had a somewhat similar accident around 15 years ago and the garage it got towed to said they could fix the car. The car was immediately sent to a GM dealer who found that the car was "warped"(unibody) so I told my insurance company there was no way I wanted this car "fixed". I think they were actually considering fixing it, despite the $13000 damage on a $20,000 car.

It's quite likely that the Jeep has similar damage from the rollover, so I'd let them(ins. co) know you'd rather not have it fixed...they may not fix it anyhow. They can fix what they can see, but there is always the issue of stressed parts, welds, chassis alignment, hairline cracks ect.

Glad to hear everyone is okay, Murph. I hope you guys aren't under too much stress from the accident.

Take care, man.

Stunt car driver (of the involuntary type) is not something I ever want to try. I'm glad everyone is OK.

Glad to hear that everything worked out Murph. Don't get the Jeep fixed
Mel

When I hear a story like that, I tend to put myself in your place. Makes my knees week, dude. Must have been a long 4 hour drive.

Glad everything turned out OK. How frightening!

Hi Murph:Glad everyone was ok,someone was looking out for both your Wife and her Mother that day.Take care Bruce

Andrew, joining the others in being thankful that your wife and mother-in-law are okay in what could have been a real disaster.

Glad to hear that everyone is OK.

Thank you everyone for the kind words and reassurances. I frequent a few tech boards regularly but this was the only one I felt compelled to share my story with.

All continues well health wise with my wife and Mom-in-law, except some soreness so I am indeed thankful to whatever causes were at play that day, be it divine, technical or just plain ol' luck.

Still waiting to hear on the Jeep. About the only reason I'd even consider repair a good thing is because I have so much extra money put into it that is not often returned by insurance and with a second, gas friendly, vehicle now it had become just pretty much a trail and snowy day vehicle. Sharon was actually taking it to be rust-checked for the winter when she had the accident.

The adjuster told me that in the case of a write off, they will consider add-ons in an individual basis based on cost and age. The good news with that is that the most expensive items like the new lift kit and the $300 a pop tires were replaced this summer, so depreciation will not be as heavy as if say I still had the lift I put on it in 2004.

I think my best bet is to push for it to be written off and then send someone licensed for the auctions to try and get it back for a couple of thousand. To replace new, there is at quick est. tally of 8800 worth of aftermarket parts surviving on there.

Even simply reselling parts to my Jeep buddies would drop the value to way less than half that in total it's also full of other Rubicon specific parts (at least those not damaged) that would sell in a matter of minutes. I know from a recent repair that just one of the two lockers alone is worth a grand. The extra heavy & extra low ranged transfer case, heavier power train parts (those not damaged,) axles, etc. All sell-able in minutes, not days.

I just might come out of this pretty good depending on the adjuster and if there are not too many 4x4 savvy bidders at the auction. The Word is already out though and some vultures have already phoned me to inquire what's happening with it.

I have had at least one near miss in an auto where I was so certain that I was going to have a serious crash that I closed my eyes and braced for impact. I have several stories from co-workers that had horrible crashes but walked away unscathed - I believe there are Gaurdian Angels.

Her friend at work actually has a side business talking to your guardian angel. I can set you up if you like. She is cute and kinda separated too. Well, Kinda.

If the Jeep does get written off, I would ask about the possibility of buying back before it even goes to auction. I have known some people that were able to do this and like you simply sold off the good parts and then sent the carcass to the wrecker.

I asked that. He said it is not 'supposed' to happen anymore but adjusters (I noticed he made a point of not referencing to himself in first person) are sometimes talked into it. He said you don't so much buy it back as take a much smaller settlement plus the vehicle.

This sounded a bit odd and not what I had heard others do in the past so I didn't ask any more questions until I can look into it.

Wow Murph, just getting to this news. I'm sure glad the family is doing well. That's some scary stuff.

I believe they have found it to be in their best interests to not do this any more especially with a newer vehicle as it could command a higher price at an auction.

I would ask the body shop to allow you to remove the parts you want from your Jeep before the Insurance company pays you out, it is after all YOUR Jeep, at least until the cheque is in your hands.

Well, the Jeep is officially a write-off.
Goodbye old friend......

Wow! It had lost its doors and windows! Total write-off!

My condolences.

Murph – I don’t spend much time on the boards lately and just noticed this. I’ve been a volunteer fire fighter for 15 years now. I’ve seen many vehicle accidents and dread responding to them as I’ve seen things that I’ll never forget. The accident you described with a roll and roof bounce is one I’ve seen before. You, your family and especially, they ladies in the accident are extremely fortunate. It’s miraculous they were able to walk away from that one. If you believe in God or a higher power, you might want to say thanks.

Black ice sucks. I’ve been driving on ice and snow for 25 years or thereabouts. Living in Alaska, you get snow and ice and lots of it. About six months out of every year ice is on the roads. Black ice is treacherous. I hate the stuff. It’s always were you least expect it and when in a zone, not paying real close attention to the road. I invest in really good winter tires and good lights to help, but every time I encounter it, the ol' pucker factor is there.

Here’s a couple pics for you……. You can see how my lights reveal black ice in one of the shots. The other is the pass I drove over every six weeks or so. It gets an average of 800 inches of snow each year.

The pot-holes are big on the East Coast!!

Murph:
I'm one of those people that attribute some sentimentality to objects so I sympathize with you.

No.

I didn't just call you an object.

Thanks Guys!

Michael your right on with the benefits of good lights. A few years ago I invested in expensive but super clear, off-road, daylighters, essentially for that reason. I never really have off-roaded at night, except for the odd 'rescue your stupid buddies missions,' but I had them for winter driving. They make a huge difference.

Unfortunately, they were driving in 9:00am daylight and the ice was just after they crested a hill so they never had a chance to see it coming. That particular spot is known for icy morning conditions as the sun never hits it until noon but it wasn't a road they frequented often enough to be aware.

I am certainly very thankful to still have them in my lives.