Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Advice from Axiom Owners Denon Receiver problem - now what?

As Adrian and John mentioned, I wouldn't turn your back on another Denon, just because your 3808 has had problems that were not due to a manufacturing defect. As you have said, chances are the lightning strike weakened some components.

I would send the 3808 in and have it repaired, then look at buying those Khartago's you want, by adding the amps it takes a big load off the 3808 which should help it last even longer.

Thanks, John, Jay and Adrian. I have thought and thought now and I do love that Denon. Also, as I try and remember better, it was not lightning, but a very hard rain where water got into the line outside my house where there was some sort of junction between coax cables from the satellite (I now remember my brother telling me to put some waterproofing stuff there and not sure I ever did that)and then took out one directv receiver which by being connected to the Denon via HDMI, took out that HDMI. I would feel better if I thought this was related to that incident. Do you knowledgeable folks out there feel that it could have somehow slightly damaged the internals, but that they could have continued working another year or so until failing? Also, why would my touching around a tweeter or woofer have shorted the thing out like that? I hope the speaker isn't weakened by this - it did output sound when I tried it on the left side. I use the dual banana plug thingies on the back of the speaker and regular banana plugs into the Denon, so don't think any wires could have touched. Any-hoo - I think I may try to find a good deal on another 3808ci with a fresh warranty for peace of mind, then get mine repaired if not too expensive and maybe sell it when fixed on audiogon or something. Are there any reasons to consider whatever unit replaced the 3808ci or to move to the wireless one that was above the 3808 in the years of my model? Or is the wireless parts something that could go wrong? I simply must decide soon so I can hear music and listening to 6.1 with no audyssey setup is just irritating and booming my bass. Also, I don't want to wait endlessly without entertainment and if I have to ship it to Denon facility, I may as well have another unit in place while I wait.

Thanks again for everyone who helps here. This is my favorite and most responsive forum. I think the Axioms are a special speaker and its supporters the best audio/home theater folks! Thanks again.
Laura

How much are you willing to spend for a temporary replacement for the 3808 and do you want to ditch the 3808 once repaired?

The direct new replacement for the 3808 is the 4310 which is quite a bit more money than the 3808 was, but it does have a better video processor in it and the newer Burr Brown DAC's. I have seen it listed for under $2000 from online etailers. The 3310 is inline price wise with the 3808, it also has the better video processor but, from I have read, has a lesser quality power supply and amp section. It is still more than capable of driving any speaker but they say the quality isn't the same as those in the 43XX and up series or even in the 3808. The 3808 seems to be the last of it's breed.

Thanks for the info. Jay. I would rather spend a max of about $1200, so without a deal, I have to re-evaluate. I wish I knew the percentage chance that I could just get an amp for the front channels and have it work. I looked today to see if I could find a 3808 (new), but haven't found a deal yet. That might be my best bet, but since I paid near top end when it first came out, I'm hoping to find a bargain. Should I also look for a 4308 model from the same era as my 3808 just so I feel like I got something new/better? That might be a way to go as well. Much to think about, but I feel more confident staying with denon now.
Laura

Hi Laura,

If your Denon won't output a test signal, I fear that the lightning strike may have damaged the microprocessor in the preamp section. You could confirm this is you have any old stereo amplifier or receiver kicking around that you could hook up to the Denon's pre-outs for the left and right front channels. If the one channel and test signal were still not functioning then the damage would be in the Denon's preamp section.

If it's any consolation, my otherwise excellent Oppo DVD player just stopped reading DVDs and DVD-Audio discs. It still plays CDs and SACDs but not DVDs. Most annoying.

Equipment does fail on occasion.

Denons, NAD, B&K, Sherwood Newcastle, Rotel and Outlaw Audio will unfailingly drive M80s, even their entry-level models. I'm less confident of Onkyo, Pioneer, or Yamaha with the exception of a few high-end models that some Axiom forum members say will drive the M80s without shutting down.

Regards,
Alan

Laura have you considered looking for a refurbished 3808 or even the 2808 if this will only be a temporary replacement?

Just found this deal on a 2310. It will drive the M80s easily, has almost all the features of the 3808. The biggest features it lacks, IMO, is the networking feature and preouts for an amp.

Good to hear from you Alan! I do have an extra receiver I can pull out to test and see if it is in the amp or preamp section. Thanks for that suggestion. I'm going to try that today and then proceed from there. Jay, thanks for the link. I'm now a little more educated about these newer Denon's and not feeling like I want to spend the money. I enjoy tv enough, but paying for all these special video processors and such seems a waste for me. I want to enjoy home theater, but I also want very good quality sound from my analog equipment and from hi-rez discs. I would also prioritize the ability to do SACD via hdmi. So, am now going to research Alan's list of other brands (new or used). The bottom line I am getting to is that I need something that will drive my wonderful speakers and I'm thinking that the denon might be a doorstop until it seems cost effective to pay for a repair and shipping and all that. Right now it just seems like a hassle and since I don't want to dig out cables and such to hook all my equipment up to my old yamaha receiver (most are now hdmi) and don't want to be without tv/music, I'll just buy what I'll consider the permanent replacement. I'll have more time in the summer (I'm a teacher, so looking forward to the time off!) to deal with the denon and maybe just carry it to a local non-authorized denon place. This process is not quite as fun as when you are happily upgrading! I can't tell you, but am sure many of you have the same problem, how hard it is to get to the back of the jungle of cables/wires!

On that note, Alan could you or anyone who might fully understand this, please be explicit on the testing through pre -outs idea? Do I simply connect denon's pre-outs to the pre-ins on my yamaha then turn both on and play a source through the denon? Do I keep the speakers connected to the denon or connect them through the yamaha? Sorry to make something simple seem complicated, but my brain is fuzzy from all this! Thanks to you all, again! Enjoy your weekend!
Laura

It's highly doubtful the Yamaha, or any avr for that matter, has the right connections to test the Denon. It would have to have an "amp in" or "main in" connection to be able to use the the Denons "pre outs".

Do you have a local audio shop with a 30 day return policy? If so go and buy an amp bring it home and try it then return it.

When using an external amp you connect the speakers to the amp not the avr.

Hi Laura,

You would connect the Denon's pre-outs for the left and right front channels to the Yamaha's "amp in" for the left and right front channels if it has an "amp-in" L and R inputs.

If it doesn't just use any line-level analog input labeled "CD" or "Aux" or "Tape". Don't use "Phono" if it has that input.

Connect your front M80s to the Yamaha's L and R main channels and leave the Denon to drive the other speakers. Switch the Yamaha to Stereo mode and "Direct" or just Stereo is fine. Set the Yamaha volume to about the 11 o'clock position, which should give you enough output to hear the output from the Denon's front L and R pre-outs.

If you do hear the Denon test signal from the M80s, then you'll know that one of the Denon's main amp channels is defective. If you don't hear the test signal, then the Denon's preamp section has been damaged.

Turn on the Denon receiver first, then the Yamaha. Set the Denon volume control where you would normally set it so the pre-outs will have enough output to feed a signal to the Yamaha's line-level (amp-in) inputs.

Regards,
Alan

Thanks for the details, Alan. I'm going to give it a try, but now being the Gemini I am, I am selling myself on sticking with Denon. I don't believe I can blame it and I have become familiar with using its features and just am lazy about the learning curve with those other models you mentioned. I've read some reviews of the Sherwoods and NADs in particular, but I think I like the synergy with Axioms and Denon (to my ears, they sound great together) and it seems there is much value built into the denon with the many hdmi inputs and such. I guess a final question and maybe it should be another thread is:

Given the choice of a refurbished 3808ci, 4308 or 4310, which would y'all choose. I'm not citing prices I've seen because I'd like to know what you think based on feature set, etc. If it turns out the 3808 is just better and has better amps, then maybe I should stick with it. I have 7.1 speakers now and do not intend to mess with the height stuff the new receivers have. Again thanks for taking time to help and I hope others can enjoy/benefit from the dialogue!