whats going on with my EP500?
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 47
buff
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OP
buff
Joined: Nov 2009
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im hopping to put some concerns to rest. i bought an ep500 in May of this year, and all of a sudden about a month ago. after not pushing my ep500 too much im starting to get a loud "CLACK" sound when it goes deep. "sometimes it's CLACK CLACK CLACK" sometimes just one. depending on how deep the soundtracks bass goes. axiom has been cool about it, and they are sending me a new woofer. my questions are these: is the clacking sound what is called bottoming out(it sounds like two sticks hitting hard)? also is it a woofer issue or an amp issue? also shouldnt the DSP prevent this, making it an amp issue? DID I BUY THE WRONG SUBi wanted a good one that went deep and one that i would not have to worry about breaking)? Im not running it "HOT" either. i have two subs. my second is the SCII. for calibration I set up the EP500 up front and SC close to me. one at a time calibrated them to 73dbs then ran Audyssey. I have an onkyo 707 and when i check the calibrated test tone levels, ALL speakers measure to about or around 70dbs uncluding the subs note: i never go above 0 usually for movies -5, which is loud but i like that. the sub was doing great! till this happend, im confused. tx in advance and sorry bout all the questions, i just don't want to be worrying about breaking my sub thats supposed to be unbreakable? any advice encouragment would be appreciated. I'll also keep this thread posted after i recieve the woofer for those that might be looking into this sub. for reference about placement: http://www.blu-ray.com/community/gallery.php?member=Vanorgecould the riser have caused it to overextend or something? or is that just silly
Last edited by Vanorge; 08/17/10 08:03 PM.
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Re: whats going on with my EP500?
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Joined: May 2003
Posts: 18,044
shareholder in the making
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shareholder in the making
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It's probably not bottoming out. Can you reproduce the sound (or make a softer, similar sound) by pushing gently on the woofer?
I am the Doctor, and THIS... is my SPOON!
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Re: whats going on with my EP500?
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Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 4,116
connoisseur
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connoisseur
Joined: Sep 2008
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Trying a new replacement woofer is probably the best course of action at this point. While the DSP is supposed to prevent the driver from bottoming out (which is one way to damage a driver), a woofer can still fail otherwise (without bottoming) over time. No sub is unbreakable.
I’m armed and I’m drinking. You don’t want to listen to advice from me, amigo.
-Max Payne
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Re: whats going on with my EP500?
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 47
buff
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OP
buff
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 47 |
It's probably not bottoming out. Can you reproduce the sound (or make a softer, similar sound) by pushing gently on the woofer? yes i can. its not as violent of course but i can. it feels like it hits something when i push it in with my hands, but not everysingle time. if i push it in like 5 or 6 times it might do it once. then i get scared that i F'd it up even more LOL
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Re: whats going on with my EP500?
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Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 4,116
connoisseur
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connoisseur
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 4,116 |
It sounds like the problem is the driver.
I’m armed and I’m drinking. You don’t want to listen to advice from me, amigo.
-Max Payne
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Re: whats going on with my EP500?
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 11,458
shareholder in the making
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shareholder in the making
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Definitely sounds like a bad driver. A new driver will take care of it.
::::::: No disrespect to Axiom, but my favorite woofer is my yellow lab :::::::
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Re: whats going on with my EP500?
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 11,458
shareholder in the making
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shareholder in the making
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"I'm a very good driver"...
::::::: No disrespect to Axiom, but my favorite woofer is my yellow lab :::::::
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Re: whats going on with my EP500?
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 47
buff
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OP
buff
Joined: Nov 2009
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sweet tx, so i should have it fixed by next tuesday. I'll be sure to get some bass heavy movies to test it out with, set it up the same way of course and hope i don't get that same issue. i'll repost after and tx again guys. I was worried that the sub was just not able to handle reference or close to reference levels, with out it going out. i can deal with just haveing a bad driver
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Re: whats going on with my EP500?
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 7,786
axiomite
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axiomite
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 7,786 |
It is my understanding that with DSP, the driver should not be able to bottom out. Out of curiosity, does it sound OK otherwise? You would think that if the driver is broken to the point it bottoms out, it would not sound particularly good.
Fred
------- Blujays1: Spending Fred's money one bottle at a time, no two... Oh crap!
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Re: whats going on with my EP500?
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 11,458
shareholder in the making
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shareholder in the making
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Also out of curiosity, how big is your room?
::::::: No disrespect to Axiom, but my favorite woofer is my yellow lab :::::::
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Re: whats going on with my EP500?
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 7,786
axiomite
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axiomite
Joined: Dec 2007
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Mark. That should not make any difference other than not having enough bass overall.
Fred
------- Blujays1: Spending Fred's money one bottle at a time, no two... Oh crap!
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Re: whats going on with my EP500?
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 47
buff
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OP
buff
Joined: Nov 2009
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It is my understanding that with DSP, the driver should not be able to bottom out. Out of curiosity, does it sound OK otherwise? You would think that if the driver is broken to the point it bottoms out, it would not sound particularly good. it sounds okay and well most of the time, it's just when it gets into the deep bass in movies, it makes that clack sound.like it can't handle it. not even my supercube does that and it's 8 inches, for a while i just let it go, and would turn down the bass, but i was watching "my name is khan" and it was just super annoying. I was like dude something is wrong!
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Re: whats going on with my EP500?
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 47
buff
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OP
buff
Joined: Nov 2009
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Also out of curiosity, how big is your room? its about 20x17x8-12 LxWxH
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Re: whats going on with my EP500?
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Joined: Sep 2004
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shareholder in the making
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shareholder in the making
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Mark. That should not make any difference other than not having enough bass overall. No, it shouldn't. But sometimes you run across a person who thinks M2s will fill a 30X40 foot room or an EP500 will fill the room at 120dB...i.e., even though he said he wasn't pushing it hard, I was curious what the definition of "not hard" was. Damn. I stepped in it again. Straight Man for hire.... get 'yer Straight Man here!
::::::: No disrespect to Axiom, but my favorite woofer is my yellow lab :::::::
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Re: whats going on with my EP500?
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 47
buff
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OP
buff
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 47 |
Mark. That should not make any difference other than not having enough bass overall. No, it shouldn't. But sometimes you run across a person who thinks M2s will fill a 30X40 foot room or an EP500 will fill the room at 120dB...i.e., even though he said he wasn't pushing it hard, I was curious what the definition of "not hard" was. Damn. I stepped in it again. Straight Man for hire.... get 'yer Straight Man here! na i completely understood why you asked. my room is not small but it's not Huge either. which is why i kept the SCII. i'll eventually get another EP500 (if it pans out) or an SVS Ultra. its at the 10 oclock position roughly and like i said before I calibrated them carefully each to 73dbs with the reciver LFE level at "0" one at a time. then ran MULTY EQ. in the recievers' LFE channel level after running AmultiEQ it rests at -7.I then rechecke levels with an SPL meter. and they measured together at 70'ish. im geussing max durring a movie about 100db or so, doubt much higher than that. no more than say 115 on a reaaaaallly loud part. so yea im not running it HOT or trying to get the most out of it. just want it right, but when a movie gets bassy it clacks
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Re: whats going on with my EP500?
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Joined: May 2003
Posts: 18,044
shareholder in the making
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shareholder in the making
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Naw, you've just got a defective or damaged driver. You'll be fine.
I am the Doctor, and THIS... is my SPOON!
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Re: whats going on with my EP500?
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Joined: May 2002
Posts: 10,654
shareholder in the making
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shareholder in the making
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Mark, I'll leave the definition of "not hard" to others(Peter?), but I'll again point out that rooms don't have to be "filled" with sound at the level needed at the listening position. That term should be deep-sixed.
-----------------------------------
Enjoy the music, not the equipment.
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Re: whats going on with my EP500?
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Joined: Sep 2004
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shareholder in the making
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shareholder in the making
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Hey, I was just saying that OTHERS want to "fill the room"....
::::::: No disrespect to Axiom, but my favorite woofer is my yellow lab :::::::
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Re: whats going on with my EP500?
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 7,786
axiomite
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axiomite
Joined: Dec 2007
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Hey, I was just saying that OTHERS want to "fill the room".... For that, we have beans.
Fred
------- Blujays1: Spending Fred's money one bottle at a time, no two... Oh crap!
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Re: whats going on with my EP500?
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Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 282
local
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local
Joined: Jul 2009
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I had about the same problem with my EP350 few weeks ago. Axiom sent my a new driver and now everything sound perfectly. Good luck
Nad C356 DAC & C515 Axiom M3v3 Grant Fidelity RPF-120 MKII Analysis Plus Black Oval 12&10 JRiver 19
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Re: whats going on with my EP500?
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Joined: Nov 2009
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buff
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OP
buff
Joined: Nov 2009
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okay got my new subwoofer yesterday and installed it. i have a few questions. does it matter how i hook it up. because there are two sets of negative and two sets of positive. so which set of negative and positive go on which side of the subwoofer? hope that makes sense.
i didn't get to calibrate it yet, as im doing that right now, but i did notice yesterday that it seems to be pushing more air out. before it used to suck in more than blow out. anybody know which way it's supposed to be. i would think out but you never know also could i have possibly gotten the connections reversed or better yet right!
tx
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Re: whats going on with my EP500?
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Joined: May 2003
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shareholder in the making
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shareholder in the making
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You shouldn't be using the high level inputs at all--you should be using a single RCA connection between your sub and the LFE/Sub output on your receiver. The connector on the sub is a 1/4" to RCA right angle adapter, and it can be a little finicky.
I am the Doctor, and THIS... is my SPOON!
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Re: whats going on with my EP500?
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Joined: Nov 2009
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buff
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OP
buff
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no im not using high level inputs... i was talking about the speaker connections from the amp to the woofer. the ones inside the box
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Re: whats going on with my EP500?
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Joined: May 2003
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shareholder in the making
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shareholder in the making
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Oh. Got me.
Can you take a picture for us?
Last edited by kcarlile; 08/25/10 10:37 PM.
I am the Doctor, and THIS... is my SPOON!
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Re: whats going on with my EP500?
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Joined: Nov 2009
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buff
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OP
buff
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i'll see how soon i can post some pics, i have my niece with me. tx for trying tho
but for now i guess its called the dual voice coil connections i think.
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Re: whats going on with my EP500?
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Joined: May 2003
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shareholder in the making
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shareholder in the making
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I doubt it matters; as long as you've got red to red and black to black, as it were, on both sides, it should work fine. Now, if you've got one reversed, that's not going to be a happy thing, but...
I am the Doctor, and THIS... is my SPOON!
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Re: whats going on with my EP500?
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Joined: Apr 2003
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shareholder in the making
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i did notice yesterday that it seems to be pushing more air out. before it used to suck in more than blow out. anybody know which way it's supposed to be. Vanorge, any subwoofer that is ported must port must blow out and suck in equally. If you believe you're feeling a difference, it's most likely because your hand is not a sensitive enough measuring device. This equal-blow-and-suck isn't just a rule I invented, it's physics. Allow me to explain. In order to make a sound, the subwoofer driver must move outward and inward many times a second. Every time it moves outward, it creates a slight vacuum in the box which causes air to move in through the port. Every time it moves inward, it pressurizes the air in the box and causes air to move out through the port. Keep in mind that the driver is moving in and out anywhere from 20 to 80 times a second or more. If the subwoofer port were actually blowing more than sucking, that would mean the driver was moving further and further into the box and not returning to the neutral position. The moral of the story is don't worry too much about the air moving through the port. If you can feel air at all, that means it's working.
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Re: whats going on with my EP500?
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Joined: Oct 2006
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axiomite
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axiomite
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If the subwoofer port were actually blowing more than sucking, that would mean the driver was moving further and further into the box and not returning to the neutral position.
Not to mention that the constant reduction in air pressure inside would mean it would eventually either a. implode b. suck in your cat and other small objects c. turn into a black hole from which nothing short of the the evil power of Justin Beiber's haircut could escape. Chris will be along shortly to take my laws of physics humor seriously and explain the error of my theories..... Just Kidding Buddy!
With great power comes Awesome irresponsibility.
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Re: whats going on with my EP500?
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Joined: Aug 2009
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axiomite
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axiomite
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Re: whats going on with my EP500?
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 47
buff
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OP
buff
Joined: Nov 2009
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i did notice yesterday that it seems to be pushing more air out. before it used to suck in more than blow out. anybody know which way it's supposed to be. Vanorge, any subwoofer that is ported must port must blow out and suck in equally. If you believe you're feeling a difference, it's most likely because your hand is not a sensitive enough measuring device. This equal-blow-and-suck isn't just a rule I invented, it's physics. Allow me to explain. In order to make a sound, the subwoofer driver must move outward and inward many times a second. Every time it moves outward, it creates a slight vacuum in the box which causes air to move in through the port. Every time it moves inward, it pressurizes the air in the box and causes air to move out through the port. Keep in mind that the driver is moving in and out anywhere from 20 to 80 times a second or more. If the subwoofer port were actually blowing more than sucking, that would mean the driver was moving further and further into the box and not returning to the neutral position. The moral of the story is don't worry too much about the air moving through the port. If you can feel air at all, that means it's working. i didn't measure with my hand.why would you assume that? I used a sheet of paper.I don't think i need nasa equiptment for the simple observation. what would happen is, it used to suck in the paper more than blow it out. now it blows it out alot more, and harder to boot. i just thought it was strange. regardless it's working well now. I calibrated it and watched gamer. i do have to set the subsonic filter to on though since i listen to movies quite loud. 100db peaks with my radio shack spl meter. for with the subsonic filter to off, it bottoms out. it made that same clack but just once. my conclusion is it's a great sub, i just don't like that i can bottom it out at 100dbs with subfilter to off. im eager to try out the SVS ultra. with it cutting out at 20hz its phenomenal tho.
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Re: whats going on with my EP500?
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Joined: May 2003
Posts: 18,044
shareholder in the making
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shareholder in the making
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If it's still clacking, there's still something wrong.
I am the Doctor, and THIS... is my SPOON!
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Re: whats going on with my EP500?
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Joined: Jun 2006
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aficionado
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aficionado
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. . . it bottoms out. it made that same clack but just once. . . i just don't like that i can bottom it out at 100dbs with subfilter to off. . . Definitely something unusual going on . . . the DSP makes it impossible for the subwoofer to bottom out.
jc
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Re: whats going on with my EP500?
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Joined: Nov 2009
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buff
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buff
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tx for the customer service JC. for those that have read up on whats going on, looks like kcarlile is right on. i gave a call to JC non other, and we're going to try and figure this out. it's looking like it might be an amp issue.
i was ready to give up and deal with the settling on my sub feeling but im glad i spoke up here and we can hopefully get this done right.
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Re: whats going on with my EP500?
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Joined: Dec 2007
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axiomite
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axiomite
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The moral of the story is don't worry too much about the air moving through the port. If you can feel air at all, that means it's working. So, when your trying to decide if your 10 year old sub that you would really like to get rid of sucks or blows, your're saying its really a toss-up?
Fred
------- Blujays1: Spending Fred's money one bottle at a time, no two... Oh crap!
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