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#327733 - 11/06/10 10:30 PM New Home Theater Build - Advice Wanted!
NuSkooler Offline
newbie

Registered: 11/06/10
Posts: 4
Loc: UT, USA
I am in the planning stage (and hopefully very near purchase time!) for a surround setup for my new work in progress home theater. I previously posted over at the AVS forums to get some rough ideas / confirmations, but would like to run my current proposed setup by the experts.

I am building a home theater in a approx 19' x 12' room. The direction we'll be facing is not ideal (not length wise) which I cannot change; Also, the couch is flush against the wall. Here are a couple Google SketchUp's I came up with:



Additional real photos of the room's current state can be found on my AVS forum post here: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=19422536

Now for the fun stuff. I have a relative with Axiom's and I've been in love with the sound for a while... now it's my turn! Here is what I plan on putting in the room. This is where I'm really looking for input -- I want to make sure I get the appropriate models for such a sized room.

The lineup:
Front L/R: M22 v3
Center: VP150 v3
Surround (1 pair for 5.1 initially): QS4 v3
Sub: eD A5-350
Receiver: I've been looking at both the Pioneer VSX-1120-K and the HK AVR 3600.
TV (already purchased): Sony KDL55NX810

Any input, suggestions, etc. on the above is greatly appreciated! Is there a better choice of the two receivers above... something else altogether? Are the speaker choices good?

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#327737 - 11/06/10 11:22 PM Re: New Home Theater Build - Advice Wanted! [Re: NuSkooler]
Adrian Offline
axiomite

Registered: 12/27/08
Posts: 6884
Loc: It's all about the location.
Welcome NuSkooler.

I'd upgrade the QS4s to QS8s if it were me, better range and power for only a moderate increase in $.....Why are the Q's in your diagram both on the side wall? is that assuming 7.1 with two on the cutaway side?

Denon or the new Onkyos seem to be the preferred choice of receivers here, generally.
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Half of communication is listening. You can't listen with your mouth.

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#327738 - 11/06/10 11:47 PM Re: New Home Theater Build - Advice Wanted! [Re: NuSkooler]
grunt Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 12/04/06
Posts: 3569
Loc: Nirvana

Don’t assume that putting your display on the long wall is necessarily bad. It will give you the option of having a wider front soundstage w/o getting to close to the side walls.

What Axiom speakers does your relative own? I ask because I would personally change your speaker selection unless you have already heard all those speakers and know already that you like them.

I would consider changing your VP150 for a VP100 and using the money saved toward upgrading the QS4s to QS8s especially if you plan to run 5.1 even if just initially. I do think the VP150 would work fine in your setup I used mine in a similar situation with my M22s and it blended perfectly. But from what I’ve read the QS8s are noticeably better than the QS4s and I don’t think changing from the VP150 to the VP100 would be as noticeable.

Another suggestion since your seating is so wide compared to your display is to not even use a horizontal center speaker. With wide seating the better horizontal dispersion of a vertical speaker like the M22 or M2 would almost certainly perform noticeably better than a horizontal speaker. The same would go if choosing one of these speakers to put the savings toward upgrading to a pair of QS8s.

As for rear speakers I’m not sure you would get a benefit worth the cost of another set of QS speakers. As you intend I would start with 5.1 and try playing with the surround speaker positioning. You could even put the surround speakers in the back corners like one is pictured. This could help create a better “phantom” rear image. You could eventually order a pair of rear speakers and try them out. If it turns out not to be worth the upgrade return them within 30 days and I think for most of the small speakers like surround and bookshelf it would only cost $30USD a pair to send back.

Cheers,
Dean
_________________________
3M80 2M22 6QS8 2M2 1EP500 Sony BDP-S590 Panny-7000 Onkyo-3007 Carada-134 Xbox Buttkicker AS-EQ1

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#327741 - 11/07/10 12:22 AM Re: New Home Theater Build - Advice Wanted! [Re: grunt]
tomtuttle Offline
axiomite

Registered: 06/20/03
Posts: 8488
Loc: Tacoma
I basically agree with Dean.

But I'd go a little farther. With the room as configured, you're not going to get diddly-squat from going to 7.1 from 5.1. Seriously. With the couch on the back wall, there's no place for "rear" speakers. Just get the QS8's and do 5.1 and enjoy yourself. Mount them either on the back wall or on the side walls.

If you can manage the aesthetics of a vertical center channel, that would be cool (even a M2). If not, considering the listening distance, you might not get much improvement by going from VP100 to VP150.

That Pioneer seems like a really good value. Denons are very popular. I also like Onkyo refurbs at either accessories4less or shoponkyo.

You are a sketchup God.

I love the look of the room, and that should be a great system. Enjoy the journey, and keep us posted!
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bibere usque ad hilaritatem

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#327745 - 11/07/10 01:09 AM Re: New Home Theater Build - Advice Wanted! [Re: NuSkooler]
JohnK Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 05/11/02
Posts: 10626
Bryan, welcome. The first point is that your sketch indicates that there's room at the bottom of the screen for a vertical M2 center, which I'd strongly suggest for a wider and smoother horizontal dispersion. Don't recess the front speakers as shown on the sketch; to minimize reflection and refraction from the stand have them protruding a fraction of an inch forward.

With the couch up against the back wall there's not enough room behind the listeners for back surround speakers in a 7.1 setup to form a rear sound field. Stay with QS side surrounds for 5.1 positioned very close to the corners, mounted either on the back wall or the side walls.

As to the receiver, I'd suggest that you consider either a Denon or Onkyo unit with Audyssey MultEQ auto-calibration and room equalization. The best buys can be had in factory refurbished units(which should be at least as reliable as brand-new ones), with Denon models being available from Dakmart and eCost and Onkyos from Accessories4less and ShopOnkyo.
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Enjoy the music, not the equipment.



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#327748 - 11/07/10 01:22 PM Re: New Home Theater Build - Advice Wanted! [Re: JohnK]
NuSkooler Offline
newbie

Registered: 11/06/10
Posts: 4
Loc: UT, USA
Thank you all for the reply's so far... I wasn't expecting so much feedback so fast!

Yes, the sketch is attepmting to show a cut out with the L 7.1 surrounds visible. I will update it to show 5.1. Someday I still may play with 7.1, who knows.

Note taken on swapping the QS4's for the QS8's. Makes sense, will do!

The center: Am I right in that the suggestions are saying to use a standard M2 bookshelf for the center? A pair? If nothing else, I'll definitely swap the VP150 for the VP100 if I say with a 'standard' center.

The L/R's I'll adjust to be more forward. What I have yet to figure out, but will have to is they need secured. I have a soon to be 1 y/o running around grabbing everything she can smile

I'll spend some time checking out Denon's and Onkyo's. I haven't done enough research between the two myself, but I've been told that Denon's have better video processing? Again, I have no evidence either way myself. This one is looking fairly nice: AVR-2311CI (though more power from the AVR-3311CI sounds tempting)

About the SketchUp: There are actually Axiom models available online to download. I pretty much just made the room to scale/etc.

Here is a small update to the diag:



Thanks again for all the helpful comments!

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#327750 - 11/07/10 05:52 PM Re: New Home Theater Build - Advice Wanted! [Re: NuSkooler]
grunt Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 12/04/06
Posts: 3569
Loc: Nirvana
For your setup I was suggesting using a single M2 as a center speaker. On the speaker ordering pages there is an option to add only a single speaker to your cart rather than a pair.
_________________________
3M80 2M22 6QS8 2M2 1EP500 Sony BDP-S590 Panny-7000 Onkyo-3007 Carada-134 Xbox Buttkicker AS-EQ1

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#327752 - 11/07/10 07:07 PM Re: New Home Theater Build - Advice Wanted! [Re: grunt]
jakewash Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 12/26/03
Posts: 10415
Loc: Calgary, Alberta
Yes, a single M2 will work, you can try 2 closely together or the extra one mounted above the TV(preferred) as this high/low really helps anchor the sound to the center of the TV.

You could also look at using the FMB to mount the M22's to the wall a little higher up to prevent little hands from pulling/touching at them. Once the the kids are old enough(not sure when that is) you can then start playing with better placement or upgrading to floorstanders, this is what I did.
_________________________
Jason
-----------------
TTTHHHPPPPPTTTT!

My HT

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#327763 - 11/07/10 09:51 PM Re: New Home Theater Build - Advice Wanted! [Re: NuSkooler]
JohnK Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 05/11/02
Posts: 10626
Yes, Bryan; a single vertical M2 center was what was suggested.

As to the receiver, a slightly higher maximum power rating really shouldn't be "tempting", and more power is one of the least important factors in a new receiver. The difference between 105 watts and 125 watts is only about 0.75dB in maximum loudness on split-second peaks. For example, a brief peak might use 105 watts to play at 105dB and could be played at 105.75dB with 125 watts, an insignificant difference. Any of the typical receivers rated in the 100-150 watt area have plenty of capacity for playing at safe sound levels in ordinary home setups and can be considered as essentially equal in that respect. Get the features that you want at the best price.
_________________________
-----------------------------------

Enjoy the music, not the equipment.



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#327773 - 11/08/10 12:31 AM Re: New Home Theater Build - Advice Wanted! [Re: JohnK]
nickbuol Offline
axiomite

Registered: 09/16/04
Posts: 5325
Loc: Marion, IA
I used to have my Axioms in an area that put me 12 feet from my screen and really wide. It worked out just fine. No 2 rows of seating, but otherwise it was still good.

QS8's for sure though. Just a better speaker for the space.

Good luck and have fun!
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http://ht.buol.us
2-M60s, VP180, 8-M3s, SVS 20-39PCi, DIY Sub, 8-Shakers, JVC RS45, Anthem MRX-1120

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