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New M80's
#335810 01/27/11 04:54 PM
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Installed 2 new M80's yesterday, to replace Energy 22 Ref which went to the back for surround duty.


First impressions after listening for about 1 hour:

Better detail in the mid and high frequencies; voices, both male and female are truer than through the Energy's, in fact they're very impressive.
Ambience is better defined too and sounds more convincing.
Treble is rendered with very high fidelity, is very smooth and detailed (i need to listen to triangles...)

That's it for now, i might give more in-depth comments later on as i get more familiar with the sound.

My brain's break-in was done and finished in just a few seconds, minutes at most; i adopted the sound right away and got a big smile on my face too.

Thanks to all who gave their comments on those speakers; they helped me make a good decision.

Re: New M80's
J. B. #335812 01/27/11 05:05 PM
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Great to hear, JB! congrats on your new Axioms.


Half of communication is listening. You can't listen with your mouth.
Re: New M80's
J. B. #335815 01/27/11 05:25 PM
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Awesome - enjoy the new gear. I am jealous as I need to find a way to fit M80's into my house somewhere!


Dan
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Re: New M80's
cb919 #335819 01/27/11 05:31 PM
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Welcome to the forum. Thanks for the quick write up, looking forward to some more of your thoughts about the M80s.


Jason
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Re: New M80's
J. B. #335821 01/27/11 05:44 PM
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Welcome,

Thanks for taking the time to write your first impressions. How long have you owned the Energy ?


jc
Re: New M80's
cb919 #335824 01/27/11 05:45 PM
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J.B, welcome and congrats! Your affinity will continue to expand. I'm marveled every time I listen to my Axioms.


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Re: New M80's
Ya_basta #335825 01/27/11 05:48 PM
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I'd lose the Energy and go with QS8's.


"A fanatic is someone who can't change his mind and won't change the subject" Churchill
Re: New M80's
Argon #335828 01/27/11 06:00 PM
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QS8,
I'm always highly impressed with their sound qualty and performance when listening to multi-channels music recordings (SACD - DVD-A - Bluray). Has someone listen to Bluray recording from the Norwegian company 2L ? Totally spectacular ! ! !
http://www.2l.no/

Last edited by Jc; 01/27/11 06:02 PM.

jc
Re: New M80's
Jc #335829 01/27/11 06:01 PM
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i bought the Energy around 1985.
they're still in excellent condition sound wise, but the foam surrounds are starting to show a bit of wear (rot).

Re: New M80's
Jc #335831 01/27/11 06:04 PM
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Originally Posted By: Jc
QS8,
I'm always highly impressed with their sound qualty and performance when listening to multi-channels music recordings (SACD - DVD-A - Bluray). Has someone listen to Bluray recording from the Norwegian company 2L ? Totally spectacular ! ! !
http://www.2l.no/


Very cool, Jc; thanks for the link!


The only reasonable argument for owning a gun is to protect yourself from the police.
Re: New M80's
Ya_basta #335851 01/27/11 07:52 PM
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85 a good year to get the hell out of high school. smile


M80s VP180 4xM22ow 4xM3ic EP600 2xEP350
AnthemAVM60 Outlaw7700 EmoA500 Epson5040UB FluanceRT85


Re: New M80's
SirQuack #335853 01/27/11 08:01 PM
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Especially if you were 23 in 1985!


Always call the place you live a house. When you're old, everyone else will call it a home.
Re: New M80's
BobKay #335855 01/27/11 08:03 PM
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Or 8.


I am the Doctor, and THIS... is my SPOON!
Re: New M80's
Ken.C #335857 01/27/11 08:06 PM
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Crap, I remember when Wid was my age, egads I'm getting up there. smile Hot Tub Time Machine baaaby back to the 80s, lol.


M80s VP180 4xM22ow 4xM3ic EP600 2xEP350
AnthemAVM60 Outlaw7700 EmoA500 Epson5040UB FluanceRT85


Re: New M80's
SirQuack #335858 01/27/11 08:12 PM
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If you got outta HS in 1985 (and you weren't 23), then you're not "getting up there." Not yet. You can still make it a goal, though.


Always call the place you live a house. When you're old, everyone else will call it a home.
Re: New M80's
BobKay #335859 01/27/11 08:15 PM
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I did beat the grandfather clause and was able to drink legally since 19, most of my frieds had to wait until 21 in college.


M80s VP180 4xM22ow 4xM3ic EP600 2xEP350
AnthemAVM60 Outlaw7700 EmoA500 Epson5040UB FluanceRT85


Re: New M80's
SirQuack #335862 01/27/11 08:45 PM
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I am born in 84... wink


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Re: New M80's
SirQuack #335863 01/27/11 09:02 PM
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Originally Posted By: sirquack
Crap, I remember when Wid was my age, egads I'm getting up there. smile Hot Tub Time Machine baaaby back to the 80s, lol.


That's not good LOL.


Rick


"A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity." Sigmund Freud

Re: New M80's
Ya_basta #335875 01/27/11 10:11 PM
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Congrats on you new M80's. I too was impressed when I listened to mine for the first time.


M80's, VP150, QS8's (all V3) Epic Sentinel Sub
Powered by Pioneer Elite
Re: New M80's
SirQuack #335876 01/27/11 10:15 PM
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Originally Posted By: sirquack
I did beat the grandfather clause and was able to drink legally since 19, most of my frieds had to wait until 21 in college.

I'll bet those 2 xtra years really gave you a leg up.
And I sure don't get that "legally" thing.

But then, I've never had any frieds.

Last edited by BobKay; 01/27/11 10:20 PM.

Always call the place you live a house. When you're old, everyone else will call it a home.
Re: New M80's
J. B. #335877 01/27/11 10:18 PM
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I can't believe nobody told you this yet. When you see your M80s for the first time, you're supposed to put on an eye patch and say "Ahoy, M80s!"

Re: New M80's
pmbuko #335878 01/27/11 10:23 PM
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I'm never going to talk to you again.


I am the Doctor, and THIS... is my SPOON!
Re: New M80's
Ken.C #335888 01/28/11 02:29 AM
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J.B., welcome. Glad to read how you're enjoying your Axioms.

Peter and Ken, I perceive that there's a story here that we'd enjoy hearing about in detail?


-----------------------------------

Enjoy the music, not the equipment.


Re: New M80's
JohnK #335891 01/28/11 02:50 AM
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I just got M80s, too, and I like the sound a lot --- especially the bass. I did already have some subwoofers, but the bass is better, which I guess is due to the mid-bass the M80s are giving me. However, I do have an amplifier problem driving the M80s, since occasionally they drive my Onkyo 3008 into protection mode. The Onkyo 3008 is supposed to drive 4 ohm speakers, and I don't listen at high levels, so this was a surprise to me. And a couple weeks from now, I'm going to replace my VP150 with a VP180, so I suppose the amplifier problem will get worse. Do you think adding an Emotiva XPA-3 to drive the M80s and VP180 will fix this?


Greg
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Re: New M80's
pmbuko #335892 01/28/11 02:52 AM
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Originally Posted By: pmbuko
you're supposed to put on an eye patch and say "Ahoy, M80s!"

I love it. I'll never see "M80s" again without thinking of this....


::::::: No disrespect to Axiom, but my favorite woofer is my yellow lab :::::::
Re: New M80's
MarkSJohnson #335897 01/28/11 03:45 AM
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No, it's just that that pun was too horrible to go unpunished.


I am the Doctor, and THIS... is my SPOON!
Re: New M80's
GregLee #335898 01/28/11 03:46 AM
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Originally Posted By: GregLee
I just got M80s, too, and I like the sound a lot --- especially the bass. I did already have some subwoofers, but the bass is better, which I guess is due to the mid-bass the M80s are giving me. However, I do have an amplifier problem driving the M80s, since occasionally they drive my Onkyo 3008 into protection mode. The Onkyo 3008 is supposed to drive 4 ohm speakers, and I don't listen at high levels, so this was a surprise to me. And a couple weeks from now, I'm going to replace my VP150 with a VP180, so I suppose the amplifier problem will get worse. Do you think adding an Emotiva XPA-3 to drive the M80s and VP180 will fix this?



What is the ohm setting in the receiver menu?


Rick


"A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity." Sigmund Freud

Re: New M80's
JohnK #335903 01/28/11 03:58 AM
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Originally Posted By: JohnK
Peter and Ken, I perceive that there's a story here that we'd enjoy hearing about in detail?

Ken's the one who introduced me to the art of puncraft. "Always go for subtlety," he would say. "The best puns slip under the radar of those who aren't playing close attention." He was a good teacher, but a little proud. He hasn't been the same since I sure passed his abilities.

Re: New M80's
pmbuko #335906 01/28/11 04:03 AM
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Ah, the smell of jealousy.


Wait, no. . .

I forgot to turn the fan on in the bathroom.

BRB


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"Nothin' up my sleeve. . ." --Bullwinkle J. Moose
Re: New M80's
pmbuko #335910 01/28/11 04:09 AM
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Originally Posted By: pmbuko
"The best puns slip under the radar of those who aren't playing close attention." He was a good teacher, but a little proud. He hasn't been the same since I sure passed his abilities.
Who says we're not paying close attention wink


Jason
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Re: New M80's
GregLee #335915 01/28/11 04:15 AM
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Greg, it appears that something's wrong which isn't directly due to the 3008(unless your unit is defective), since it should be able to easily drive M80s to beyond safe listening levels(as the numbers indicate, and other users have reported). The most common thing when something like this is present is an intermittent short in the connecting wires(or possibly internally in one of the speakers). Re-connect all the wires very carefully even if they appear to be good now. Try using only one M80 at a time to see if possibly an internal short is present in one of them.


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Enjoy the music, not the equipment.


Re: New M80's
jakewash #335921 01/28/11 04:52 AM
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D'oh. The first was a typo. frown

Re: New M80's
Wid #335928 01/28/11 05:09 AM
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Originally Posted By: wid

What is the ohm setting in the receiver menu?

4 ohms, as the manual specifies. I've seen the advice to leave it on the 6 ohm setting.


Greg
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Re: New M80's
JohnK #335930 01/28/11 05:17 AM
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Originally Posted By: JohnK
Re-connect all the wires very carefully even if they appear to be good now. Try using only one M80 at a time to see if possibly an internal short is present in one of them.

I'm quite skeptical about this short theory, but I certainly would test it if I could. The problem is that I don't know how to reproduce the fault, yet.


Greg
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Re: New M80's
GregLee #335931 01/28/11 05:18 AM
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Absolutely you should leave it on the 6 ohm setting. The other setting will simply limit current and therefore cause it to go into protect much more quickly.


I am the Doctor, and THIS... is my SPOON!
Re: New M80's
Ken.C #335936 01/28/11 05:25 AM
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The manual has to say that for the product to get a UL rating. But for performance you should leave it at 6 Ohm.


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Re: New M80's
pmbuko #335951 01/28/11 12:24 PM
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Originally Posted By: pmbuko
D'oh. The first was a typo. frown


I wish I had known before I went to Game Stop and asked if they had it in stock!


"A fanatic is someone who can't change his mind and won't change the subject" Churchill
Re: New M80's
GregLee #335964 01/28/11 03:06 PM
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Originally Posted By: GregLee
Originally Posted By: wid

What is the ohm setting in the receiver menu?

4 ohms, as the manual specifies. I've seen the advice to leave it on the 6 ohm setting.


Kind of figured so, put it back to the highest setting which is 6 ohm on an Onkyo and see how it does then.


Rick


"A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity." Sigmund Freud

Re: New M80's
Wid #335966 01/28/11 03:12 PM
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Just so you know what the others are talking about regarding the impedance switch read this excellent article. It will explain it all in detail.

http://www.audioholics.com/education/amplifier-technology/impedance-selector-switch-1

Also, if you have the M80's set to large in the bass management settings, change it to small and use a higher crossover point. That will definitely help take some load off the AVR as well.


I’m armed and I’m drinking. You don’t want to listen to advice from me, amigo.

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Re: New M80's
BlueJays1 #335974 01/28/11 05:10 PM
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Originally Posted By: Dr.House
Just so you know what the others are talking about regarding the impedance switch read this excellent article. It will explain it all in detail.

http://www.audioholics.com/education/amplifier-technology/impedance-selector-switch-1

Also, if you have the M80's set to large in the bass management settings, change it to small and use a higher crossover point. That will definitely help take some load off the AVR as well.

Thanks, all of you, for the information about the impedance switch. That being in the low setting, and having my fronts -- the M80s -- set to large, may very well be what has sent my Onkyo 3008 into protection mode. Also, I'm using the setting that sends LFE to the large speakers, as well as the subwoofers, so that could also be a factor.

In the discussion thread at Audioholics, there is some dissent from user kaiser_soze that the high impedance setting really is best. I'm looking forward to seeing some test results for this specific receiver about its behavior with 4 ohm speakers at the two impedance settings.

I have my fronts set to large, because my EP500 is using its high level inputs connected the receivers front outputs. The reason for that, in turn, is that the EP500 line-level inputs don't work. (It's obvious that there is a possibility of getting this repaired, so you needn't point it out to me.)

I'm still interested in the answer to the question I asked, if any of you has relevant experience: Would the XPA-3 used for the M80s (and VP180) fix the protection mode problem? I know there might be other remedies, but would the XPA-3 work?


Greg
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Re: New M80's
GregLee #335975 01/28/11 05:17 PM
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Yes, that would work. I would change the setting first, though. A lot cheaper.


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Re: New M80's
Ken.C #335978 01/28/11 05:20 PM
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Changing the settings should work. Then with the money saved from not buying an amp you can get the EP500 fixed.


Rick


"A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity." Sigmund Freud

Re: New M80's
Wid #336006 01/28/11 06:17 PM
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Using any external amp will take a huge load off the receiver and would stop the shut downs, as you are no longer using the internal amps and reducing the load created by them. The early XPA series in the past, didn't play overly well with the M80s, but that appears to have been resolved with the latest offerings.


Jason
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Re: New M80's
GregLee #336060 01/28/11 08:05 PM
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The XPA-3 would definitely drive your front speakers much easier than the Onkyo receiver. M80s are a hard load for many receivers to drive, get the Emotiva!

Re: New M80's
jakewash #336061 01/28/11 08:06 PM
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as i said in my first post, i will write some updates, once in a while, about the M80 sound.

i just listened to a CD which i had not played for quite a bit of time and which, if one wants good uncompressed reproduction from it, one better have speakers that can take lots of power and a good amp because the last minutes of the piece are a real blast, hitting you with everything the orchestra has.

the piece is Ravel's Bolero, with the MSO, Charles Dutoît, on Decca, a digital recording.

the sound was crystal clear from beginning to end, with no audible distortion and/or compression anytime during the whole piece, even though the end was overpowering in it's effect. (played at "live" levels)

when i had listened to it on my Energy 22 Ref., i could hear a bit of compression near the end, and so a bit of distortion too; the Energy's were pushed to the limit of their capacity.

i used to have an oscilloscope to check what was happening on my sound system; extrapolating from my notes re. playing this piece on the Energy speakers, i can estimate that the amp was now giving about 475-500 peak Watts to the M80s, maybe less, but not my much.
had my amp not been able to produce that much power, the peaks would have been clipped and there would have been some distortion.

i was so impressed by the quality of the reproduction with the M80s that many times during the audition i had tears in my eyes.

very impressive indeed!


Last edited by J. Bellemare; 01/28/11 08:26 PM.
Re: New M80's
GregLee #336088 01/28/11 09:30 PM
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Originally Posted By: GregLee

I just got M80s, too, and I like the sound a lot --- especially the bass. I did already have some subwoofers, but the bass is better, which I guess is due to the mid-bass the M80s are giving me. However, I do have an amplifier problem driving the M80s, since occasionally they drive my Onkyo 3008 into protection mode. The Onkyo 3008 is supposed to drive 4 ohm speakers, and I don't listen at high levels, so this was a surprise to me. And a couple weeks from now, I'm going to replace my VP150 with a VP180, so I suppose the amplifier problem will get worse. Do you think adding an Emotiva XPA-3 to drive the M80s and VP180 will fix this?

Odd! I have only ever shut down my Onkyo 3007 once when I first bought it to test how well it could handle my 3 M80s up front and QS8 surround and rears. I played GOA Trance music with a very intense bass beat in all channel stereo for 30 minutes at 100dB and then switched to 2ch stereo for another hour and a half at 100 dB and everything was fine. To test it’s limits I finally bumped it up to 105 dB and it shut down about 5 minutes later. Since then I’ve never had any shutdowns of my 3007 at any sane listening levels.

FYI all SPL measurements were 12 feet from the M80s.


3M80 2M22 6QS8 2M2 1EP500 Sony BDP-S590 Panny-7000 Onkyo-3007 Carada-134 Xbox Buttkicker AS-EQ1
Re: New M80's
J. B. #336159 01/29/11 03:00 AM
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JB, I also have the Dutoit Ravel performances, and certainly agree that the Bolero can give your speakers a good workout in certain passages. Now, although you hadn't played it and presumably the other Ravel works "for quite a bit of time", you can enjoy this wonderful music more often with your M80s.


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Enjoy the music, not the equipment.


Re: New M80's
GregLee #336165 01/29/11 03:38 AM
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shareholder in the making
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shareholder in the making
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 10,654
Greg, a couple more points. Since we don't know the cause of the "protection mode problem" yet, there's no purpose in discussing spending more money on a guess.

You say that the EP500 line-level inputs "don't work", but do you mean that the external input jack is broken? If so, the output jack works just as well to input the voltage, since it's connected to an internal "Y" arrangement which leads into the sub amp.

The closest approach to your request for comparative results using the lower impedance setting would be in the December S&V test results for the 1008 . Although your 3008 has a bit stronger amplifier section and should handle the M80s with even greater ease when properly set up, the effects of using the 4ohm setting are clearly shown, and would be similar in your case. Note that in one and two channel tests the 4ohm results of 272 and 229 watts were reduced to 65 and 45 watts at the 4 ohm setting. This may not be the only cause for the problem, but voluntarily cutting the voltage output capability certainly doesn't help, and this setting should never be used.


-----------------------------------

Enjoy the music, not the equipment.


Re: New M80's
JohnK #336171 01/29/11 05:11 AM
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 144
veteran
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veteran
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 144
Originally Posted By: JohnK

You say that the EP500 line-level inputs "don't work", but do you mean that the external input jack is broken?

I don't know what specifically is broken. Back when I bought the EP500, I posted here about the problem, and was told about plugging into the line-level output jack. So I did try that.
Quote:

The closest approach to your request for comparative results using the lower impedance setting would be in the December S&V test results for the 1008 . Although your 3008 has a bit stronger amplifier section and should handle the M80s with even greater ease when properly set up, the effects of using the 4ohm setting are clearly shown, and would be similar in your case. Note that in one and two channel tests the 4ohm results of 272 and 229 watts were reduced to 65 and 45 watts at the 4 ohm setting.

I don't understand what these tests of clipping have to do with whether the impedance setting causes the receiver to go into protection mode.


Greg
VP180, M80s, M22s, QS8(4), CSW S305s, EP500, Pioneer VSX-90
M2i, M3(2), Pio vsx-1020
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