 Dual centers
|
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,021 Likes: 1
connoisseur
|
OP
connoisseur
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,021 Likes: 1 |
Can adding a second identical center help if the first center falls short of the target?
I have considered the simplicity of adding the same center next to my current center. They would sit side by side and would probably be angled slightly, towards the lazy boy on each end of the love seat.
They don't have the best specs but together they would have 8-2.5" aluminum drivers.
And I could leave each component as is where is.
I'm eager to hear pro's, con's and horror stories.
Woofers: Quad 2-1/2" aluminum cone
Tweeter: 1-1/8" soft dome
Frequency Response: 90 Hz - 45 kHz
Nominal Input Power: 40W
Maximum Input Power: 120W
Sensitivity: 90 dB
Impedance: 6 ohms
Dimensions (WxHxD): 17-5/16" x 3-11/16" x 4-15/16"
Last edited by brwsaw; 05/07/13 05:22 AM.
|
|
|
Re: Dual centers
|
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 6,015
axiomite
|
|
axiomite
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 6,015 |
Normally a dual center is placed one above and one below the TV. That's how I have them. Never heard anyone mention them side by side.
|
|
|
Re: Dual centers
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 18,044
shareholder in the making
|
|
shareholder in the making
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 18,044 |
Michael D. in Alaska has them side by side. He uses vertical centers, though. Horizontal centers side by side would be... odd.
I am the Doctor, and THIS... is my SPOON!
|
|
|
Re: Dual centers
|
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,021 Likes: 1
connoisseur
|
|
OP
connoisseur
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,021 Likes: 1 |
Dual M80's...
Last edited by brwsaw; 05/07/13 02:08 PM.
|
|
|
Re: Dual centers
|
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 912 Likes: 4
aficionado
|
|
aficionado
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 912 Likes: 4 |
Can adding a second identical center help if the first center falls short of the target?
I have considered the simplicity of adding the same center next to my current center. They would sit side by side and would probably be angled slightly, towards the lazy boy on each end of the love seat.
They don't have the best specs but together they would have 8-2.5" aluminum drivers.
And I could leave each component as is where is.
I'm eager to hear pro's, con's and horror stories.
Woofers: Quad 2-1/2" aluminum cone
Tweeter: 1-1/8" soft dome
Frequency Response: 90 Hz - 45 kHz
Nominal Input Power: 40W
Maximum Input Power: 120W
Sensitivity: 90 dB
Impedance: 6 ohms
Dimensions (WxHxD): 17-5/16" x 3-11/16" x 4-15/16"
I would think not. The speaker sizes are comparable to those on soundbars where they have eight or ten of them and designed for a totally different application primarily in a one-speaker only with sub configuration. Whether its one center channel or five, it looks like the drivers on your particular model are just too small and the crossover would have to be set too high especially when you have M80s as mains making any sort of seamless transition of sound virtually impossible. As I always say, when it comes to speakers "you really can't defy the laws of physics".
|
|
|
Re: Dual centers
|
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,021 Likes: 1
connoisseur
|
|
OP
connoisseur
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,021 Likes: 1 |
Yeah, I already knew it was wishful thinking. It would have been an easy fix though.
|
|
|
Re: Dual centers
|
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 6,015
axiomite
|
|
axiomite
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 6,015 |
How come nobody uses high quality headsets. You could just have a set of plugins for them nearby, and everyone could get immersive sound. Something I might try playing with in the future, just for fun.
If I can figure out how to do this without increasing hearing loss.
|
|
|
Re: Dual centers
|
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 4,444 Likes: 16
connoisseur
|
|
connoisseur
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 4,444 Likes: 16 |
Michael D. in Alaska has them side by side. He uses vertical centers, though. Horizontal centers side by side would be... odd. I moved to the VP160 a while back. Way-mo-betta...
|
|
|
Re: Dual centers
|
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,021 Likes: 1
connoisseur
|
|
OP
connoisseur
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,021 Likes: 1 |
A new center is still my priority.
I'm hung up on trying to fit too many things in too small a space.
|
|
|
Re: Dual centers
|
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,021 Likes: 1
connoisseur
|
|
OP
connoisseur
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,021 Likes: 1 |
Lets pretend I want to use a pair of QS4's or QS8's for my center channel.
Would I benefit more from giving each its own channel of amplification or by running both of a single channel.
Its a two part question. Should I use the single output on the reciever or swap two channels off the amp?
|
|
|
Re: Dual centers
|
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 6,015
axiomite
|
|
axiomite
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 6,015 |
I have dual mains and centers, and using a single channel for each. Wasn't even aware there was a way to reassign amps to different channels.
|
|
|
Re: Dual centers
|
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,021 Likes: 1
connoisseur
|
|
OP
connoisseur
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,021 Likes: 1 |
I won't be re assigning. Just removing rears from the amp and using the recievers built in amp.
I'd preffer to keep it simple while I test the theory.
The simplest would be to run them off the receivers single output with a paired cable.
The recievers only powering the center and presence now. Theres headroom available.
Would running 2 8ohm speakers mean a 4ohm load?
|
|
|
Re: Dual centers
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 18,044
shareholder in the making
|
|
shareholder in the making
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 18,044 |
Yes, cabled to the same output, 2 8 ohm speakers would be 4 ohms.
I am the Doctor, and THIS... is my SPOON!
|
|
|
Re: Dual centers
|
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,021 Likes: 1
connoisseur
|
|
OP
connoisseur
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,021 Likes: 1 |
Is there a benifit or detriment to using seperate outputs?
|
|
|
Re: Dual centers
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 18,044
shareholder in the making
|
|
shareholder in the making
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 18,044 |
Almost no one (aside from CatBrat) does what you are proposing, which, if I understand it correctly, is running two pairs of L/R fronts. There is no second center output on any receiver I know of, so if you're talking about running dual centers, your question is moot.
Seriously, dude, you've got the worst case of upgraditis I've ever seen.
I am the Doctor, and THIS... is my SPOON!
|
|
|
Re: Dual centers
|
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,021 Likes: 1
connoisseur
|
|
OP
connoisseur
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,021 Likes: 1 |
I would be using 2 channels from the amp if I did.
The reciever could handle the load though.
I like to swap speakers. Looking at the cost of the stand and new center it almost makes sense to add another pair of M80's. I will work my old towers back into L /R and will try the dual 80's for a while. It won't be for a while though.
I'd like to hear Brians setup too.
I like how my layout sounds but the center has to go. It will join the parts pile asap.
|
|
|
Re: Dual centers
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 18,044
shareholder in the making
|
|
shareholder in the making
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 18,044 |
You won't be able to run a pair of M80s off of one channel; that would be a load of 2 ohms--and you can't reassign a rear amp to the center channel.
I am the Doctor, and THIS... is my SPOON!
|
|
|
Re: Dual centers
|
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 6,015
axiomite
|
|
axiomite
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 6,015 |
Kens right, I'd be leery of running 2 4ohm loads on the same channel. Doesn't mean I wouldn't try it, but I'd definitely keep a close watch on how much heat the amp / receiver generated.
So far running 2 8ohm loads hasn't presented a problem on 3 different mid to high end receivers.
|
|
|
Re: Dual centers
|
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,021 Likes: 1
connoisseur
|
|
OP
connoisseur
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,021 Likes: 1 |
I'd be running 2 QS4's or QS8's off one(receiver or amp). I'm not sure if having the empty channel on the amp would have any benifit except that at 4 ohm I should have more potential headroom.
M80's would be on seperate channels from the amp. Always will be.
|
|
|
Re: Dual centers
|
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,021 Likes: 1
connoisseur
|
|
OP
connoisseur
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,021 Likes: 1 |
Almost no one (aside from CatBrat) does what you are proposing, which, if I understand it correctly, is running two pairs of L/R fronts. There is no second center output on any receiver I know of, so if you're talking about running dual centers, your question is moot.
Seriously, dude, you've got the worst case of upgraditis I've ever seen. It wouldn't be dual left and right. Just two centers with the L/R move slighlty farther apart.
|
|
|
Re: Dual centers
|
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,021 Likes: 1
connoisseur
|
|
OP
connoisseur
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,021 Likes: 1 |
 I like the idea. I wonder if it will work. I did scale a different stand than the one I'm currently using but I've seen it and know it would work if the center wasn't to be placed in it.
Last edited by brwsaw; 05/28/13 01:44 AM.
|
|
|
Re: Dual centers
|
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 10,654
shareholder in the making
|
|
shareholder in the making
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 10,654 |
Of course it'll "work", within the inherent limits of the arrangement. As compared to using the M80 mains to carry the center channel material in a "phantom center" setup, placing two M80s(or other speakers)directly alongside the screen for center channel speakers has several effects. The center channel volume can be increased independently of the mains since different speakers are carrying it. The center channel image would be exactly centered for someone directly in the middle between them. As the listener would move to the side, so would the center channel image move with him, but not farther out than the center speaker on that side.
-----------------------------------
Enjoy the music, not the equipment.
|
|
|
Re: Dual centers
|
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,021 Likes: 1
connoisseur
|
|
OP
connoisseur
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,021 Likes: 1 |
So in theory this could provide 2 sweet spots on the love seat?
Could it also provide better imaging for seats below the QS's?
|
|
|
Re: Dual centers
|
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 10,654
shareholder in the making
|
|
shareholder in the making
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 10,654 |
Not really two "sweet spots". A single center channel speaker keeps the center material imaged directly in the middle of the screen, regardless of whether the listener is off to the side. Using two separated(sidewise)center speakers keeps the image in front of the listener who's off to the side, but it's no longer in the center of the screen where the voices etc., are generally supposed to be coming from, so that probably shouldn't be termed listening in the sweet spot.
-----------------------------------
Enjoy the music, not the equipment.
|
|
|
Re: Dual centers
|
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,021 Likes: 1
connoisseur
|
|
OP
connoisseur
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,021 Likes: 1 |
I think I'll try it on my next 2 day weekend.
Might wait until my QS8's arrive and add my first banana plugs into the mix.
|
|
|
Re: Dual centers
|
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,021 Likes: 1
connoisseur
|
|
OP
connoisseur
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,021 Likes: 1 |
Nope.
Just ruled it out.
Won't even bother trying dual M80's.
Sat down to watch TV and two things happened.
I opened the cabinet door and hit my left tower. I forgot I had changed the toe-in on a whim last night.
Second, when I turned on the Simpsons (no longer broadcast in surround on Fox) Homer was planted in my right tower. My right tower is 4' from the center of the screen.
It won't work.
Now...dual QS4's are still on the auditioning block.
Last edited by brwsaw; 05/28/13 04:37 AM.
|
|
|
Re: Dual centers
|
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,021 Likes: 1
connoisseur
|
|
OP
connoisseur
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,021 Likes: 1 |
I hate to say it but the idea of using dual M80's for the center channel got to me.
I will take the doors off the cabinet just to try it out.
Only harm will be if I waste a couple hours swapping them back and forth.
Two day weekend coming up in 3 weeks.
Stay tuned.
|
|
|
Re: Dual centers
|
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 912 Likes: 4
aficionado
|
|
aficionado
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 912 Likes: 4 |
I hate to say it but the idea of using dual M80's for the center channel got to me.
I will take the doors off the cabinet just to try it out.
Only harm will be if I waste a couple hours swapping them back and forth.
Two day weekend coming up in 3 weeks.
Stay tuned. I think this is an arrangement that many of us(space and pocketbook notwithstanding) would love to have. If you have either one or in your case, two M80's as center channels along with L/R M80s, you will get that perfect timbre match in the front sound stage that is just not possible with any horizontal center. Also the vertical speakers will give you a truer wider angle of dispersion so toed-in in such a manner to hit all the angles it should sound just fine.
|
|
|
Re: Dual centers
|
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 11,458
shareholder in the making
|
|
shareholder in the making
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 11,458 |
you will get that perfect timbre match in the front sound stage I don't disagree that identical speakers across the front are the ideal situation, but remember that even identical speakers can, and likely will, have a slight timbre different due to positioning within the room.
::::::: No disrespect to Axiom, but my favorite woofer is my yellow lab :::::::
|
|
|
Re: Dual centers
|
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,021 Likes: 1
connoisseur
|
|
OP
connoisseur
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,021 Likes: 1 |
Timbre!!
Might have to call in sick on Monday.
|
|
|
|
Forums16
Topics24,943
Posts442,465
Members15,617
| |
Most Online2,082
Jan 22nd, 2020
|
|
|
1 members (rrlev),
740
guests, and
4
robots. |
|
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
|
|
