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#401280 - 02/21/14 10:48 AM VP180 Vertical?
nickbuol Offline
axiomite

Registered: 09/16/04
Posts: 5329
Loc: Marion, IA
I've been wondering about this for some time. I have M60 fronts, and with the idea of the speaker layout of the VP180 not being quite as good as the layout of the VP160, I was wondering if putting the VP180 on its end to make it vertical would yield any increased awesomeness of the center channel?

I am not trying to "fix" anything as things sound pretty awesome, especially after I added treatments to my walls later last year, but I am always looking for the next tweak. Just like putting in some 50Hz low pass filters in-line with my bass shakers to make it so that they were just getting the 50Hz and below signal and not the 80Hz and below that was coming from my signal that was split from my subwoofer out. It make it so that they come into play for the deeper, punchier stuff and not the 50Hz - 80Hz less critical "buzzes".

So just looking for, like I said, the next tweak in my experience. I figured that I would ask before going through the process of taking down some panels and the screen to get to the VP180.
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#401287 - 02/21/14 03:24 PM Re: VP180 Vertical? [Re: nickbuol]
fredk Offline
axiomite

Registered: 12/06/07
Posts: 7786
Loc: Canada
If you are going that route, just go to a third M60 and be done with it.
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#401288 - 02/21/14 03:51 PM Re: VP180 Vertical? [Re: nickbuol]
nickbuol Offline
axiomite

Registered: 09/16/04
Posts: 5329
Loc: Marion, IA
Yeah, I was going to do that back when I bought the VP180, but I was planning for the future where I may not have an acoustically transparent screen to hide the vertical speakers behind, so I paid more and got the "biggest" center channel Axiom had at the time (the VP160 wasn't out yet) so that I had an option for down the road in case I needed it.
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2-M60s, VP180, 8-M3s, SVS 20-39PCi, DIY Sub, 8-Shakers, JVC RS45, Anthem MRX-1120

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#401296 - 02/21/14 06:15 PM Re: VP180 Vertical? [Re: nickbuol]
SirQuack Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 01/29/04
Posts: 13576
Loc: Iowa
I guess the only thing that comes to mind, is a conversation that comes up here often. A floorstanding speaker is designed to have a horizontal dispersion by design, as is a vertical center channel. If you flip them I would think the dispersion pattern would give you affects you may not want.
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#401297 - 02/21/14 07:19 PM Re: VP180 Vertical? [Re: nickbuol]
tomtuttle Offline
axiomite

Registered: 06/20/03
Posts: 8488
Loc: Tacoma
First, and most obvious, you're never going to know how well that might work in your room until you try it in your room.

Lastly, I think that Randy's comments are appropos; part of the crossover design would deal with baffle-step correction, and would differ based on the size and configuration of the surface upon which the tweeter is mounted. i.e. ALL other things being equal, the crossover design is likely different based on the speaker's intended orientation.
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#401298 - 02/21/14 07:45 PM Re: VP180 Vertical? [Re: nickbuol]
SirQuack Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 01/29/04
Posts: 13576
Loc: Iowa
I'm guessing it would sound something like this, Delp vocals only with no band backing him, amazing voice.


RIP Brad

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aNHFtJsbcYc
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#401315 - 02/22/14 12:24 PM Side Surround Placement [Re: nickbuol]
nickbuol Offline
axiomite

Registered: 09/16/04
Posts: 5329
Loc: Marion, IA
OK. No problem. I will leave it as is.

I was in another discussion elsewhere about putting side surrounds actually in front of the main/front listening area. Dolby, THX, DTS, etc all say that they should be no more than 90 degrees to the side, or back a little, and never forward. Some are saying that they are getting a much more immersive surround field with it. Personally, I can't test this out since my speaker wires come through my wall right where my side QS8s are located, and pushing the wires through the wall, cutting a new hole, and trying to fish them out the new hole through two layers of 5/8" drywall would not be fun.

Than again, those people are using direct radiating surround speakers. I do wonder if this has something to do with why the surround field sounds so much better in my second row than in my front row where I like to sit.
_________________________
http://ht.buol.us
2-M60s, VP180, 8-M3s, SVS 20-39PCi, DIY Sub, 8-Shakers, JVC RS45, Anthem MRX-1120

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#401319 - 02/22/14 02:06 PM Re: VP180 Vertical? [Re: nickbuol]
Gr8_White_North Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 07/12/09
Posts: 2272
Loc: Whitehorse YT
Is this how your room is configured now. I have often wondered how only 2 side surrounds could have enough output for a larger than normal room with 2 rows of seats. I think if I had a theater I would use 2 side surround outputs from the receiver and drive a second amp with the pre-outs for 2 more further ahead.





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#401320 - 02/22/14 02:44 PM Re: VP180 Vertical? [Re: nickbuol]
nickbuol Offline
axiomite

Registered: 09/16/04
Posts: 5329
Loc: Marion, IA
That is sort of the way that I went.



I know that it seems really similar, but the speakers are at 90 degrees (straight to the side) of the listening area, and not the front of the seats. This is how all of the big names show it. Even or behind where the head would rest on the seat, and not in line with the front of the seating area.

There are very few diagrams of what to do for 2 rows, and most of them just put the second row behind the first, and bump the rear surrounds back, but leave the side surrounds "as-is."

I too wonder if a second set of surrounds would help, but at the same time you are talking about $750+ to add them once you factor in almost $600 for another pair of QS8s, and just $150 for an amp. There has to be a better way. LOL
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2-M60s, VP180, 8-M3s, SVS 20-39PCi, DIY Sub, 8-Shakers, JVC RS45, Anthem MRX-1120

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#401321 - 02/22/14 03:32 PM Re: VP180 Vertical? [Re: nickbuol]
Gr8_White_North Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 07/12/09
Posts: 2272
Loc: Whitehorse YT


Absolutely, from a financial point of view its expensive. I was more shooting from the hip and pontificating the ideal setup. Since I only have one seating position its not issue but maybe I can have this issue one day . What about adding some front presence speakers, I found it added to my enjoyment.
Any time I consider more speakers I immediately think about all the wiring I already have lol.
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What others think of me is none of my business.
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