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Upgrade from vp100 on-wall to vp150 on-wall
#408291 11/24/14 05:48 PM
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I, like many, received the axiom holiday countdown promotion and it has me considering an upgrade. I have a modest 5.1 system in my main family / living area made up of a pair of on wall m22s and on wall vp100 for LCR, a pair of QS4s for surrounds, and a Klispch RW12D sub. These are all being driven by a Denon 2312CI reciever. We use the system for about 80% tv/movies and 20% music.

When I bought the system 2 years ago I contemplated going with the VP150 instead of the VP100. In the end I ended up going with the vp100 mostly do to cost but I'm wondering, given the deal I can get now, if I should update to the on-wall vp150. Right now my only option is an on wall speaker. Will I hear a noticeable difference between these two on wall speakers particularly with movie/tv dialog?

Most discussion I find on the vp150 is people suggesting going with the vp160 instead but that is a bookshelf variety that won't accommodate my needs. There isn't a ton of discussion on the on-wall vp150.

Thoughts?

Re: Upgrade from vp100 on-wall to vp150 on-wall
Stsalomon90 #408293 11/24/14 06:06 PM
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Funny you should bring this up as I'm upgrading my living room setup from Polk satellites to Axiom's. I have the on wall m22's, and looking at m2 on walls for surrounds. This is not my main large setup and the room is only 12x14.

So looking at the VP150, I'm wondering if its overkill. Is there anything about the 100 you do not like?

Last edited by newf; 11/24/14 06:07 PM.

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EP500/800/HSU VTF3/SVS PB2k/SB2k/SB-12
Re: Upgrade from vp100 on-wall to vp150 on-wall
Newf #408302 11/24/14 09:21 PM
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My only complaint is that when watching blu rays it seems like the dialog has some trouble coming through. It's that phenomenon where you feel like you have to turn things up to hear dialog and down for the louder parts of the movie. Almost like the dialog can't keep up. It's a bit hard for me to describe. I'm definitely not an audiophile. I have run the AVR's audyssey calibration but I still find myself reaching for the remote to turn things up and down due to the dialog in movies. I don't know if that is a function of the center speaker, audyssey calibration, me needing to boost certain levels, or just poorly mixed audio. I don't really notice the same thing when watching TV but that typically happens at lower volume levels. It may also be worth noting that my room size is much larger than yours. I don't know dimensions off the top of my head but it is an open concept entry way, kitchen, dinning and living area.

I'm not sure I would even consider upgrading could I not get a vp150 for about half the price. The deal simply has me questioning if maybe I should upgrade.

Re: Upgrade from vp100 on-wall to vp150 on-wall
Stsalomon90 #408303 11/24/14 10:48 PM
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With all my setups, I find I always have to run the center channel just a bit higher then what audyssey suggest.


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M80/VP150/VP160/QS8
4xM3/M22OW/M2OW/VP150OW/4xM3IC/4xM3OW
EP500/800/HSU VTF3/SVS PB2k/SB2k/SB-12
Re: Upgrade from vp100 on-wall to vp150 on-wall
Stsalomon90 #408307 11/25/14 12:49 AM
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I originally used a VP100 that was not ideally placed - on a shelf that was only a couple of inches off the floor & tilted upwards towards the listening area. My Audyssey 'heard' it at 80 Hz.

I never felt that the VP100 was particularly deficient; however, a couple of years ago I began reading that there was much more content than just dialogue now being mixed into the CC. Therefore, to gain some more 'horsepower' & bass extension, I upgraded to a VP160 & that required a new stand because it is a monster. My Audyssey 'hears' it at 40 Hz so it is a much more capable speaker. Furthermore, its driver placement on the front baffle, according to some so-called experts, is much closer to ideal than the 'stretched out' placement on the VP150. This theoretically improves off axis response but in most HT setups, I suspect that this is not much of an issue...

TAM

Last edited by exlabdriver; 11/25/14 12:50 AM.
Re: Upgrade from vp100 on-wall to vp150 on-wall
Stsalomon90 #408311 11/25/14 02:49 AM
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The problem likely arises from the fact that in many movies the dialog is mixed too low to be clearly audible during scenes when there's also other audio content being played. At least a partial remedy is to set the center channel level(not the overall level)maybe 3-4dB higher than the "balanced" level as determined by Audyssey or other method of level calibration.

The VP150 can play at a higher maximum level than the VP100, but it's unlikely that this would help with the basic problem of dialog mixed too low, as mentioned above.


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Enjoy the music, not the equipment.


Re: Upgrade from vp100 on-wall to vp150 on-wall
Stsalomon90 #408314 11/25/14 04:03 AM
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In my haste to 'Submit' my post above, I forgot to mention that I fully agree that the 'mix' is often the culprit.

One of the worst examples of this was the first 'Sherlock Holmes' from 2009 with Robert Downey Jr & Jude Law. It was universally criticized for having a CC that was woefully inadequate for hearing & understanding dialogue. It is doubtful that even cranking the CC up would have helped much...

TAM

Last edited by exlabdriver; 11/25/14 04:03 AM.
Re: Upgrade from vp100 on-wall to vp150 on-wall
Stsalomon90 #408318 11/25/14 01:05 PM
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I find that I need to keep the CC a few dB "hot", as do many others here.

I noted that my new receiver even has a shortcut to raise the CC to increase intelligibility.

I liken the dialog mix to Hollywood's version of the loudness wars. Drop the dialog in the mix a bit and the explosions, etc., are louder in comparison.

Jeez, I just sounded old when I typed that.


::::::: No disrespect to Axiom, but my favorite woofer is my yellow lab :::::::
Re: Upgrade from vp100 on-wall to vp150 on-wall
Stsalomon90 #408321 11/25/14 03:00 PM
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I went from an in/on-wall VP100 to an in/on-wall VP150 to an in-cabinet VP160.

I considered each one an improvement over the other.

Re: Upgrade from vp100 on-wall to vp150 on-wall
Stsalomon90 #408324 11/25/14 04:22 PM
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Thanks all, this is helpful input. Perhaps this week I will try simply increasing the center channel and see how I like that across various sources. That is certainly cheaper...

Last edited by Stsalomon90; 11/25/14 04:27 PM.
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