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Re: So NOW I'm a real Axiom owner...
Boomzilla #416049 12/25/15 01:01 AM
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Tam is totally correct. Even a mild day in the summertime can slow the veneer process a lot. The glue doesn't cure as fast and the clear coat takes forever even on cool summer days. I waited patiently for some sunny days to get the best hardening times. There is a lot of time and effort involved with veneer , and more so when its going to a customer who is going to inspect every surface for a mistake. Mine look great at up to 6" but would fail a customers inspection.

Boom , I was hoping to hear your impressions of the M100 so I too must endure the wait so we will wait together. Since our sonic memory is not very good its a shame the transition could not have been quicker. Alas this is a first world problem so enjoy the more important things in life like time with the family during the holiday season. smile


DOG is GOD spelled backwards.
What others think of me is none of my business.
M80 V3 MY GLOSS Cherry
Re: So NOW I'm a real Axiom owner...
Boomzilla #416054 12/25/15 02:39 PM
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Mine are vinyl, but "custom" maple vinyl rather than the default cherry/black-ash. I've owned real wood Axioms & vinyl Axioms. The real wood IS nicer, but at this time, just wasn't worth the extra money for me. My piggy bank was stretched to the limit just to get the M100s anyway, and it wouldn't have been possible at all except for Axiom's generous trade-in allowance. And by the way, if anyone's looking for some ABSOLUTELY PERFECT M80s at a great price, keep an eye on the Deals section of the website for a pair of M80s in Russian Maple vinyl with light tan grills. Those were probably mine. Mine were NEVER abused, and are as "like new" as you could possibly find.

Merry Christmas!


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Re: So NOW I'm a real Axiom owner...
Boomzilla #416077 12/27/15 09:01 PM
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So assuming a medium-sized room (18 x 34 feet) and lower listening levels (never above 90 dB) how much power does one need for the M100s? Or to phrase it differently, how little power can one get by with?

With an (honest?) efficiency rating of 88 dB (1 w / 1 m), and a listening position approximately 3 meters away, the 1 watt SPL should be ~81 dB. (-6 dB for every doubling of distance - so 88 at one meter, 82 at two meters, and 76 at four meters).

So doubling the power for every three dB increase, to get 90 dB at the listening position, I'd need 8 watts of amplifier power (81 = 1W / 84 = 2W / 87 = 4W / 90 = 8W).

Now for SPLs > 90dB, the power requirements increase by a LOT -
93 dB = 16W
96 dB = 32W
99 dB = 64W
102 dB = 128W
105 dB = 256W
etc.

So my conclusion here is that any 50W amplifier (into four ohms) should be more than sufficient for my needs.

Is this correct?


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Re: So NOW I'm a real Axiom owner...
Boomzilla #416079 12/28/15 12:17 AM
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What I don't understand in the equation given is how the efficiency rating is gotten. I know it's a number published by Axiom, but how did they come up with this number. is it from an average of power required to generate pink noise, or is there a real life side to this?

I ask as I am sure that the power levels needed to get the amount of sound level you desire is also influenced by what you are listening to. The amount of power to drive a tweeter is a small fraction of the amount of power needed to drive the 6.5" long throw woofer.

I would expect that you might be pulling far more power listening to a bass heavy rave club track at 90db over listening to a flute concerto in D major. All things being equal need not apply hear.


Anthem: AVM60, Fosi DAC-Q5
Axiom: ADA1500, LFR1100 Actiive, QS8, EP500, M3, M3comp, M5
Re: So NOW I'm a real Axiom owner...
Boomzilla #416081 12/28/15 02:46 AM
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The manufacturer's specifications actually DO come from industry standards. Loudspeakers are measured at their centers (physical height/2 and physical width/2) from a distance of one meter. A voltage is delivered to the speaker (using white noise, 20 to 20K Hz. if I remember right) equivalent to one watt. The actual voltage necessary for one watt varies with the speaker impedance due to Ohm's law. The calibrated SPL meter averages the decibel count at one watt / one meter, and that number becomes the published efficiency of the speaker. These measurements are taken in an anechoic chamber and are devoid of room reinforcement.

Common speaker outputs range from 80 dB (highly inefficient speakers) to 104 dB (Klipschorn). The rest (outputs at different distances and outputs at different wattages) are just plain physics.

Last edited by Boomzilla; 12/28/15 02:48 AM.

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Re: So NOW I'm a real Axiom owner...
Boomzilla #416082 12/28/15 01:04 PM
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Given that is how they get that number. But I guess my question is how relevant is that number?

The point that I was making was along the line of I would need far more power if I wanted to listen to deep bass house music than the number they published.


Anthem: AVM60, Fosi DAC-Q5
Axiom: ADA1500, LFR1100 Actiive, QS8, EP500, M3, M3comp, M5
Re: So NOW I'm a real Axiom owner...
Boomzilla #416084 12/28/15 08:20 PM
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Matt you are absolutely correct and there is plenty of info available on this subject. Since this test is done with a single frequency at a specified level (1 watt ) at a specific distance
(1 meter) it doesn't really reveal the speakers true identity since the impedance changes with frequency which draws more current as the impedance drops. Pulling more current than the amplifier can supply will clip the signal with varying degrees of change to the music . The only way to know if Boom's receiver will do the job is to wait and see when he gets the new speakers.


DOG is GOD spelled backwards.
What others think of me is none of my business.
M80 V3 MY GLOSS Cherry
Re: So NOW I'm a real Axiom owner...
Boomzilla #416085 12/28/15 08:52 PM
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To add to this, the furnishings and overall room absorbtion, will decrease the efficeiency of the system's output. Plan on losing 3-5db of headroom to acheive the same reference level in a bare vs a treated room. This is especially true if the early reflection points are treated with absorbtion.

Re: So NOW I'm a real Axiom owner...
Boomzilla #416086 12/28/15 09:18 PM
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Well I did get a little bit lost as a few pages back he was talking about an amp with 85wpc where in the last post he stated 50wpc. There is quite a bit of difference between the two.

But glad that Socketman cleared it up for me. I just wanted to make sure that I understood things too.

I don't know what db level that I like to play at, but when I moved my speakers from the Anthem 170w@8ohms to the smaller Amp/OneA 80w@8ohms, I did think the sound degraded on the lower end with my LFR's. I know that they do need a bigger amp to run them when you turn the sound up to a reasonable level. Will have to see if I can figure out the db on them with my ipad.


Anthem: AVM60, Fosi DAC-Q5
Axiom: ADA1500, LFR1100 Actiive, QS8, EP500, M3, M3comp, M5
Re: So NOW I'm a real Axiom owner...
Boomzilla #416087 12/28/15 09:20 PM
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The value of having all speakers tested identically is that one can accurately evaluate the RELATIVE efficiencies of two pairs (or more) of different speakers. Regardless of what the impedance does, regardless of what room they're in, a speaker with an anechoic sensitivity higher by 3 dB or more than another indicates that (ultimately) the higher sensitivity speaker takes fewer watts to drive.

Depending on how loudly you want to listen, depending on how large your room is, and depending on how much amplifier power you can afford, knowing the speakers' sensitivity is a valuable thing.

It would be impossible to compare speakers efficiencies were not the test conditions standardized.


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