Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Home Theater Advice for surround speakers - QS4, QS8 or on-wall

Atmos and DTS-X is like putting cream onto a baked apple pie. The movies are now being mixed at the post-production using objects and encoded in ATMOS and/or DTS-X so that modern cinema's have something better to offer the movie goer. Think, they are loosing customers to Netfix and people just not going out to the movies.

Your 5.1 is about 88% as good as a home ATMOS / DTS-X
Your 7.1 is about 93%

So Atmos and DTS-X does add something, but it is not an revolutionary that much better experience. The average home theater is not perfect and unless you are throwing hours and thousands towards getting to that next level, you are not going to find it that much better.

I watch movies at home to escape for a bit and enjoy the entertainment.

But the cream is the best part!

Hey pidg dont feel bad your not the only one torn between 5.1/7.1 and ATMOS. I argue with myself daily about the cost vs sonic improvement. It is a huge outlay of cash and without hearing it in action i suspect my internal wrestling will continue. If you listen to some reviewers you would swear we have been listening to a tin can with a string connected to it ,the improvement is that great. I just wonder is they are trying to convince us or convince themselves. At present i have QS8's and it is a great experience but i just cant help wondering LOL. Maybe one day but the house needs a roof.

Fwiw movies encoded with atmos sound better anyway. There is a benefit even without atmos speakers.
Nail 5.1 or 7.1 first and enjoy.

As a lover of Atmos, I am also a realist. Atmos is quite good, but you have to also keep in mind that it still relies on the person doing the sound mix. Some people/companies are better at it than others. Also some movies just don't lend themselves to getting much value. An example would be a romantic comedy. Heck, even the first DTS:X title (Ex Machina) really didn't seem improved as they only added subtle environmental elements. Something that a lot of people would miss unless they could do an A/B test of the material. Based off of movies like that, it would be completely not worth it.

That being said, there are a lot of movies that really do capitalize on it. Heck, even movies that you would never think would benefit do. Age of Adeline has a spectacular car crash scene that is very Atmos worthy. It last about a minute. The rest of the movie doesn't hardly touch the overheads, so you aren't getting an immersive effect beyond regular 5.1 or 7.1 at that point.

So even movies with really good native Atmos content probably still only effect 10-15% of the whole movie as a norm, others will have longer sequences (imaging the ridiculously long cars chasing down the military plane scene in Fast & Furious 6 where the runway must have been 100 miles long or something silly). That chase scene lasted a long time. IF it would have been in Atmos, then that would have made that movie exceed that number. It isn't in Atmos, but just saying. It is possible.

So you have to decide if that really great improvement for only a small portion of a movie is worth it. Now, upmixed movies do utilize overhead speakers more, but usually it is very subtle through the whole movie until any action scenes or ones where the volume increases and then you notice it more.

So you have to figure out if that is worth the price of admission so to speak. Is Atmos really the next generation in sound? Absolutely. Does it come cheap? Not really... You can get a fairly inexpensive receiver, but usually are limited to 5.1.2 or maybe 5.1.4/7.1.2 but you will pay a little more. Then you need more speakers, and don't think that you can skimp on the speakers. Bose Cubes won't cut it. The more "full range" the speaker is, the better. That costs money too. Plus you need to run more wires, maybe get speaker mounts for the ceiling depending on your room, etc.

Again, choice is up to everyone. I bought an Anthem MRX-1120, traded in my four QS8 surround (which I got credit for, but not a ton), and bought eight on-wall M3s... You do the math and that is almost $2000 in speakers (might have been around $1500 after trade in), and a $3500 MSRP receiver. I get a lot more benefit than just Atmos and DTS:X with the Anthem receiver, but 7.2.4 Atmos all in one single box was the primary driver. Money certainly does not grow on trees in our back yard. I had to do some of the purchases over time, like swapping out the QS8s for M3s for regular 7.2 over a year before doing anything else, and I had to work some side jobs to fund the upgrade, plus a small bonus from work certainly helped (came the exact time that I wanted to make the receiver purchase. I hadn't had an opportunity for a bonus in over 15 years, so it was unexpected.)

Worth it for me? Absolutely. I am so happy that I did it, but the pain of the price tag has been gone for a year now, so it is easier to say that.

Well, right now I really want to improve my surround experience compared to my Paradigm Titan and probably go 7.1 later this year with surround backs (or use the Paradigm as surround backs for now).

After reading all your comments and thinking about it, Atmos may be the best new thing but really I do not have the money to add a new receiver and a lot of speakers for that 15% more experience Thank a regular 5.1 or 7.1 setup.

yes, where and when does it end. Atmos, DTS:X, Auro 3D Now in a couple years will be ATMOS II ,,,,,,,,,
I was seriously thinking upgrade, but the more and more I think about it, thats a whole lot of money and research. DO I go with inwalls or onWalls or those SVS Primes ......
That there is $1000 extra costs. Then its upgrading the Pre/Pro or receiver, another $2000 entry level. Yes, you can go cheaper $1000 but really at 7ch they were pushing the wattage ratings now they are adding an extra 4 channels ???? I believe thats ok if you add atleast a 3 channel external amp to run the front three. Let is do the rears and heights. So now your up $3000 - $4000 more for ATMOS.
Also, my room is 11.5 x 15.5 x 7.5, I think it is on the small side for ATMOS. I could just add front heights and maybe use the extra money and grab a couple of EP500 and go with four and I'd have a kick ass system.

As nick said ATMOS only comprises a small portion of the movie and is totally dependent on how it is mixed which makes me wonder even more if I really need it vs want it. Troy i dont think your ceiling height is all that bad, maybe a bit low but positioning the overhead speakers a little closer to the LP and aimable tweeters would overcome the limitation.

I too have done the math. Send pre/pro for upgrade 900 american, New amp with 6 channels 1800 american and 4 in ceiling speakers another 400 thats a lot of change so maybe just get a projector which i will enjoy more and call it a day.

I think it's safer to wait for hdmi 2.1 spec amps. I don't think they are out yet? It's too close now to buy anything else.

Nic is right, and my experience with Atmos is that it works really well, but it depends completely on how the studio used it. Which is like any movie really. Right now it seems most studios haven't a clue what to do with it. It's getting better. I know Deep water Horizon was superb. But a lot of movies still don't get it. Tom Cruise's new Jack Reacher movie absolutely sucked for Atmos. Both movies out around the same time, one excellent, the other sucked. Now with Atmos you really need to drop everything you know and understand about Dolby Digital. 3d Positional sound is a lot more than just ceiling speakers. So a movie like San Andreas, which hardly used the ceiling speakers, still sounded great in Atmos...but it also sounds great in 7.1. So.. worth it? To me yes.
The upmixing for non Atmos is good, but not exactly a game changer, even music sounds a little better with Atmos vs Pro logic or other DTS modes but I still prefer good old 2 channel for music. When Atmos is done right, you will smile, and you will want more. That's what I remember about the switch from pro logic to DD.

Atmos came out around the same time I also got a bonus, and I suddenly lost an amp. Add a black Friday sale and I had my ceiling speakers as Axiom just came out with them too. The timing just fell into place. Otherwise I would have waited...this was two years ago.

But it didn't take long to realize the days of having those crazy good QS8's up high in the back were long gone and I tried lowering them, which helped a lot, but still I need direct firing on wall M3's. Which, if they ever hit the B Stock store I'm going to grab a set in black in case ANYONE at Axiom is reading...daddy just worked a lot of overtime in the past week, maybe I can sneak another set in the house! lol. Plus I need to trade in my vp150/qs8's to get a second set later on.

Stop pushing me back over the fence man, sheesh