Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Advice from Axiom Owners M3 Crossover setting

Hello everyone,

It's been a long time.

I have been switching around with my home cinema speakers just recently and have last resorted to using my M3(v2) as Front speakers in place of my pair of Definitive Technology(DT) BP6Bs (bipolar) which are now being used as surround back and another BP6B pair as side speakers. However due to space constraints, I have placed the Surround Backs level about two feet away from the side of the Surround Side speakers. The listening area couch is positioned between the Surround side and Surround Back (again placed side actually) Speakers. The surrounds are about an inch from the side walls. If I did manage to sneak in the pair of BP6Bs behind the couch as surround back speakers what would be the minimum recommended distance? Would it be better to downgrade to 5.1 instead of 7.1 in light of the space constraints?

After a lot of experimentation the audio crossover settings for all speakers is set at 250hz and the subwoofer low frequency is set at 250hz as well in my Denon AVR3310 setting. The sub in use is a DT Prosub 1000.

Is 250hz too high for the M3s? I am (and have been) leaning towards giving the sub woofer more work to do hence the crossover setup.

I hope you got ALL that. If you did I would appreciate any criticisms on the setup and placement.

Anything higher than 100hz will get directional. So between 100 and 250, your ear and your brain will identify the source of all sounds to be the subwoofer. For surround you can go a nudge higher, but not for the mains. M3s are quite good even down to 60hz, so 80hz-100hz would be a low as you should get.

Thanks for the first reply EFalardeau. I will take the information into consideration.

Extra info: The Prosub1000 is located on the right side wall and tightly placed between the SBR and SR speakers with the front bass radiator facing the SBR speaker. Again this is primarily due to a space constraint.

Ef is spot on with his recommendations. If you are limited to where things are placed all you can do is find some sort of compromise that suits you. Short of having larger speakers in the front , optimize it as best you can using the room correction software and crossover settings.

Thanks for the reply Socketman especially about the room correction software part. I think it would sensible to tweak using the automatic setup recommendations as a baseline.

Update: I have placed by Surround Back Speakers just behind my couch with the primary drivers facing each other parallel at a distance of maybe five feet with the secondary driver more than a foot away facing the side wall....

I did previously place the M3 as a surround side speaker but was unhappy that it outperformed and dominated the other BP6B speakers particularly when running seven channel stereo.

Yes Axiom, I have done my advertising good deed for the day. If only I was a celebrity...

Folks, I have been miserable for the past two days since my Prosub 1000 subwoofer has stopped functioning. While I have been scrambling around (mostly in my mind...mostly) with options to get it fixed, the Denon AVR3310 automatically sets the FRONT left and right speakers to LARGE when I remove the subwoofer ON setting from the setup.

Would this mean that placing the BP6Bs or Axiom M3 at the FRONT is risky at say -20db volume level?

But is the risk the same for stereo integrated amplifiers which do not have crossover settings or running the AVR in Direct / Pure Direct mode which essentially makes it function more like a power amplifier?

I honestly dont think that you could blow the M3 speakers sending them full sound range. they may not be able to reproduce the low frequency sounds all that well, but it wouldn't risk the speaker in doing so.

Thanks for the confirmation MatManBob... and thanks also to Ian for the assurance.

the whole of the -xx db is just to try and match different sound output levels between disparent speakers. so for example, you have a set of 4ohm M80 on the front, and the 8ohm M3 on the side. the volume output of the fronts would be different than sides so you can adjust the +/- db to get them all to sound the same at the same setting on the volume.

The "-xx db" which I was referring to is the receiver's master volume control which has the option of changing the "volume display" between absolute (i.e. 0,1,2...98,99,100) or relative (-80db to 18db).

I think you were referring to the channel level setting which varies from -12db to +12db.

I am sure that Ian will chime in at some point, but from what I have experienced the speakers can handle a very large amount of wattage.. just as long as what is being put out is clean power and not clipping. this will be true for most speakers.

Axiom performs extensive testing on all products and components. One of the most interesting is the "torture chamber", where they drive speakers to the point of exploding...literally!

The room has trophies of those drivers that have sacrificed themselves for our listening pleasure!

Clovis and I were chatting in our e-mail system about this. It is no problem to run the M3s full range from the receiver. Our entire line of product is designed to take lots of power no problem. To give you an idea I am running my LFR1100s with an ADA1500-2 to each speaker. That is 1300 continuous watts to each speaker with usable dynamics about 3 times that. It is really loud and clean.

It is reassuring to hear from... the President... of Axiom Audio that running the M3(v3) on full range frequency at -20db volume by my 120 watt (8 ohm) AVR does not pose a risk.

I had mentioned in a previous post that I used to power these M3s with a Rotel RA06SE stereo integrated amplifier so i guess it goes without saying that they were played as "Large" speakers.

I did refrain from specifically mentioning my email feedback from Ian as I felt it seemed irrelevant or inappropriate to share a one on one correspondence. But Ian's revelation has tempted me to share my correspondence with Thomas "TJ" Baust, Customer Technician from Sound United (Definitive Technology).

As you may know I am working on fixing my faulty Prosub1000 and in that regard he has been very helpful in his prompt replies. I did use this opportunity to ask him some questions like I would on a forum like this.

He had specifically advised me to run the BP6B tower on 60hz (small) to minimize the risk of "blowing the speakers".
I don't know what's more funny; the risk of witnessing an orgasmic explosion after "blowing" the speakers or referring to a tower speaker with 60hz range limit.

I immediately followed up with another query (given his prompt Artificial Intelligence like replies) on using a stereo integrated amplifier like the aforementioned Rotel to power the BP6B...Silence. I sent him another email... Silence. I went into my gmail sent items to check if the email message was delivered and it was. I haven't witnessed this much silence since Benjamin Netanyahu's forty four second hush at the 2015 UN general assembly.

Having a forum of a transparent nature like this where even harsh criticisms, reviews and complaints of its products and services are tolerated is what makes this (in my opinion) a great organisation.

If I did want to end this comment with a question it would be: Would it be ethical to sell a floor standing speaker like the BP6B without recommending that it not be powered by traditional two channel high fidelity amplifiers / receivers without crossover controls? Of course I had read somewhere that the term "Business Ethics" is an oxymoron so I wouldn't be surprised over this established fact.