Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Home Theater So... was the upgrade worth it?

yeah , god damn shoe laces

Your in ontario are you not? its like hotter than HELL there .

I don't need multi channel stereo, I have the LFR speakers that pretty much do it right to begin with.

I am also a fan of stereo recordings being played back in stereo. Though I am running LFRs like Matt and that gets rid of the dreaded sweetspot that drives you crazy with regular stereo.

Hmmmm...my stereo has incrementally gotten better as follows:

1. Moving from 1970s vintage Realistic speakers, a Kenwood receiver and 8-track tape and vinyl to Bose 601 series III, 1990 vintage Yammie receiver and cassette player

2. Adding a 1990s vintage CD player

3. Moving from a 10x10 room to a 4200 ft^3 space

4. Upgrading my 1990 vintage Yammie receiver to a 2002 vintage Denon

5. Gifting my Boses to my good friend who is 15 years my senior and has gone deaf from competitive shooting when I upgraded to M80 v2. This was an absolutely HUGE change.

6. Upgrading my Yammie to a 2013 vintage Onk. The XT32 made a HUGE change (in all listening modes)

7. Moving my MLP from 8 feet on the diagonal from the M80s to 14 feet away. This was more than HUGE; it was a revelation for all listening modes.

8. Upgrading my EP600v2 to the EP800v4 NME. This was another HUGE change in all listening modes.

The VP150v2 to 160v4 was another HUGE change but of course it doesn't count for stereo only. BTW, anyone with the 150 is ruining their life. Ditto with the 600v2 or earlier.

I have amazing width even in stereo but I lack stage depth. The LFRs can apparently give me that but I wonder what I might sacrifice in return.

Ugh, recalibrating using Audessey AccuEQ certainly mucked things up! Oh well, it did show just how much more capable the VP180 was over the VP150 setting the crossover at 40Hz whereas the VP150 was set at 75Hz (which was also the same as the M22 settings).

That said, my starting point is usually 80Hz for all speakers as this is what I set my sub at. Tweeking things a bit, I decided to lower the VP180 to 60Hz and keep the M22's at 80Hz.

For movies and games, the upgrade to the VP180/EP500 is remarkable as described initially.

However, the VP180 simply overpowers the M22's when listening to 2-ch recorded music in any processing dsp mode (Dolby, DTS, etc). DTS:X is probably the best sounding mode when I lower the VP180 by -3db but direct and stereo still sound better

However, SACD's recorded in multi-channel, that's a different story and they still sound simply amazing with the VP180 (as they did with the VP150).

Perhaps my Onkyo's processor/DAC simply isn't good enough for 2-ch music

I don't think there's anything wrong with Onkyo's DAC or surround processor unless they've cost-reduced or introduced bugs since I purchased mine. As for the AccuEQ, that's a different story. I think Onkyo made a big mistake moving away from Audyssey before perfecting their own correction.

The "over-powering" you are hearing could be due to a setting in your surround menu. You can broaden or narrow your centre image for PLII and NEO. PLII also has a wrap-around mode that you can defeat if it doesn't sound natural.

Of course there's also the possibility that you've evaporated a lot of your grey matter by listening to multi-channel stereo and no amount of electronic wizardry will ever help you hear well again.

Ok, found the problem and it isn't the VP180

I went old school and took SPL measurements. As suspected, the VP180 was measuring 3db higher than the M22's, fixed that by adjusting it to -3db...

What was surprising though, my ATMOS Height ceiling speakers were measuring 3-4db higher than the M22's. Adjusting them down -4db and BINGO, that seems to have done the trick. Now, when listening to 2ch recorded music in Dolby/DTS sounds way more natural.

Somehow, the ceiling speakers were contributing to the localization of sound appearing to come from the VP180. I didn't notice it during movies and games as the coding for height is better separated.

Glad old school spl (ok, it was an app I downloaded onto my phone) beat out AccuEQ wizardry.

Makes sense and not surprised by the AccuEQ.

I was able to finally enjoy a movie from end to end last night... Steven Spielberg's homage to the 80's "Ready Player One" in glorious ATMOS.

My wife doesn't like it loud so I had to restrain the system but I was floored how everything was still crystal clear and how beautifully mastered the recording was with all speakers working together to create a truly immersive sound bubble.

Even at -10db from my normal listening volume, the star was by far the upgrade from the EP175 to the EP500. You don't know what you are missing until you hear it (or in this case feel it). It is simply amazing how much more capable the EP500 is able to "pressurize" the room and make you feel the action. The action was already intense in the final fight scene with all the gamers coming online for a final assault on Planet Doom that you think the sub can't do more until Mechagodzilla arrives and the sub delivers more! I was feeling pressure in my ears and tickling in the Mojo regions! And then came the Holy Hand Grenade and Cataclyst bombs... the walls were shaking, the earth was quaking, my mind was aching, I was fighting for air!

I was spent after the movie. 2.5 hours went by quickly reliving 80's nostalgia (making the teenage angst aspect of the movie tolerable) and the beauty is I didn't once think of the VP180 as it blended so well with the system. Once I realized I only had the sub at 5, I'm now wondering what it would have been like if I had it cranked to 11?

Heh heh...:)

The sealed 800v4NME has gone a long way to cleaning up the sound in my space for both movies and music. Any more upgrades in my space now are a "want" and not a "need". My A/V space is now preventing me from moving out of my house into a condo.

BTW, why don't you get the wife to wear ear plugs?