Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Advice from Axiom Owners No more M22s?

I'm with you there Cork. I love the M22s as well. My pair is white and they look great.

I'm gonna buy an M22 and an M2 and compare for 2.1 against each other and against M5.

Cork, I find your comments about proportions and refinement interesting. I'll have to contrast against the M5.

I'm getting the M2 in rosewood and the M22 in walnut.

I'll likely buy both in on-wall as well and try them all out.

Looking for some advise. I thinking of purchasing a preprocessor or would it be worth purchasing a preamp and add it to my Yamaha RX850A. I looking at the Emotivo XMC -1
or the Marantz 8002 11.2 Channel. I would need to purchase a new am for the side and rears. Pre amp I was thinking Parasound Halo 6 with home theatre bypass.

Thanks
Bob M

So I received my wood V4 M22s. (The 24th actually, but it's been busy and I didn't have a chance to swap them in.)

First off - they're beautiful! I'm sure no one's surprised, but I've only ever had the vinyl and had to see for myself. On the other hand, when I asked my wife what she thought of the finish she said they were great, but what was wrong with the other wood pair? She sits three feet away from them when she's at her desk and she never knew they were vinyl; so a tip of the craftsman hat to Axiom - both for the old vinyl and the new, awesome, wood veneer!

As for the V4 (vs my old V2) they are everything I was hoping for, the tweeter is much more noticeable. No such thing as a shy cymbal now. I have to say ... I'm hoping this isn't a case of being careful what you ask for, they definitely are more "crisp". I hope I get used to it (I'm enjoying the sound, so I think I will.)

I found the v4 tweeter was a very big improvement over the v2. My v2 was breaking up and was not as "airy" or clear. I wish I could contrast the M22 against the M5 and M3.

What I hadn't realized previously is how much the version (tweeter & crossover I presume?) plays a part in the comparison. I was freely comparing M2, M3, M22, and M5; but I have different versions of each and it wasn't until I got the M22 that I realized how much that plays into things (because for the first time I have two versions of the same speaker.)

I definitely like the tweeter/crossover combination better on the V4 M22. What I'm still on the fence about is the woofer/low performance. At first blush it seems like the V4 M22 is missing something, I'll call it "harmonic nuance"; for instance, when I listened to Rachmaninov's Piano Concerto #2 & #4 (two of my favorites) they felt less "complex" than previously. It's not all one-way though, with the V2's I would listen to 'In Memory of Elizabeth Reed' and be thinking there's something missing from Duane's high chord sliding, now that sounds about perfect.

Of course, I only have a about 4 hours listening on the new speakers, and for the first hour I had forgotten to recalibrate with the new speakers. Another issue is I'm running a V2 VP 100 and I'm not convinced mixing on the front is a good thing. (I listen to music in 5 channel stereo on a Yamaha V681.) In fact, it sometime sounded better when I went to straight 2-channel stereo (I forget what tracks drove that conclusion).

I was thinking of investing in an A/B switch and setting both the V2 and V4's up at the same time, but they probably both require their own calibration so that wouldn't be a fair comparison.

Here's another thought I had, maybe Axiom was mucking around in their secret laboratory (queue evil laugh) and when came up with the V4 they said, "the highs are great, but we lost some of the the low end. I know, let's swap in a six and a half inch for one of those five and a quarters." And viola - the M5! It would certainly explain a lot, including the phasing out of the M22. But I watch a lot of cynical TV, so don't mind me.

In any case, the M22s are a better fit for my music room so I'm definitely staying with these; and I have a lot of tweaking left to go before I declare a personal winner.

It could be the M22v4 is more linear, and hence introduces less harmonic distortion, which you interpret as less involving.

I've tried 5-channel stereo and find it kills the soundstage. PLII works very well for a lot of tunes. Even though the 160v4 is great, I find many songs benefit from PLII with no centre.

If you can, even temporarily, move the M22s into the room and see how soundstage width and depth may differ between the versions.

As for the M5, my theory is it was on the roadmap for a long time but a few things had to come together for it to be a worthy introduction. The HP driver, the v4 tweeter, improved mid-woofer, improved understanding of The Family of Curves, improved cabinet bracing and improved cross-overs all were necessary to get to the M5.

The M5 is, in my opinion, the most refined speaker Axiom makes. It takes very little to get them to disappear. The soundstage and imaging is absolutely spectacular rivaled only by my actives. Unfortunately that HP driver's coil is massive and is loaded with inductance which makes it unusable much above the crossover frequency of 250Hz. Therefore unlike the non-HP woofer, it can't be used to aid the mid-woofer. This lowers the sensitivity of the M5 requiring large amounts of power to drive it.

The M5 is truly a marvel and an absolute bargain.

Keep in mind that the M5 is a 3-way design while the M22 are only a 2-way design.
Forget the crossover.
Having a dedicated midrange driver makes a huge difference in the detail and sound signature.

I went from a 3-way Technics system (Japanese speakers) to M22s and i returned the M22s. I found them anemic and without detail. We bought the M60s (not a bookshelf size of course) and its detail and low end filled everything we were looking for. Since then i've been a convert that 2/2.5 way systems just don't have the same detail as dedicated midrange driver systems. Acoustic research i read years ago was looking at covering a room 360 degrees with speakers and found that the more speakers presented, the more detailed sounds were to the human ear (today's premium 'standard' of Atmos 10.2, 11.4... ring any bells?).

I often thought what it would be like if Axiom had a 3-way bookshelf unit to truly compare to my age old Technics system and now they finally do (about 15 years after i sold the Technics unit).