Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Home Theater Hsu STF-2, Hsu VTF-3, and SVS PB1+

yep...I heard all three last night at Curtis's house.

Care to guess which of the three was my favorite?*



*based only on fun little demo listening. No scientific mumbo jumbo. Just throw in a disc and listen.

I think you should have recused yourself due to conflict of interest...

YES, i wanna know.. the battle rages on.

i am gonna laugh if you liked the SVS more..

bigjohn

I don't think bigjohn is going to laugh.

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Care to guess which of the three was my favorite?*

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My money's on the VTF-3.

Mark

OK! OK! Enough with the suspense already!

He's not online at the moment.

na na nana na.....I know the answer.

We spent a little more than an hour with the subs. Spiff brought some music, I had some music and movie clips. We played them and messed with the sub levels. Like spiff said, nothing scientific, just good 'ole fashioned listening.

I was just glad someone else was there to help move the subs around.

I will take a picture of the three subs tonight before the PB1+ leaves.

WELL HE'S GOT A LOT OF NERVE! BOY! Just hit and run, huh?

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I think you should have recused yourself due to conflict of interest...

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Hey, if Scalia can do it...

Well let's say it was a surprising evening.

First off, that PB1+ is freakin' HUGE. I thought the VTF-3 was a big subwoofer. The SVS dwarfed it.

Having said that, when I walked into Curtis house, he said, "That's the SVS over there in the corner." I looked and ask "huh? Where?". I didn't see it. Finally he walked over and pointed. There! Oh...wow. I didn't realize that was the subwoofer. It was beautiful. As huge as it was, it didn't stand out. It was a beautiful, fully integrated piece of furniture in Curtis's living room. Bravo SVS!

OK...so how did they sound?

Well, since the SVS was already hooked up, we began with that. First I threw in a Dead Can Dance cd. I figured a sub this big may be able to recreate that room pressurizing effect I heard from a Rel a long while back. Nope. Not sure how they got that Rel to do that. I've never heard anything like that before. I suspect they had the crossover set very low, and CRANKED it's volume.

Anyway...that's beside the point. What I did hear was a very full, smooth, bass. It seemed to lack a little punch that I'm used to hearing on that disc though.

Next disc...Kristine W 'Land of the Living'. Terrific dance CD if you're into that kind of thing. The disc begins with a slow, steady, low boom. Decent, but still didn't really stir me like I was expecting. Maybe I was expecting too much, because it was so darn big?

Finally I threw in my ultimate test cd. The Propellerheads 'decksanddrumsandrockandroll'. Lots of fantastic FAST bass, as well as some groovy low tunes. I listen to this disc very, very often. I know what it sounds like (or what it can sound like. Track one fired up and I was immediately struck that the bass sounded just slightly slow. (note I said slightly) Hmm...damn.

We quickly swapped out the SVS for the STF-2. Popped on that same track. Wow...that little STF-2 can pound! It didn't have nearly the fullness of the SVS. It was lean by comparison, but what it threw out was loud and tight. I was really surprised. (That's twice now...I told you it was a night of surprises!) Listening a bit more, I have to say I preferred the PB1+ over the STF-2. The SVS had a nice fullness and richness that the STF-2 lacked. Though the STF-2 was tighter. It kept up with that fast bass better.

Finally we tossed Curtis's VTF-3 back into the system. My goodness that's one hell of a sub. TIGHT, TIGHT, TIGHT...again like the STF-2, not quite as "warm" or "rich" as the SVS, but hands down the tightest of the three.

OK...to wrap up.

The SVS is a beautiful, I mean beautiful sub. S.A.F. on this one is off the charts. Personally I think it's a better sub for movies than music. It's fullness and depth is absolutely perfect of low bass effects. That's not to say it's a slouch in the music department. I've heard a LOT worse.

Hsu VTF-3...probably a personal preference more than anything, but I light my bass tight. It loses some of the smoothness and richness in being that tight, but that's just the way I like it. To give a visual analogy, the SVS is like being hit by a boxer, the Hsu is more of a bare fisted punch. Both have more than enough power and depth to really shake your house. Litterally! Curtis's house, not his room, his entire HOUSE was shaking at times last night.

Finally the STF-2. How can they sell this for under $400? Certainly the best sub bargain I've ever heard. Clean, tight, and powerful.

Hope this helps some people on the subwoofer fence. Bottom line is which type of bass you prefer, full, and smooth, or tight and punchy. Please bare in mind that these are subtle differences. We're not talking a total night and day difference, but if you have to say what the difference between the two is, that's it.

***sorry this took so long...I'm pretty busy at work today!***

SUPER review Craig! Thanks. Be sure to thank Curtis too.

DUH! "Thanks" is a DIY project. Thanks Curtis.

There you have it.

I have had the PB1+ in my home and used as the sub in my system for a week now.

My thoughts pretty much concur with spiff's. I have been descibing the VTF-3 as being a bit more defined. Last week, there was one other person who had the same thoughts as well...but he only listened for about 30 minutes.

Last October, I purchased a SVS 20-39PC+ to compare for myself as well. From memory. the PB1+ and 20-39PC+ sound the same.

Everyone that has seen the PB1+ in my house has commented on how beautiful it is....and how big it is. My 4 yr.old daughter said the first time she saw it, "I like this Daddy". My 6 yr.old son...the first time he saw it, proceeded to climb on it. My Parents loved the finish. Friends that came over to watch a movie were impressed as well.

Now...why do I have this sub? My Parents are putting together their HT system. My Mom does not want a black box in the livingroom. They also have friends that happen to own a PB1-ISD and want a more aesthetic sub in their livingroom. I showed my Parents the PB1+ and offered to order it if I got to play with it for a week....and they agreed.

So tonight, the PB1+ is getting picked up. My Parents will decide if the size of it is not too intrusive. If it is too intrusive, their friends will take it.

I am hoping that in the future I can hear the PB1-ISD and the PB1+ again.

Also, I hope to get an in home demo of the new VTF-3MK2. There have been some rumors floating around that it may not be as good as the older VTF-3. I have questioned some of the folks at Hsu about that, they insist that the new VTF-3 is a better box, and they are thinking about loaning me one to prove a point.

I want it known that I think the value of ALL of the subs is outstanding, and I could not fault anyone for choosing any of them.

Curtis, thanks for having me over last night. That was a blast. If you get that VTF-3 MKII, I have to be there to hear it!

No problem spiff. You are quite welcome.

You finish unpacking first, and then we can talk about you coming over to hear the VTF-3MK2 if I get it. Heck, it should be light enough for me to put in the car, I can drive it over and check out your new home. So there is more incentive to unpack!

And we'll see if we can annoy your new neighbors.

what area of LA is your new home in, anyway?

Oh...by the way. The VTF-3 and PB1+ were both tuned to 20hz....and I cross at 80hz. The room is 14x18 with a sloping ceiling from 8' to 9'....three doorways to other rooms that were left open, as well as an open window. We sat about 5' to 6' from the subs.

Has anyone noticed that no one else has been invited to the Curtis and spiff road show? sniff. I thought we were friends

Ray, that's quite a commute from Rochester, NY!

hey...I posted an open invite in another thread somewhere around here, and two non-Axiom forum members were going to try and make it, but couldn't......one of them an SVS owner.

Jack and I can make the cross-country trip in his '59 Buick. It would be kind of like the Odd Couple with an attitude. The passenger could wipe the driver's drool. With the requisite pit stops with old prostates, the drive should only take 3-4 weeks.

stop in texas and pick me up.. i am dying to hear one of these HSU's or SVS's..

we can swing thru vegas.. i got a cousin out there!!

bigjohn

If you guys come out here....I can probably get you a nice discount on rooms right on the beach.

I can do my best to get the SVS back in my home....and you can set up an appointment to visit Hsu Research's demo room.

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stop in texas and pick me up.. i am dying to hear one of these HSU's or SVS's..

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BigJohn,

My SVS 20-39 PC+ is tuned and ready for you to experience when you make it to Austin...

WhatFurrer

I notice that about 300 folks have signed up on this forum in the last month. As I read through this thread, I can't figure out why they did that. It CERTAINLY can't be for the pithy and deep discussions on audio theory and advice.

"...helps some people on the subwoofer fence."

Well, I've been managing to avoid a case of upgraditis re: my sub for quite awhile now. But with this review, I think I'm starting to waver...

Great review. It's always neat to see this sort of stuff compared.

kcarlile,

my boss and I have a great relationship and are always giving each other a hard time - well, one day, he calls me an evil CRUDGEMAN (He has a speach impedement - and is dyslexic, which adds to the fun - and I could be described as OCD and ADD if you believe in such...)anyway - I say, "crudgeman? what the hell are you talking about? Do you mean curmudgeon?" He says, "yeah, crudgeman."

HA

what a loveable maroon...

sorry for the tangent, but curmudgeon's profile charged the memory reserves.

^billy

I stand in awe of your ability to go off on tangents. That's, what, four this afternoon?

between trigonometry and english a hundred years ago, this is the only tangent I remember how to execute...

^billy
forever off-topic

Here are some pictures so you can see how they all look in relation to one another:

curtis,

that top photo does a better job at representing the SVS than what they have on their site...wow, what a monster. DO you know how the box subs compare to the cylinders...or it a noticeable difference.

I ask, b/c I was thinking that the 16-46PC-Plus would be a great companion to the EP350...with a little xover fiddling, one should be able to reach deep and stay really tight in the more audible range.

Am I close to a good idea? I do not pretend to know anything about subs.

nice pics.

^billy

The only SVS cylinder I have heard is the 20-39PC+ I bought to try out last October.

Using my VTF-3 as the constant, the PB1+ and 20-39PC+ sound extremely similar if not the same.

The PB2 box subs....the ISD, Plus, and Ultra are even bigger than the PB1+.

The cylinders take up less floor space, but are tall....that 16-46 will be 46" high.

i love how real life sneaks into these home pics..

in addition to the awesome subs.. i see a tissue box, a tennis ball, and what looks like maybe some shoe polish, and maybe a winnie the pooh toy.

thanks for sharing..

bigjohn

hmmm...no shoe polish or winnie the pooh toy....

DVD case and burned DVDs, lotion, kids' change can, tissue, candles, remotes, tennis ball, duster, and CD case.

I need to clean up!

looks spotless compared to my place!!

that SVS sub is really spectacular looking. much more attractive than most of the 'water heaters' i have seen.

bigjohn

bigjohn,

It really is a nice looking piece...truly furniture grade.

-curtis

Did you all notice how well it matched Curtis's speaker stands and a/v rack?

Wow, the PB1+ is gorgeous! I kinda like the spartan, no-nonsense looks of Peter's PB1-ISD, but the + is definitely a looker!

Hey Peter, I bet Jess wouldn't mind a cherry finished sub...

Yeah, I think she'd like it. You should just buy one and surprise her.

Nah, I'm fixin' t'git me some o'dose QS4 gajits.

Hey I guess I have to come to Curtis' defense (not that he needs it).

I also recieved a very gracious invitation to come over and audition the SVS monster while it partied over at 'Casa de Curtis'. Unfortunately due to an unscheduled overtime shift I could not join Curtis when he hosted spiff. I did get to read spiff's opinions on the sub and I was very suprised to find that they were very similar to the observations that I had made.

The sub is really a beautiful piece of furniture. The fit and finish are great as well as the features on the amp.

However the sound was different than that of the two Hsu speakers we also listened to.

As afr as the condition of Curtis's house - hey he's a dad. It looks just the way a dad place should. And he assured me he knows where everything is in case he needs to get to it in a hurry.