Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Technical Questions DVD-Audio connections

My DVD player connects via an optical (TosLink) cable to my receiver and works fine for movies but the only way I can getany sound out of a DVD-A disk is to use 5 standard analog cables cinnected through the " externall in" jacks on the receiver. I'd like to use the Toslink cable for the DVD-A as well. What to do?

Not a whole lot. This is a normal thing; the industry doesn't want the possibility of making totally accurate copies of DVD-As or SACDs, so they've done it by forcing decoding in the player. There may or may not be truth in the fact that the optical digital connection is too low bandwidth for the data coming from DVD-As and SACDs. There are some solutions, such as Firewire, but these remain on high end receivers/players for the time being.

At this point in time, you CAN'T use a toslink connection (i.e. digital connection) for DVD-A or SACD. It's not allowed for security reasons. They're afraid of copying if they allow a digital connection for Hi Rez audio. Maybe some day in the future it will be enabled. But, for the moment, you have to use the 6 analog cables for Hi Rez audio.

I think if you have a Denon DVD player (3910 or higher) with D-Link (Denon's proprietary digital connection), and a Denon receiver with D-Link, you can use a single digital cable for DVD-A only. SACD hasn't yet granted permission for it's use with D-link, but it's supposedly in the works.

In reply to:

---

SACD hasn't yet granted permission for it's use with D-link, but it's supposedly in the works.

---

And it sure seems like it has been for a long, long, time!

Whaaat, my reply not good enough, Jack?

Hey! When I started mine you hadn't posted yours yet. What am I supposed to do, check back every 30 seconds, while I'm composing my post, to see if somebody else posted?

It's been forever, Mark. At least it's been forever that I've been hearing that permission is just a few weeks away.

6 minutes in between the two. You're a slow typist.

(this is when you get to guilt trip me by saying that you only have one finger...)

No, I've got 10, just like you. But, they're 59 year old fingers (with a 59 year old brain, I might add), which are wracked with rheumatoid arthritis. You're lucky my posts don't look like dmwop dnmfoow nsl nfn[p ]] dnnk nnj ; kwf s m;mdwangg, dkn fwa! So, count your blessings.

Jack - I'll THANK you to stop copying my typing style.

Bob, as Ken and Jack pointed out, the optical or coaxial digital outputs of a player don't output DVD-A material because of copy protection concerns. However, you say that you can't get any sound at all from a DVD-A on the optical output. Besides the actual DVD-A track, all DVD-A discs also include a DD and/or DTS track which will play on any DVD player(since they're the audio formats used for DVD-Video). There should be a setting on your player to play those tracks, which are output from the optical or coaxial digital outputs. It shouldn't be assumed that the DVD-A track is necessarily audibly better than the DD or DTS. For example, see the report of Howard Ferstler of Sensible Sound.

One of the interesting things in that Sensible Sound article was that Howard had to take the DD subwoofer level down 10dB to get the same bass levels as DVD-A. That means DVD-A must not have the artificial 10dB boost that Dolby Digital has... (explained in the following article) :

>>For consumers, we want things to be simple. Up until recently, only serious enthusiasts would use an SPL meter to set the levels of their home theater equipment, let alone ask everyone to remember to set the LFE channel differently. For this reason, home Dolby Digital equipment is pre-set to play LFE data 10 dB higher than a main channel (or 10dB higher than the bass from a main channel). It is only necessary to set the subwoofer relative to a main channel and the LFE level will be correct. Very few processors allow direct manipulation of the LFE level. That is why the menus on most receivers say "Subwoofer Level" rather than "LFE Level".

http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volume_7_2/feature-article-misunderstood-lfe-channel-april-2000.html

Anyways, I found it interesting. That's what happens when you stay up until 4AM moving your HT system around to the other end of the basement so that more than one person can listen to it...

Hi AudioBob

If your DVD Audio player has multichannel analog outputs for each channel (Front L/R, Surround L/R, Center and Subwoofer) you have to connect these cables to either your receiver, your processor or your ICBM Bass Management Module. You should also connect the toslink or coax to the receiver/processor for your non-direct formats. If you only connected a coax/toslink and select "direct" that means the pure, unprocessed analog signal, you won't get any output. You have to coordinate your receiver/processor with your DVD Audio player - direct mode on each, then you will get your DVD Audio output.

What kind of DVD Audio player are you using? I use a Toshiba SD9200, blows me away.

There's apparently a lack of standardization problem with bass management for SACD material, and maybe DVD-A (less sure about that one).

It's a very serious problem and I can't believe there's been so little discussion of it.

For DD 5.1 material, everything works great. The bass channel is recorded -10db and at playback time Dolby specifies the playback chain boost it +10db. The player and receiver mfgs implemented the standard, and everything works fine.

For SACD, I typically see subwoofer level at least 10db too low. IOW you calibrate subwoofer levels based on pink tones from either receiver OR SACD player with the RS meter. Then when you play the real SACD material, bass is weak. It looks like they recorded bass -10db like Dolby, but didn't coordinate with the playback chain to boost +10db.

You can't turn up the subwoofer knob, because the sub will then be too loud for CD, DVDs, DD 5.1 TV, etc.

The only solution is manually turn up the sub volume at least +10db on the player itself - if a discrete sub adjustment for SACD is available. Some players have the adjustment, and some receivers have separate level controls for each input (CD, DVD, multichannel analog). Those so fortunate can jerry-rig their systems to work, although it usually maxes out the bass adjustment. You shouldn't have to do that.

Regular DD 5.1 calibration is hard enough for average users. The SACD lack of bass standardization between mastering and playback is a total disaster. I'll bet less than 5% of users have their system adjusted properly. I just can't believe there's such little discussion of it.