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#82316 - 02/21/05 04:59 AM WHAT TO CHOOSE??? 5.1, 6.1, 7.1
toadiefan Offline
regular

Registered: 02/19/05
Posts: 9
Loc: louisiana
HEY EVERYONE!! I'm trying to figure out which configuration to go with 5.1, 6.1, 7.1, and I think there is a 7.2? I'm fixing to build and my room will be 18X22X10. I want the system that would bring out the most in my room!! Is there really that much difference between them?

Also which Axiom setup would best suit my room size??

Thanks in advance

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#82317 - 02/21/05 06:43 AM Re: WHAT TO CHOOSE??? 5.1, 6.1, 7.1
TurboDog1 Offline
devotee

Registered: 02/29/04
Posts: 342
Will you be buying a new receiver for this room or using an existing receiver? This will shape some of the responses that you'll get here. If it's a new receiver situation, then I would say to go with 7.1. Right now, most movies don't have a 7.1 soundtrack. However, the receiver will still output 7.1 if set correctly. In my mind, there really is no good reason to go 5.1 if you are getting a new receiver and budget isn't severely limited. You don't have to have the rear surrounds immediately....could run it at 5.1 if you want to. The alternative is to buy 5.1 and get a case of upgradeitis in the near future when 6.1 and 7.1 tracks become more prevalent.

In the end, I am of the mindset that the more the speakers and enveloping sound the better. So, I'm going to fall into the 7.1 crowd.

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#82318 - 02/21/05 10:01 AM Re: WHAT TO CHOOSE??? 5.1, 6.1, 7.1
nickbuol Offline
axiomite

Registered: 09/16/04
Posts: 5316
Loc: Marion, IA
I agree that it is good to buy a 7.1 receiver if you don't have a receiver already, but the actual value of 7.1 over 5.1 is up for debate, and you should get several responses here.

I asked the same question about 6 months ago, and now I am here with my 5.1 Axiom system and love it. Since my listening area is not very deep (distance from the back of the room to the screen, or at least where the screen WILL be when I am done), I didn't have the depth to put a rear center (6.1) let alone 2 speakers back there for 7.1. I hear that you need a really good sized room to REALLY get the benefits of 6.1 or 7.1...

WIth that said, you mentioned 7.2... Since the number after the "." is for subwoofers, you will find that some people here have 5.2, 6.2, 7.2, etc... I was looking in a home theater magazine I got a couple of months ago, and there is a company that sells speakers that give you 5.5, 6.6, 7.7 and so on. Every speaker has a powered subwoofer in it. I don't think that each sub is that powerful by itself, but together they are supposed to generate a move even sound. So you only see 5, 6, or 7 speakers (no seperate sub since the subs are internal) for 5.5, 6.6, and 7.7 setups, unlike seeing 6 speakers for 5.1, 7 speakers for 6.1 and 8 speakers for 7.1 like the rest of us.

Neat idea, but who knows. Like I said, just saw an ad in a magazine, I have no idea how good that is.

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2-M60s, VP180, 8-M3s, SVS 20-39PCi, DIY Sub, 8-Shakers, JVC RS45, Anthem MRX-1120

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#82319 - 02/21/05 10:11 AM Re: WHAT TO CHOOSE??? 5.1, 6.1, 7.1
bridgman Offline
axiomite

Registered: 08/25/04
Posts: 6026
Loc: Bowmanville, Ontario, Canada
I have to cry foul on this. 5.1 implies five distinct channels of normal audio and one channel of LFE. If you have two center channel speakers wired in parallel it's still 5.1. Should be the same with subs -- you can have two subs in parallel but it's still 5.1...

For "real" 5.2 don't you need two discrete LFE channels on the media, or at least two discrete channels synthesized out of a processor ("faux" 5.2) ?
_________________________
HT: M60ti/VP180/QS8, SVS PC+ 20-39, EP500
Music: M5HP, Sierra-1, M40ti
Idle: M2ti, M3v4, VP100
John

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#82320 - 02/21/05 07:50 PM Re: WHAT TO CHOOSE??? 5.1, 6.1, 7.1
toadiefan Offline
regular

Registered: 02/19/05
Posts: 9
Loc: louisiana
HI!! Guess I should have told ya'll I'm going to buy a totally new system, receiver, dvd,speakers. I've been doing some research and also checked with Axiom they recommended for the most awesome sound use the M60,vp150,4 qs8's, and 2 ep500's.

Anybody out there have this setup??


Thanks for all the help.

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#82321 - 02/21/05 07:59 PM Re: WHAT TO CHOOSE??? 5.1, 6.1, 7.1
Ray3 Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 02/02/04
Posts: 2854
Loc: Rochester, NY
4 QS8s and 2 EP500s??? In the conversation, did you ask them to suggest something that would be overwhelming and spectacular or did they bring this suggestion up out of the blue?

Is my guess that they suggested 2 QS8s and 1 EP500 correct and you asked them to pile it on?

Just curious.

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#82322 - 02/21/05 09:24 PM Re: WHAT TO CHOOSE??? 5.1, 6.1, 7.1
nickbuol Offline
axiomite

Registered: 09/16/04
Posts: 5316
Loc: Marion, IA
bridgman, I would call foul too. You are right that as far as descrete audio channels, there is nothing more than X.1 no matter how many subwoofers. I was just commenting on some manufacturer's method of trying to say that their speakers are better because they all have small subs in them... I need to look up that company. Very odd.
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2-M60s, VP180, 8-M3s, SVS 20-39PCi, DIY Sub, 8-Shakers, JVC RS45, Anthem MRX-1120

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#82323 - 02/21/05 09:24 PM Re: WHAT TO CHOOSE??? 5.1, 6.1, 7.1
bridgman Offline
axiomite

Registered: 08/25/04
Posts: 6026
Loc: Bowmanville, Ontario, Canada
>>they recommended for the most awesome sound use the M60,vp150,4 qs8's, and 2 ep500's. Anybody out there have this setup??

Joninflorida is probably the closest :

2-SVS SS Maple Ultras, Axiom 60s,22s,150cc, QS8s

He bought his subs before the EP500 came out. The 22s are rears. There are arguments for having QS8 surrounds and M2 or M22 rears rather than 4 QS8s but I'm not qualified to take sides in that one.

It would certainly be an awesome system. One EP500 is probably big enough in terms of bass output, but having two subs is supposed to give much more even bass response throughout the room.
_________________________
HT: M60ti/VP180/QS8, SVS PC+ 20-39, EP500
Music: M5HP, Sierra-1, M40ti
Idle: M2ti, M3v4, VP100
John

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#82324 - 02/27/05 12:20 AM Re: WHAT TO CHOOSE??? 5.1, 6.1, 7.1
Misfit_Toy Offline
devotee

Registered: 02/22/04
Posts: 346
Loc: Wisconsin, USA
Fascinating conversation all. I've been doing much research in the realm of subwoofers lately and I'd say. Yes, you could have 5 subwoofers and it be only 5.1, or you could have 5 subwoofers and it be 5.5.

Simply stated that if you had 5 subwoofers only receive the .1 signal all you have is duplication of one signal. Now, take those 5 subwoofers and have them receive the 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th and .1 signals...well now you have a 5.5. Each subwoofer carrying a discrete singnal. And depending how you set it up can run seamlessly in conjunction with your surround speakers giving each channel the ability to hit down to the 20 Hz range (should your subwoofer be capable). Note that there are MANY movies that have surrounds that go below 25 Hz in the surrounds, and more yet that do such in the center channel.

So many may think the concept as outragous, it really is the best of all given that bass signals don't become non-directional until below 60 Hz (and no, its not 80 Hz like you believe from THX). The reason this truely is ideal is matching bass ENERGY. You can feel a seamless blend between each speaker.

The bottom line is that all speakers would be set to LARGE and occompanied by a subwoofer.

I used to think these people were nuts, they just really are people who have figured it out, AND have the money, means, and room to pull it off.

The most affordable approach, though not as pure, is to set all speakers to small and cross over at 60 Hz. When you set a speaker to small it incorporates an additional crossover, which degrades the sound vs all being set to large. Setting some to small and some to large still incorporates the crossover becauase you still have the signal passing through because of the speakers set to small. Only when all speakers are set to large do you remove the crossover. This is why having multiple subwoofers is the most pure.

And heres another tip. I made this change and sound difference blew my mind. But if you remove your setting of your subwoofer on your receiver menu to "not present" or "off" or whatever your setting...it removes yet ANOTHER crossover. So, all speakers set to large, Subwoofer disabled...you've now removed TWO crossovers. This, in turn, is a much cleaner signal. Try it, you'll see. Oh...and when you remove the subwoofer signal (or .1 signal), it redirects it the two front speakers (assuming they're set to large), so make sure you have a decent left and right front before you turn it up too loud. I have the M60s, M80s would probably be better still in this function. I now use my left and right front pre-outs to send the LFE signal to my subwoofer.

So in essence I'm running a 5.0, but its really 5.1 redirected to 5.0. The subwoofer takes the signal and removes the high frequencies with its built in low pass filter.

I know you'll all want to take this with a grain of salt, but this is the result of HOURS of research and testing.

Crazy stuff, but fun to play with if you have the time.
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